[JamesNoBrakes]

Originally Posted by Raptor Jesus

What's even more sad is the new Supra, Toyotas new flagship sports car makes the same 335hp out of a turbo 6 cylinder.

I doubt it, if it does what all other BMW engines do, that's the HP at the wheels, not the crankshaft. If it's the BMW 3.0 6 cyl turbo (which it is) it'll smash a NA V6 like in the LT. These have around 330-350lb of torque, again, at the wheels. Additionally, as stated in the last post, there's way more area below the curve due to full torque around 1500-1700rpm. It's not even on the same planet, sorry.

[Raptor Jesus]

Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes

I doubt it, if it does what all other BMW engines do, that's the HP at the wheels, not the crankshaft. If it's the BMW 3.0 6 cyl turbo (which it is) it'll smash a NA V6 like in the LT. These have around 330-350lb of torque, again, at the wheels. Additionally, as stated in the last post, there's way more area below the curve due to full torque around 1500-1700rpm. It's not even on the same planet, sorry.

It came from Toyota at the introduction that the car makes 335 crank hp. It's in all the publications and literature. I didn't say torque, I didn't say "area under the curve", or what the BMW's make, or who would be faster, I said the Supra has the same horsepower numbers as the V6 Camaro. There is no reason to discuss it beyond that.

[JamesNoBrakes]

Originally Posted by Raptor Jesus

It came from Toyota at the introduction that the car makes 335 crank hp. It's in all the publications and literature. I didn't say torque, I didn't say "area under the curve", or what the BMW's make, or who would be faster, I said the Supra has the same horsepower numbers as the V6 Camaro. There is no reason to discuss it beyond that.

Based on what that bmw engine makes, I seriously doubt they are going to detune it that far. It might make you feel better to think so, but based on what these put out, it would be like stepping back to 2006, and even that engine would still be faster/stronger.

[cignul9]

Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes

Based on what that bmw engine makes, I seriously doubt they are going to detune it that far. It might make you feel better to think so, but based on what these put out, it would be like stepping back to 2006, and even that engine would still be faster/stronger.

Jalopnik interviewed Ben Haushalter, senior manager of product planning for Toyota’s sports cars, at the Detroit Auto Show. Here's the article: https://jalopnik.com/here-s-where-to...upr-1831780403

When asked about the power difference between the BMW Z4 and the Supra, this was his answer:

“I don’t know,” he said. “We don’t know a lot about what BMW’s done with their engine since we’ve broken off and started doing our own thing.”

So, this is all purely speculation, but based on his answers it might not be Toyota detuning it, but instead BMW improving it after Toyota received their "final" version.

Either way, Toyota is aware of the rated power differences, and they're sticking to their 335 number. Whether or not this is to deliberately "under rate" the motor, or to give room for enthusiasts to tune it, who can say. When they start hitting the street, we'll know the real answers.

[Raptor Jesus]

Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes

Based on what that bmw engine makes, I seriously doubt they are going to detune it that far. It might make you feel better to think so, but based on what these put out, it would be like stepping back to 2006, and even that engine would still be faster/stronger.

Every single automotive publication and Toyota and the engineers themselves said that's the power number. It's not "making myself feel better" its the number they published. I'm for sure going to believe them over James the guy off the Camaro forums.

[PDXSSCE]

2019 Toyota Supra vs 1993 Toyota Supra

[MackSteelPrivateEye]

Originally Posted by PDXSSCE

Being that they stated it would be increased, maybe it's underrated so as to not steal SS sales.

The data you obtained has the incorrect weight. That's the 2.0T weight.

284 lbs tq, to 455lbs tq. I doubt it.

[IMadeYouReadThis]

Originally Posted by MackSteelPrivateEye

284 lbs tq, to 455lbs tq. I doubt it.

Let's not forget less weight and a higher RPM range. Telling you man the six in the 6th gen Camaro all around handling acceleration sound awesome car.

If I ever bought another one I wouldn't even consider the V8 or the four the V6 is just too damn good when paired with a manual transmission

[USAFS197]

I think I’m tracking what James is saying. I’ve watched a ton of different dyno videos of new BMW’s that we’re dead stock and they made their advertised BHP rating at the wheels. I think what he’s trying to explain is that while BMW or even Toyota may be advertising the power as they are, in BHP form, it may very well make that kind of power to the tires or at the very least, the Z4 will. Therein, if that is indeed the case, then yes, it would trounce the V6 in the 6th Gen something fierce.

[Raptor Jesus]

Cool, so Toyota’s $50+k flagship sports car MAY make more power than a base model Camaro rental car. Glad we argued to prove that point ��

[CoolbreezeNJ]

Unless you have owned one I wouldn't go all goo goo ga ga over a BMW engine. Pretty much all of them have some little gremlin or another right down to rod bearings in the M cars. Worse yet is that the newer ones have so much management control on them who knows what you really are getting from them.

Putting garbage BMW aside and with that engine being a turbo I suspect it will stomp the LGX while it is making near rated torque at lets say 2K RPM.

I further suspect that this car will really be a $55K to $60K car and if Toyota fan boys come out of the closet and there is just a few made then your looking at over MSRP and you will see $65K . I'll take my SS anyday over it either way.

On the inside it looks like a BMW shifter and the BMW center display.

[PDXSSCE]

Originally Posted by IMadeYouReadThis

If I ever bought another one I wouldn't even consider the V8 or the four the V6 is just too damn good when paired with a manual transmission

1971 Camaro Z-28
MSRP $3,634 (2017 MSRP $22,044)
275 HP @ 5600 RPM (Net)
300 LB-FT @ 4000 RPM (Net)
4-Speed Manual
Length 188.0"
Width 74.4"
Height 50.5"
Wheelbase 108.0"
Curb Weight 3,310 lbs
0-60 mph 5.8 sec
¼ mile 14.2 sec @ 100.3 mph

2017 Camaro 2.0T
MSRP $25,905
275 HP @ 5500 RPM
295 LB-FT @ 3000-4500 RPM
6-Speed Manual
Length 188.3"
Width 74.7"
Height 53.1"
Wheelbase 110.7"
Curb Weight 3,354 lbs
0-60 mph 5.4 sec
¼ mile 14.0 sec @ 100.0 mph

It seems similar to an old school driving experience.

[ecko04]

So we’re all in agreement that the 355 HP number from configurator is incorrect. Whew, I’m glad we got that solved before the thread unraveled into babble about the BMW Z4...errr I mean Toyota Supra


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[PDXSSCE]

Originally Posted by ecko04

So we’re all in agreement that the 355 HP number from configurator is incorrect. Whew, I’m glad we got that solved before the thread unraveled into babble about the BMW Z4...errr I mean Toyota Supra

I'm still in the 'it's underrated' camp.