[DevilsReject97]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

Remember how people criticized the 6th Gen Camaro for being cramped inside and praised the S550 for being roomier and having much more trunk space and all that jazz? Well this is where you're going to see those differences especially in a car that is fully optioned with huge brakes and suspension parts and adequate cooling and an auto trans a DOHC engine and a big blower etc. Look at the lightest cars that come with full options like heated/cooled seats etc...they're cars like the GTR and the Z06 and those are 2 seaters. And even for 2 seaters they're still very small on the inside. So now you have a 4 seater that isn't quite as big as the Hellcat but IS bigger and roomier than the Camaro by a lot (according to those who used to trash talk the Camaro) and has tons of visibility and you're gonna have a heavy car. I would not be surprised if it does indeed top 4200 pounds.

Pretty much this...

The manual/automatic SS are basically 3700lbs. Now, these cars already come decked out with all the cooling that the Mustang GT doesn't, even the GT 350 doesn't come with all of that.

The ZL1 with larger brakes, more cooling, the supercharger, the larger wheels/tires, etc etc... weighs roughly 200lbs heavier in manual trans, and roughly 300lbs more in automatic mode.

There is absolutely no way, that Ford is going to add all the coolers, the supercharger, the massive brakes/rotors (which are supposed to be the biggest of all the pony cars), the added goodies which will be a must for this car (heated seats, remote start, etc etc) and somehow weigh only like 3800lbs...

It's just not going to happen... the base GT350 already weighs almost the same weight as a ZL1. The GT350 R is 100lbs lighter, but it adds a lot more cost with Carbon Fiber wheels and other things..

[Gunkk]

4500 lbs with fluids and driver....

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by Gunkk

4500 lbs with fluids and driver....

Seems about right.....

[BlaqWhole]

At 4200-4500 pounds I think it is safe to say that it ain't gonna touch the ZLE around a track. And unless Ford severely underrated it and it really has 800ish HP then it won't touch the Redeye and that is with all the magical Ford drag mode BS added in. I think we'll see a good three way fight. But Dodge will remain the straight line king and Chevy will remain the cornering and triple threat king.

[whiteboyblues2001]

There was some sort of spec sheet that was "leaked" that stated 4200lbs. That number does sound reasonable, but for some reason, I think it will be a bit lighter than that. I think 4100 for the regular loaded one, and 4000 or so for the carbon fiber one might be where we are looking at. Which is like 4200-4300 with driver...

[newmoon]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

At 4200-4500 pounds I think it is safe to say that it ain't gonna touch the ZLE around a track. And unless Ford severely underrated it and it really has 800ish HP then it won't touch the Redeye and that is with all the magical Ford drag mode BS added in. I think we'll see a good three way fight. But Dodge will remain the straight line king and Chevy will remain the cornering and triple threat king.

Well the triple threat thing is true but the ZL1 is expected to be a 1/2 second or more behind the GT500 in the quarter, that is a very big disparity between the two and makes the ZL1 no longer competitive in the segment. The battle will be between the Hellcat RE and the 500.

[whiteboyblues2001]

Originally Posted by newmoon

Well the triple threat thing is true but the ZL1 is expected to be a 1/2 second or more behind the GT500 in the quarter, that is a very big disparity between the two and makes the ZL1 no longer competitive in the segment. The battle will be between the Hellcat RE and the 500.

It seems as though the Hellcat (and it's variants like the Demon and RedEye) are going for 1/4 mile only. The ZL1 is supposed to be a triple threat, but we all know that it is a road course car (track monster), that can 1/4 mile as well.

Where does that leave the GT500? Will it be faster than the RedEye in a straight line and/or, will it beat the ZL1 1LE around a road course?

After all this time, it should beat both. But we all have dumbed down our expectations (for some reason), and we assume it might do one or the other.
But if it's slower than the RedEye in the 1/4 AND slower than the ZL1 1LE, it's a fail.

[newmoon]

Originally Posted by whiteboyblues2001

It seems as though the Hellcat (and it's variants like the Demon and RedEye) are going for 1/4 mile only. The ZL1 is supposed to be a triple threat, but we all know that it is a road course car (track monster), that can 1/4 mile as well.

Where does that leave the GT500? Will it be faster than the RedEye in a straight line and/or, will it beat the ZL1 1LE around a road course?

After all this time, it should beat both. But we all have dumbed down our expectations (for some reason), and we assume it might do one or the other.
But if it's slower than the RedEye in the 1/4 AND slower than the ZL1 1LE, it's a fail.

It will be faster than the ZL1 on the track surely, and whether it is faster than the 11.7 second ZL1-1LE , who really cares other than for boasting track rights. Make the GT500 what the ZL1-1LE isn't a ultra strong track, street, and strip performer.

[hotlap]

Originally Posted by newmoon

It will be faster than the ZL1 on the track surely, and whether it is faster than the 11.7 second ZL1-1LE , who really cares other than for boasting track rights. Make the GT500 what the ZL1-1LE isn't a ultra strong track, street, and strip performer.

So than... you're saying it won't be faster than the ZLE or Redeye?

You're saying the GT500 will need the Carbon Fiber Track Package to beat the regular ZL1?

Sounds about right.

[newmoon]

Originally Posted by hotlap

So than... you're saying it won't be faster than the ZLE or Redeye?

You're saying the GT500 will need the Carbon Fiber Track Package to beat the regular ZL1?

Sounds about right.

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The ZL1-1LE is a track capable machine that is not very good in any other venue as discussed in multiple reviews and evident by how quickly they are put up for sale after purchase.

The A10 ZL1 is a great platform that does a variety of things extremely well but IMO will get toasted by this new 500, carbon package or not.

[Laststandard]

Originally Posted by newmoon

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The ZL1-1LE is a track capable machine that is not very good in any other venue as discussed in multiple reviews and evident by how quickly they are put up for sale after purchase.

Well, it was always billed as a track car. Of course, right now there's 4 GT350R's for sale on the first page of M6G and and you have to go to the bottom of the 3rd page here to find a ZLE, and it's marked as sold...

The A10 ZL1 is a great platform that does a variety of things extremely well but IMO will get toasted by this new 500, carbon package or not.

I would hope so, being that Ford has had a few years to benchmark the ZL1 and the GT500 will probably be 10-15k more at MSRP, before ADM?

[newmoon]

Originally Posted by Laststandard

Well, it was always billed as a track car. Of course, right now there's 4 GT350R's for sale on the first page of M6G and and you have to go to the bottom of the 3rd page here to find a ZLE, and it's marked as sold...



I would hope so, being that Ford has had a few years to benchmark the ZL1 and the GT500 will probably be 10-15k more at MSRP, before ADM?

Yeah the 11 or 12 SS 1LEs on page one are pushing everything else back.

[hotlap]

Originally Posted by newmoon

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The ZL1-1LE is a track capable machine that is not very good in any other venue as discussed in multiple reviews and evident by how quickly they are put up for sale after purchase.

The A10 ZL1 is a great platform that does a variety of things extremely well but IMO will get toasted by this new 500, carbon package or not.

Using M6G rational that the power advantage alone dictates that the base ZL1 should beat the GT350R that is not very good in any other venue...

The base GT500 should beat the ZLE. Right?

I gonna say that I'm rooting for the GT500 to salvage an otherwise lackluster showing of the S550. You guys need this one and Ford sure has worked hard and long for it.

[NW-99SS]

Obvious bias posts are obvious.

I will keep my speculations to myself, not much point in arguing over highly biased opinions until the stats are released and we see some actual performance data...unless you just like to argue.