10-27-2022, 02:00 PM | #29 | |
Drives: '23 2SS RSblue 6MT, sold '19 ND2 Join Date: Dec 2021
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 262
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Quote:
For 2022 and before, the only requirement was Dexos2 0w-40 anyway (or dexos1 5w30 for street). These oils are so similar there would be no difference on a oil analysis unless you worked for Mobil and could conduct advanced test beyond the scope of a used oil analysis.
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'23 2SS, 6 speed, NPP, Copper-free brakes, 56V Carbon Flash Rims, Riverside Blue
1LE sway bars EOS front splitter 5-6-22:1100, 7-19-22: 3000, 8-3-22: TPW 8/15/22, 10-4-22: ETA 10/13/2022 10-15-22 6000 |
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10-27-2022, 11:09 PM | #30 | |
Drives: 2020 ZL1 1LE Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 1,335
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Quote:
Hi-Temp Hi-Shear Viscosity @ 150 C 1x10(6) sec(-1), mPa.s, ASTM D4683 3.8 Comfortably above the Euro standard (ACEA A3 as in manual)/Dexos2/DexosR of 3.5. Keep in mind it only takes 25-30hp to keep most modern cars at 70mph, but its not linear as you go faster. Sustained speeds 100mph or higher create a lot more stress and heat, which is where the ACEA standards come from. Newer oils have less of a tradeoff for high speed cruising protection vs thin for fuel efficiency or start up, so we get Mobil1 ESP or R in -40 grades even for "CAFE". This is more the case for big displacement, low cruise rpm engines where engine torque is not as much affected by parasitic losses from oil viscosity friction. On the track you run at WOT. In Europe, I used to drive at WOT also, for hours on/off. Yeah, foot to the floor. Nowadays you don't need a 20w-50, 10w-60 (for some BMWs) anymore for this kind of use. 0w-40 is fine but the measure is HTHS at 150C (302f) of ~3.5 - and you get good fuel economy.
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2020 ZL1 1LE [Moroso SC Expansion Tank, otherwise stock]
Last edited by wakespeak; 10-27-2022 at 11:44 PM. |
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10-31-2022, 01:32 PM | #31 |
Drives: 2022 2SS 1LE 6 MT Join Date: Aug 2022
Location: York, PA
Posts: 70
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So despite all the foot-stomping, tantrums, name-calling, and claims of "DO YOUR RESEARCH", there is nothing out there which proves or states that the ESPx3 is "bad" or "wrong" for these cars it looks like.
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2022 Camaro 2SS 1LE
Rapid Blue || 6MT |
10-31-2022, 08:06 PM | #32 |
Drives: 2020 1LE Join Date: Apr 2020
Location: MI
Posts: 88
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So collectively, we have done some research here. And we have determined that X3 is in no way inferior to Supercar and meets Dexos2 requirements as outlined in the '22 and before owners manuals.
The only modicum of argument is for '23 models that specifically state Dexos R required in the manual. While X3 does everything that Supercar does, at least, Dexos 2 is no longer specifically called out in the manual for track use. So X3 can be technically disqualified for track use for '23 models. OK. For your '22 Dave, it sure seems like there is no legit argument against X3. It is the individuals calling foul that have not shown any empirical evidence for their claims. |
11-01-2022, 08:19 AM | #33 |
Electrical Engineer
Drives: 2023 1SS A10 Black Join Date: Apr 2022
Location: Illinois
Posts: 775
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I suspect the concerns with the PCV system putting residue on the intake ports and valves (due to direct injection) is part of the driving force behind the changing oil recommendations and formulations.
I think that running a catch can may help widen the range of oils used by resolving PCV concerns. If GM made a specific request for the DEXOS-R and 0W-40 Supercar formulation, it was in reaction to data collected over the past few years with the Gen 6 LT1 and/or LT4. The other question I have is if the change in oil is also a reaction to AFM impacts on lifter reliability.
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2023 1SS A10 Black NPP/C2U/H72 - Daily Driver
Historically an Accord and Camry owner with self-performed maintenance/repair. 1100: 5/3/22 . . . . . . . 2000: 6/25/22 . . . . . .4000: 8/17/22 . . . . . . . 6000: 9/10/22 Daily Driver mileage update: 22k mi. @ April 2024 New Engine @ 22,600 Build Log: https://www.camaro6.com/forums/showt...6#post11353116 |
11-01-2022, 08:57 AM | #34 | |
Drives: 2017 Blue Camaro 1SS 1LE with PDR Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 961
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Quote:
In my case, my car did have a bad (non AFM) lifter on the misfiring cylinder and all lifters were replaced under warranty as part of the repair. |
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11-01-2022, 12:02 PM | #35 | |
Drives: '23 2SS RSblue 6MT, sold '19 ND2 Join Date: Dec 2021
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 262
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Quote:
https://www.mobil.com/en-us/passenge...-formula-0w-40 https://www.mobil.com/en-us/passenge...supercar-0w-40 ESP x3 is a new oil with Porsche approvals and dexos2. <=2022 MY required only dexos2 oil. With no changes to the 2023 LT1 engine, one can safely ascertain this oil will work fine with 2023's, if not better.
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'23 2SS, 6 speed, NPP, Copper-free brakes, 56V Carbon Flash Rims, Riverside Blue
1LE sway bars EOS front splitter 5-6-22:1100, 7-19-22: 3000, 8-3-22: TPW 8/15/22, 10-4-22: ETA 10/13/2022 10-15-22 6000 |
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11-02-2022, 01:01 AM | #36 | |
2020 Shadow Gray 2SS
Drives: 2020 2SS - A10, NPP, MRC, CAI Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: SoCal
Posts: 3,007
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Quote:
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2020 SGM 2SS - A10, NPP, MRC, Red Calipers, Black Camaro Fender Badge, Footwell Lighting
Added after delivery: - GMP CAI, GMP Black Strut Tower Brace, MRR017 1LE Wheels, SS Armrest, Black Fuel Door, Stainless Sport Pedals, SS Wheel Caps, Black Lugs/Locks, GM Splash Guards, DD Smoked LED Markers, Smoked Rear Reflectors, Mishimoto Catch Can, Xpel PPF - Full Front, SunTek 35% Tint, CeramicPro coating, RST Stainless Brake Lines, Castrol SRF, MSD Super Conductor Wires Left: My "fun" ride. Right: My "work" ride: a Gulfstream G600. One's top speed is 180 Mph, the other, 620 Mph... |
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11-02-2022, 07:39 AM | #37 | |
Electrical Engineer
Drives: 2023 1SS A10 Black Join Date: Apr 2022
Location: Illinois
Posts: 775
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Quote:
You're just looking at a webpage with simplified data (annoyingly in a different format). The MSDS for Supercar, ESP, and ESPx3 list different hazardous ingredients. For example, ESPx3 has eight hazardous ingredients listed and Supercar has five and ESP has three. For Section 8 which is exposure limits, Supercar has one, ESP has two, and ESPx3 has five ingredients listed. Other differences listed include pour point (temp), relative density, and viscosity. Granted, the differences are small. Interestingly, ESP and Supercar are much closer and ESPx3 is the most different. I don't put much stock into what a product webpage says, especially when the data is formatted differently. I'll always jump to the MSDS when I want real data. TLDR: They are not the same. https://sds.exxonmobil.com/ Just search for 0W-40 and the MSDS for each pops up.
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2023 1SS A10 Black NPP/C2U/H72 - Daily Driver
Historically an Accord and Camry owner with self-performed maintenance/repair. 1100: 5/3/22 . . . . . . . 2000: 6/25/22 . . . . . .4000: 8/17/22 . . . . . . . 6000: 9/10/22 Daily Driver mileage update: 22k mi. @ April 2024 New Engine @ 22,600 Build Log: https://www.camaro6.com/forums/showt...6#post11353116 |
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11-02-2022, 09:36 AM | #38 |
Electrical Engineer
Drives: 2023 1SS A10 Black Join Date: Apr 2022
Location: Illinois
Posts: 775
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I made a graphic showing the MSDS information that differs for each of the three. I'm not claiming that one is better than another, just noting the differences.
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2023 1SS A10 Black NPP/C2U/H72 - Daily Driver
Historically an Accord and Camry owner with self-performed maintenance/repair. 1100: 5/3/22 . . . . . . . 2000: 6/25/22 . . . . . .4000: 8/17/22 . . . . . . . 6000: 9/10/22 Daily Driver mileage update: 22k mi. @ April 2024 New Engine @ 22,600 Build Log: https://www.camaro6.com/forums/showt...6#post11353116 |
11-02-2022, 04:52 PM | #39 | |
Drives: '23 2SS RSblue 6MT, sold '19 ND2 Join Date: Dec 2021
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 262
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Quote:
M1 ESP Formula is the latest formulation. Coincidentally, they are the same for Supercar. ESP Formula = Supercar.
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'23 2SS, 6 speed, NPP, Copper-free brakes, 56V Carbon Flash Rims, Riverside Blue
1LE sway bars EOS front splitter 5-6-22:1100, 7-19-22: 3000, 8-3-22: TPW 8/15/22, 10-4-22: ETA 10/13/2022 10-15-22 6000 |
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11-02-2022, 05:41 PM | #40 | |
Electrical Engineer
Drives: 2023 1SS A10 Black Join Date: Apr 2022
Location: Illinois
Posts: 775
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Quote:
EXPx3 still seems to be the most different of the three. But does Mo' Hazardous = Mo' Betta?
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2023 1SS A10 Black NPP/C2U/H72 - Daily Driver
Historically an Accord and Camry owner with self-performed maintenance/repair. 1100: 5/3/22 . . . . . . . 2000: 6/25/22 . . . . . .4000: 8/17/22 . . . . . . . 6000: 9/10/22 Daily Driver mileage update: 22k mi. @ April 2024 New Engine @ 22,600 Build Log: https://www.camaro6.com/forums/showt...6#post11353116 |
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11-03-2022, 12:02 PM | #41 |
Drives: 2016 Camaro SS Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: CA
Posts: 9
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2016 SS oil
I'm sure this has been addressed, but should I be running a different viscosity oil in my 2016 SS? Since new, I've been running 5w- 30w. I only have 10k on my SS, and I'm worried about the build up on my valves.
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11-03-2022, 12:08 PM | #42 |
2020 Shadow Gray 2SS
Drives: 2020 2SS - A10, NPP, MRC, CAI Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: SoCal
Posts: 3,007
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You can run the latest Mobil 1 0W-40 ESP Formula (or SuperCar Formula) if you'd like...
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2020 SGM 2SS - A10, NPP, MRC, Red Calipers, Black Camaro Fender Badge, Footwell Lighting
Added after delivery: - GMP CAI, GMP Black Strut Tower Brace, MRR017 1LE Wheels, SS Armrest, Black Fuel Door, Stainless Sport Pedals, SS Wheel Caps, Black Lugs/Locks, GM Splash Guards, DD Smoked LED Markers, Smoked Rear Reflectors, Mishimoto Catch Can, Xpel PPF - Full Front, SunTek 35% Tint, CeramicPro coating, RST Stainless Brake Lines, Castrol SRF, MSD Super Conductor Wires Left: My "fun" ride. Right: My "work" ride: a Gulfstream G600. One's top speed is 180 Mph, the other, 620 Mph... |
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