[kramard]

I've been excited for this comparison and never expected to be in it! A local A10 ZL1 1LE and I put our laps side by side. It's not the best comparison since its run by two different drivers with two different tire compounds on two different days but still interesting nonetheless. Also, I believe I will be getting the solo 2 data so I can post some details and look at the A10s acceleration advantage; I'll update after I get a chance to go through the data.

My key take away after watching the video is that driver mod, line changes and tires are all going to have a much bigger impact on lap time then A10 vs M6. I might get another crack on main in July with Supercar 3rs so that'll be a fairer comparison.

Few notes:

• M6 car was on R888Rs and other wise stock
• A10 car has pads / intake and on Supercar 3r
• M6 car made a big mistake 8 - 9; cost .5 or so to final turn (I haven't been on main in years and focused on 4 more; sorry!)
• I never intended this to be a head to head; just found the laps interesting to put side by side for enjoyment
• Clearly the R888R is not as slow as I thought; I'm pushing incredibly hard though. I don't know how hard the A10 driver was pushing but I was nearing my personal limit and well past where I normally go when I do a fun event. If the tires end up being about the same my note would be that its much easier to go "fast" on the Supercar 3r.

Enjoy!

[RUQWIKR]

The A10 ZL1 1LE video come from here? He is not exactly braking real hard as seen by the braking scale in the PDR. Seems more of early braking at a lower rate. It was his first time out in a Camaro he just bought after he had a serious off in his Subaru. Not being critical of his driving or style, but, looks to be learning the car, which would be quite a different vehicle than his prior one.

[JD2018_ZL1]

Randy probs ran an auto versus a manual and the manual was faster by a a little.

https://youtu.be/E0amO_lJks8?t=672

[Can'tHave2MuchHP]

Let's face facts:

The A10 is faster.

That is all.

[kramard]

Originally Posted by RUQWIKR

The A10 ZL1 1LE video come from here? He is not exactly braking real hard as seen by the braking scale in the PDR. Seems more of early braking at a lower rate. It was his first time out in a Camaro he just bought after he had a serious off in his Subaru. Not being critical of his driving or style, but, looks to be learning the car, which would be quite a different vehicle than his prior one.

It did, yup. Are you talking about pedal travel or G. A10 ZLE looks to be pretty hard on the brakes based on the G meter and brake points except prior to 4 (which is what I made as my focus for the day). We've traded some notes over FB prior to posting as well. Without going through data and getting into the small details I was really impressed with his 1:19 lap - hope my post was not suggesting anything otherwise.

My personal target for the Supercar 3r is a high 1:18 / low 1:19. 1:20 on down at summit main is a monster time.

[LT4]

With a pro driver, very familiar with the course, with traction and stability nannies off, the manual is very slightly faster. In all other scenarios, auto is faster.

[Can'tHave2MuchHP]

To expand on my point, I haven't seen any evidence, besides the Motor Trend/Randy Laps, that the M6 beats the A10 on track by any margin, no matter if its ultimate conditions/driver and raining unicorns and lollipops. I think that one situation with Motor Trend has been blown out of proportion.

The A10's tremendous advantage in acceleration out of corners, keeping optimal balance of the vehicle, and 200 ms shifts everywhere are not going to be outdone by anybody behind the wheel. Equally fast cars with equal settings and the same driver, the A10 WILL win, 100% of the time. That delta will only get wider as the drivers get worse. So unless you go by Alonso, Hamilton, or Schumacher, put your money on the A10.

Now if fun factor, engagement, etc. are in discussion, the M6 will blow the A10 away, obviously. I'm speaking purely of speed and lap times here due to subject of the thread.

P.S. I'm a diehard manual guy that happens to own a couple autos that I periodically regret getting.

[JD2018_ZL1]

Originally Posted by Can'tHave2MuchHP

To expand on my point, I haven't seen any evidence, besides the Motor Trend/Randy Laps, that the M6 beats the A10 on track by any margin, no matter if its ultimate conditions/driver and raining unicorns and lollipops. I think that one situation with Motor Trend has been blown out of proportion.

The A10's tremendous advantage in acceleration out of corners, keeping optimal balance of the vehicle, and 200 ms shifts everywhere are not going to be outdone by anybody behind the wheel. Equally fast cars with equal settings and the same driver, the A10 WILL win, 100% of the time. That delta will only get wider as the drivers get worse. So unless you go by Alonso, Hamilton, or Schumacher, put your money on the A10.

Now if fun factor, engagement, etc. are in discussion, the M6 will blow the A10 away, obviously. I'm speaking purely of speed and lap times here due to subject of the thread.

P.S. I'm a diehard manual guy that happens to own a couple autos that I periodically regret getting.

A10 is nice. My 16 year daughter old loves it in her Ecoboost.

[Checkmate1]

I am not a race car driver so do not care for lap times. Lap times have scores of variables.

Give me a Manual all day every day.

[viurniel]

Originally Posted by JD2018_ZL1

Randy probs ran an auto versus a manual and the manual was faster by a a little.

https://youtu.be/E0amO_lJks8?t=672

Randy ran a mag drive A10 vs a 1LE M6. I think we are all looking for A10 1LE vs M6 1LE without the variables that the OP presented here.

[URBAN LEGEND]

No one cares about manuals. If people cared ALL manufacturers would have them.

[Checkmate1]

Originally Posted by URBAN LEGEND

No one cares about manuals. If people cared ALL manufacturers would have them.

Wrong, why don't you ask Porsche why they brought it back after killing the manual in the 991.1 GT3.

Enthusiasts and people who 'CARE' about driving buy manuals. There is no substitute.

Manufacturers are pandering to the fact that majority of the public do not know how to drive stick and therefore do not buy them. There is little to no business case for them to conduct R&D on manuals because the public can't drive them. More importantly, the business case for an Auto has driven manufacturers to make them faster and more responsive as is the case for the PDK and Fast torque converters.

[unleaded28]

Originally Posted by URBAN LEGEND

No one cares about manuals. If people cared ALL manufacturers would have them.

If nobody cared about manuals then NO manufacturers would have them.

[verdicaysen]

To be fair, you're also justifying your own purchase subconsciously by declaring what are essentially lab environment test results and claiming they "blow manuals away" - even though we're talking hundreds of a second - in perfect conditions - with a trained and experienced driver - automatic or otherwise.

To be fair to you, the manual supporters are doing the same. I think we need to just stop. This topic is getting beaten to death. I see it everywhere in the forums. We all feel a little insecure sometimes - but driving is about the driver. I've seen Camaros beat Vette's on strips and tracks by wide margins and it doesn't matter what's in the car. Can we just agree Camaro in general is great?

This community is always at it's best when there's common ground. Clearly, this isn't one of them. Or maybe i'm just trying to be too reasonable.

Originally Posted by Can'tHave2MuchHP

To expand on my point, I haven't seen any evidence, besides the Motor Trend/Randy Laps, that the M6 beats the A10 on track by any margin, no matter if its ultimate conditions/driver and raining unicorns and lollipops. I think that one situation with Motor Trend has been blown out of proportion.

The A10's tremendous advantage in acceleration out of corners, keeping optimal balance of the vehicle, and 200 ms shifts everywhere are not going to be outdone by anybody behind the wheel. Equally fast cars with equal settings and the same driver, the A10 WILL win, 100% of the time. That delta will only get wider as the drivers get worse. So unless you go by Alonso, Hamilton, or Schumacher, put your money on the A10.

Now if fun factor, engagement, etc. are in discussion, the M6 will blow the A10 away, obviously. I'm speaking purely of speed and lap times here due to subject of the thread.

P.S. I'm a diehard manual guy that happens to own a couple autos that I periodically regret getting.