[JB'sZL1]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

Regardless of the chassis or how old it is, it does exactly what Dodge designed it to do and then some. Plus that design is why they're able to keep the cost low. Maybe our Camaros wouldn't be soo expensive if they weren't getting refreshed every 4 years and then 2 getting a completely new design 2 years after that.

True dat!

However, the benefits of a redesign every 3-4 years are substantial. I have read some HC owners post HC times at the 'ring of 7:51 and 8:00: yet there are no such official times. I did watch a video of the HC at the 'ring, and it is downright scary. The HC should be in a drifting completion...not at the 'ring.

The other benefit the HC has is that it is more spacious. And it has more interior creature comforts than the Z. However, the braking is inadequate. The ride comfort level is second or third class...so it is not a good touring car. It is not a track car. I loved the look of the car...until I saw the Z: I truly like the look of the 5th gen Z better than the HC. So it beats most everything as a drag car, but nothing else.

I like the HC, but not being a touring car sealed the deal for me. I took my 83 year old mother and 80 year old aunt out for a spin the other day. I asked them if the had insurance and a recent cardiogram. I was privately hoping they were wearing depends.

They both commented on how nice quality the ride was. Isn't that sweet?

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by JB'sZL1

True dat!

However, the benefits of a redesign every 3-4 years are substantial. I have read some HC owners post HC times at the 'ring of 7:51 and 8:00: yet there are no such official times. I did watch a video of the HC at the 'ring, and it is downright scary. The HC should be in a drifting completion...not at the 'ring.

The other benefit the HC has is that it is more spacious. And it has more interior creature comforts than the Z. However, the braking is inadequate. The ride comfort level is second or third class...so it is not a good touring car. It is not a track car. I loved the look of the car...until I saw the Z: I truly like the look of the 5th gen Z better than the HC. So it beats most everything as a drag car, but nothing else.

I like the HC, but not being a touring car sealed the deal for me. I took my 83 year old mother and 80 year old aunt out for a spin the other day. I asked them if the had insurance and a recent cardiogram. I was privately hoping they were wearing depends.

They both commented on how nice quality the ride was. Isn't that sweet?

About the comfort, I think the HC is more comfortable as long as you're on a smooth road. It is very cushy. But once you hit bumps and potholes it hits like BANG even in touring mode. The ZL1 takes bumps and potholes much easier. Plus on some parts of the road where there are dips or those little sharp upgrades the HC will bump and you'll kinda flop around in the seat. One such road had my butt actually lift out of the seat. I took that same road in the ZL1 many times and it stuck to the road much easier and held me in the chair. But again, when the road is straight the HC is a pleasure to drive. I don't think the brakes on the HC can stop it as well as the ZL1 brakes stop the ZL1. But it does an adequate job for a vehicle of it's size. I would like to see how much different the Charger HC is compared to the Challenger HC.

[Blackdevil77]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

I think A10 to A8 it will always be close enough that either car can claim a victory. But M6 HC (obviously not the Charger since it comes with A8 only) to A10 ZL1 might be a clear ZL1 win. And A8 HC to M6 ZL1 should be a HC victory. Once you start getting into the higher speeds is when I think the ZL1 will pull away as it has a higher top speed, less weight, and is lower to the ground. That is with all else remaining stock. The HC makes more power but at a certain speed that extra weight will start to wear it down. I think some of the HC owners do underestimate the ZL1 for some reason. But it is clear that both cars are formidable. Once there are more ZL1s out there we'll see more good runs with these two heavy weights.

I'm no engineer or physics major or anything, but I don't think it works like that. Once the weight gets moving, then the car with more power, better aero and less drag should start to pull ahead. I think they're pretty damn close, close enough to be called a drivers race when comparing the A10 to A8 or M6 to M6, but at higher speeds, I think the Hellcat should slowly start to pull ahead. Nothing dramatic, but slightly.

What's the top speed on the ZL1? I thought it was 199 or something like that. The Challenger HC top speed is also 199 mph. The Charger Hellcat, despite weighing more, has a top speed of 204 due to better aero.

[Artos]

I cannot see a HC having better aero at all (maybe less downforce)...it's the ponies that take it there.

[Evolvedx27]

Originally Posted by Artos

I cannot see a HC having better aero at all (maybe less downforce)...it's the ponies that take it there.

Agreed. I'm still waiting to have a meeting with one... that and a 13-14 Gt500

[TheShooter]

Unless I see something different...

Hellcat Charger is a 204 MPH car that has made passes at 207 MPH as well. Officially they say 204. The 1/4 mile is a regular story at 10.85 with drag radials, but that will NEVER happen on a normal road.

I've driven the ZL1 twice now. And I've tested it directly against my Hellcat. From 70 MPH I will pull on the ZL1 in every instance. I had a second go at it last week with a A10 ZL1 and it was exactly the same.

But again, these cars are really NOT comparable. The Hellcat is a truly practical car. People can fit in the back and the Charger version is a totally usable family car with a HUGE trunk. A ZL1 is a 2+2 Corvette and no one fits in the back happily, including my son who's just 5'3 at the moment.

If you want a practical car that can also be a awesome fun car, the Hellcat is a great way to go. If you want a focused sports car that still has a minimum of utility, get the ZL1. I don't see why folks compare these cars when only a madman would cross shop them. They have totally different design goals.


R.

[Can'tHave2MuchHP]

From my bench reasoning...

A Hellcat can walk a half car away on a stage 3 aero Z06 on the highway (seen it 10 times in a night). Stage 3 Z06s have a ton of drag north of 130, where the Hellcat is just getting moving. A stage 3 Z06 will put a car or more on a 6th ZL1. So with that in mind, On a 60+ to top speed highway roll, I see a 2 car win for a Hellcat by 180. Less as you go down.

[TheShooter]

Originally Posted by Can'tHave2MuchHP

From my bench reasoning...

A Hellcat can walk a half car away on a stage 3 aero Z06 on the highway (seen it 10 times in a night). Stage 3 Z06s have a ton of drag north of 130, where the Hellcat is just getting moving. A stage 3 Z06 will put a car or more on a 6th ZL1. So with that in mind, On a 60+ to top speed highway roll, I see a 2 car win for a Hellcat by 180. Less as you go down.

100% correct.

And those 275 tires also let the Hellcat get beyond 200 MPH. Less drag/friction.

But with less downforce, the Hellcat is a scarier ride. Yes, it pulls maniacally well beyond 150 MPH, but that lack of downforce is more than a tad scary. I know this 1st hand.

A ZL1 will test your skills. A Hellcat will test your balls. Both tests are a LOT of fun!



R.

[BlaqWhole]

I would love to come across either of these two in either trans configuration in either of my cars...and habe the driver actually have balls to go at it. I would love to see where I stand. From videos I have seen both cars look about dead even but that depends on driver ability. One thung I do notice is that the ZL1 seems more planted at higher speeds which is why I think it'll do a higher top speed. It just takes a lot to unplant the ZL1. Between the two I prefer the ZL1 for high speed runs but that's just me.

[newmoon]

Originally Posted by TheShooter

100% correct.

And those 275 tires also let the Hellcat get beyond 200 MPH. Less drag/friction.

But with less downforce, the Hellcat is a scarier ride. Yes, it pulls maniacally well beyond 150 MPH, but that lack of downforce is more than a tad scary. I know this 1st hand.

A ZL1 will test your skills. A Hellcat will test your balls. Both tests are a LOT of fun!



R.

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In this older episode ot Motor Trend's Ignition they claim that the Hellcat was incredibly stable at high speed?

[MR-02]

Originally Posted by CarFlow1

I'm currently in a rush, but I just wanted to update the forum with a personal observation. I just raced a hellcat charger today, the race was so close that he followed me into another city. I believe he had underestimated the ZL1's potential lol. We evenly had won a few pulls over each other but it was cool, although the Hellcat is fast, I just feel as though the ZL1 can last longer for some reason. It won't be hard for our vehicles to catch up and win the race.

?

[Raven87]

Originally Posted by Artos

I cannot see a HC having better aero at all (maybe less downforce)...it's the ponies that take it there.

The HC Charger has better aero than the HC Challenger. Certainly not better aero vs the 6th gen ZL1 though. But - it does have a the ponies to compensate so it comes down to a driver's race.

[mdmoore23]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

Regardless of the chassis or how old it is, it does exactly what Dodge designed it to do and then some. Plus that design is why they're able to keep the cost low. Maybe our Camaros wouldn't be soo expensive if they weren't getting refreshed every 4 years and then 2 getting a completely new design 2 years after that.

I don't get this statement. The ZL1 is less expensive than a Hellcat. I thought they were priced right at introduction, but with the big 2016 price increase I actually think the Cats are overpriced for what they are. I traded my 2016 Hellcat Challenger for my ZL1, by the way. It is indeed an awesome car, that did exactly what Dodge said it would, but I feel no regrets since trading.

[mdmoore23]

Originally Posted by bpang1234

Is there any good reason why Dodge decided to only put 275s on the rears of the Hellcat? Did they think that was "good" or did they just expect everyone to toss them for DRs?

There's really no more room inboard to add more meat if you look under the car. That's why they had to go with fender flares on the widebody. I know people add wider wheels and tires and drag radials on stock wheels, but they stick out.