Optional Long Tube Headers on the ZL-1

[Wondering]

Originally Posted by DevilKnightFalcon

Uhh long tube headers are not illegal in Arizona. As far as your comment about that disclaimer being on every website you should look closer.

http://www.americanracingheaders.com...oSS+V8_V6.html

The disclaimer is clearly marked for California only. It is illegal to drive a car without cats however replacing the stock cats with high flow ones is not illegal.

Feel free to Google the subject of LT's & their legality.

[68vert]

I was bringing this thought up to see who would pop for the headers at what price/hp gains. The reason LT are illegal is the act of changing or altering a system that been through all the certifications required of manufactures. The length of the exhaust tube before it goes into the collecter is not the issue.

The reason manufactures use the typical heavy manifolds is because of longevity. A regular header is not going to hold up well to the years compared to a heavy oem piece.

As far as cost, LT headers can be made and sold for a couple hunded bucks. Have been for years. We are currently just getting ripped off because the Camaro is hot and new.

I was just wondering who would be willing to spend extra to get "real factory headers" if GM decided to go with it.

[clg_98ta]

Originally Posted by Wondering

Actually,LT headers are illegal (other than off-road use) in every state in the union.

LT's require relocation of the cats,and that's a federal no-no. Having said that,it's rarely enforced. But if a comapny like GM decided to do it,I'm sure it would peak the interest of the folks at the EPA.

Actually, what's illegal, is modifying the OEM exhaust between the engine and the rear O2 sensors. If a car was built and delivered with LT's they would not be illegal. Of course, the exhaust would have had to meet all federal (and Calif) emissions requirements before it could be certified for use on US roads.

If a car was delivered with LTs, it would be illegal to modify them or to replace with factory LS3 exhaust manifolds & cats, because that, again, is a change to the original equipment.

[GoldenBear]

Originally Posted by 68vert

I was bringing this thought up to see who would pop for the headers at what price/hp gains. The reason LT are illegal is the act of changing or altering a system that been through all the certifications required of manufactures. The length of the exhaust tube before it goes into the collecter is not the issue.

Even though Federal law doesn't mandate a pre-determined exact length between the engine and the catalytic converter, the length of the exhaust tube before the catalytic converter is an issue due to fact that the longer the distance is between the engine and the converter, the more difficult it is for the converter to reduce cold start emissions. The further the converter is away from the engine the longer the converter will take to reach its light-off temperature (the temperature at which the converter reaches a 50 percent conversion rate). Roughly 80 percent of the emissions measured during Federal emissions testing occur during the first few minutes after cold start. If the converter is too far away from the engine, the vehicle will not be able to pass Federal emission standards and, therefore, will not be able to be certified to be legally driven in the U.S.

Originally Posted by 68vert

I was just wondering who would be willing to spend extra to get "real factory headers" if GM decided to go with it.

You're effectively asking a purely hypothetical question because it is very unlikely that GM would ever offer factory long tube headers due to the difficulty they pose in meeting Federal emission standards.

[BSR-1]

Originally Posted by GoldenBear

Actually, the length of the exhaust tube before the catalytic converter is an issue due to fact that the longer the distance is between the engine and the converter, the more difficult it is for the converter to reduce cold start emissions. The further the converter is away from the engine the longer the converter will take to reach its light-off temperature (the temperature at which the converter reaches a 50 percent conversion rate). Roughly 80 percent of the emissions measured during Federal emissions testing occur during the first few minutes after cold start.

Very informative, thanks!

[Mr. Wyndham]

I'll weigh in...because I just realized something...

The thoughts in this thread seem to be revolving around the headers as a thing unto themselves. (Which is the title of the thread, I know, but bear with me)

I'd much rather concern myself with the total engine as an assembly, rather than inflating the value of one or two components. For example (this is NOT a "vs")...Ford put shorty headers on the new Mustang GT's engine. That's cool, but when I compare it to the LS3 found in the Camaro, it's still down on power.

So...I guess what I'm trying to say is, if GM powertrain determines they can/need to put headers on an engine from the factory to meet their goals, I'll take it...and brag about it, ...but if not, I can't see myself paying the $1500+ they'd probably be.

[MrDew]

question... Why isnt there a company that has their headers tested and CARB certified? Is it simply impossible to meet the requirements or is the test just too expensive or what is it? Quantities on a Camaro or Mustang might actually justify the investment and it would be a validated replacement...

[TX Pony Killer]

I know very little about the LSA, so this may be a stupid question, but would LS3 long tubes match an LSA?

[MileMAN402]

http://www.lingenfelter.com/mm5/merc...gory_Code=C409

They would probably be something similar to this with maybe some different bends to fit in the ZL1 engine bay.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk

[GEEo]

Originally Posted by Mindz

They wouldn't as this car needs to be available in California. Long Tube headers are illegal in California due to the California Air Resources Board. =(

boooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!

[Unobtainium]

Tube-style headers are becoming more common on factory cars.
Audi and BMW have had them for years, and the new coyote motor has a tube-style 4-2-1 exhaust manifold.
Cost is the major motivator for cast manifolds, longevity second.
The GT500's care so little for headers I usually recommend guys spend their money elsewhere. Unless you have a big whipple, or a really wound-up TVS,
The gains are less than 20whp on the 5-550whp cars. Spend 1200 on headers, plus install time/money, and you could just get a smaller pulley.
Wonder if the ZL-1 will be similar?
Headers that are put together anywhere and sold for 3-400 are junk.
They cost more now because they are mostly being built based on sound engineering principles now. The majority have switched to MIG welding now though to increase profit at the cost of quality and aesthetics.
I don't see GM wasting time on headers for this car.
A gear option, now there is an idea.

[14pilot]

This would be a way to go for GM:

Similiar to LS9 Exhaust Manifolds shown here, with the collector moved rearward to clear the Camaro engine mounts.