[arpad_m]

Why can't you electric jockeys just congregate and enjoy your newfound infatuation with the brave new digital futur(e) elsewhere, on a Tesla or "sustainability" forum? No judgment from me, I went through that phase in my early 20s, too, what I don't understand is why you feel the need to spread this "it's inevitable", pardon, "resistance is futile, you will be assimilated" meme everywhere.

This is a Camaro forum, last time I checked, there was no electric Camaro. Once that changes, a new powertrain subforum will indeed be due, maybe that section can be a new home for these conversations.

The textile industry analogy is flawed, too, because it completely disregards the propaganda aspect of this recent transition. You think those who don't embrace this idea with the same zeal are all stupid?

[Xaxas]

Remember how the digital format was pioneered as a better format as analogue? It's a pure signal so you don't have to worry about interference, better quality, etc, and vinyl sales have been steadily increasing since 2007? Requiring people to buy a bulky method of storage that's not reliable quality wise and specialized equipment? Some people like that, and as time goes on more people miss it, same will happen with electric cars.

Kids nowadays spend all their time in their cellphones so when they get in their cars, they care about the same things as if were a phone, screen size, gimmicks, etc, all "features" that will be in every car but have to pay to have them activated; eventually people will get tired of that, they will miss the noises, the mechanical feeling, all things ICE cars provide, just look at it this way, the movement for restomods and classic/older cars is pretty hot right when when we are in arguably peak ICE, Ferrari has an 800+ hp NA engine, 400+ is "standard" in sport cars, imagine 10-20 years into the future, enthusiasts and hobbyist will keep it alive.

[Petrol Head]

Originally Posted by Puddin

Well I hate to be the bearer of bad news but it looks like the Camaro is going to have to go to electric if it wants any chance of survival. This website will just have to make an extra sub section when it eventually happens.

If you have read any of my posts you’d know I have always said either the Camaro retains at least an option for a gasoline engine or it must be axed. No appliance with an electric motor should ever have the Camaro badge on it.

[Petrol Head]

Originally Posted by Xaxas

Remember how the digital format was pioneered as a better format as analogue? It's a pure signal so you don't have to worry about interference, better quality, etc, and vinyl sales have been steadily increasing since 2007? Requiring people to buy a bulky method of storage that's not reliable quality wise and specialized equipment? Some people like that, and as time goes on more people miss it, same will happen with electric cars.

Kids nowadays spend all their time in their cellphones so when they get in their cars, they care about the same things as if were a phone, screen size, gimmicks, etc, all "features" that will be in every car but have to pay to have them activated; eventually people will get tired of that, they will miss the noises, the mechanical feeling, all things ICE cars provide, just look at it this way, the movement for restomods and classic/older cars is pretty hot right when when we are in arguably peak ICE, Ferrari has an 800+ hp NA engine, 400+ is "standard" in sport cars, imagine 10-20 years into the future, enthusiasts and hobbyist will keep it alive.

I just spent $850 on a turntable and easily could have spent $5,000 to get what I really, really, REALLY wanted.

Vinyl is magic compared to even the best CD player or the best digital streaming or iTunes.

People will want that feeling and sound of an internal combustion engine after missing it for a while.

[Camaro fanboy]

same here.
5000 usd turntable. but tbh i never use it

[Petrol Head]

Originally Posted by Camaro fanboy

same here.
5000 usd turntable. but tbh i never use it

Is that a Mitchell?

[Camaro fanboy]

yep
with gold sme series v. used to love vinyl..lost interest in music as i got older

[Petrol Head]

Originally Posted by Camaro fanboy

yep
with gold sme series v. used to love vinyl..lost interest in music as i got older

Very nice! I bet if you got a few of your favorite albums on remastered 180g it will rekindle your interest.

Van Halen never sounded so good!

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by arpad_m

Why can't you electric jockeys just congregate and enjoy your newfound infatuation with the brave new digital futur(e) elsewhere, on a Tesla or "sustainability" forum? No judgment from me, I went through that phase in my early 20s, too, what I don't understand is why you feel the need to spread this "it's inevitable", pardon, "resistance is futile, you will be assimilated" meme everywhere.

This is a Camaro forum, last time I checked, there was no electric Camaro. Once that changes, a new powertrain subforum will indeed be due, maybe that section can be a new home for these conversations.

The textile industry analogy is flawed, too, because it completely disregards the propaganda aspect of this recent transition. You think those who don't embrace this idea with the same zeal are all stupid?

So I have to reject your thoughts on “this a Camaro forum why don’t you go to a Tesla forum” thinking.

By your definition, this forum can ONLY be about what the Camaro IS and what it WAS. No discussion on what it COULD be is allowed. That’s what I disagree with.

The argument here is simply the same as manual vs automatic, or sound vs no sound.

I enjoy a good manual, but for mea DCT is far better.

I miss the start up sounds of my SS sedan, but it doesn’t define the driving experience for me. Besides so many cars now have fake noise pumped in that what you think you hear isn’t genuine.

What people enjoy and why they enjoy it isn’t the same for everyone.

[Petrol Head]

Originally Posted by Number 3

So I have to reject your thoughts on “this a Camaro forum why don’t you go to a Tesla forum” thinking.

By your definition, this forum can ONLY be about what the Camaro IS and what it WAS. No discussion on what it COULD be is allowed. That’s what I disagree with.

The argument here is simply the same as manual vs automatic, or sound vs no sound.

I enjoy a good manual, but for mea DCT is far better.

I miss the start up sounds of my SS sedan, but it doesn’t define the driving experience for me. Besides so many cars now have fake noise pumped in that what you think you hear isn’t genuine.

What people enjoy and why they enjoy it isn’t the same for everyone.

Everything you just said is EXACTLY why it does NOT belong in this forum.

There is no future for Camaro if it does not include a real, naturally aspirated gasoline V8 and a true 3 pedal manual transmission, and I’m ok with that.

What I am NOT ok with, and will fight you every step of the way on, is that somehow you can justify an electric Camaro.

Maybe you need to start your own forum if you feel differently then.

[Puddin]

Originally Posted by Petrol Head

Everything you just said is EXACTLY why it does NOT belong in this forum.

There is no future for Camaro if it does not include a real, naturally aspirated gasoline V8 and a true 3 pedal manual transmission, and I’m ok with that.

What I am NOT ok with, and will fight you every step of the way on, is that somehow you can justify an electric Camaro.

Maybe you need to start your own forum if you feel differently then.

So if there's no longer a v8 but just 6 and 4 cylinder versions they don't count as a Camaro? Genuine question by the way because some people like to look down upon the lower displacement cars but they still technically are a Camaro.

[Petrol Head]

Originally Posted by Puddin

So if there's no longer a v8 but just 6 and 4 cylinder versions they don't count as a Camaro? Genuine question by the way because some people like to look down upon the lower displacement cars but they still technically are a Camaro.

I got no problem with them because they help keep the Camaro viable.

So they can replace the 4 and 6 with electrics, so long as there’s a V8.

The V8 could even be the slowest of the lineup

[MBSS1LE]

Originally Posted by Dathomas94

There’s no replacement for displacement !

That electric Camaro, if it comes to be, is definitely replacement for displacement. It will outperform the current ICE versions.

[UnknownJinX]

Originally Posted by Norm Peterson

What's wrong with having a reasonably fuel-efficient ICE-MT car for the daily stuff? Why not keep as much of the fun car's fun in the DD as you can?

Norm

I could do that theoretically, but one thing I find is that having multiple manual cars can be tricky due to every car having different clutch bite points.

And heh, if it's supposed to be a toaster, there is less feeling involved and more financial calculations. EVs are good for drive it and forget it type of deal.

It's all hypothetical for me anyway. The gas and maintenance saving from not driving the Camaro doesn't offset the extra cost incurred with another car, mainly insurance in my area

And now that I think of it, EV doesn't have to be a car. Could be an e-bike. But then again, motorcycles are cooler and more fun. Hmmm...

Originally Posted by Number 3

You have exactly the same concern with an ICE car.

Because no one buys those and they are all but gone. GM makes 3 cars with a manual and 2 of them are only available at $60k plus on the sticker (Blackwing). Heck 2 of GM’s divisions don’t even sell a car, trucks and SUVs only.

For fuel efficiency, manuals aren’t the answer anymore. In line haul tractors, manuals are being replaced by automated manuals and automatics as the computer is better than the driver.

Don't you mean 4? There is Spark, Camaro, CT4-V BW and CT5-V BW.

And I mean, in a business setting, every little bit counts, but for personal use there are other factors to it. Yeah, manual enthusiasts all know that there aren't many objective reasons to drive one anymore, but emotions also play a part.

Originally Posted by digitalfutur

EVs are the future, including performance cars. and the trend is irreversible. It will take about 25 years for a complete transition, but eventually ICE vehicles will be an oddity on the road...you hardly see any 25 year old cars on the road around compared to newer models.

The range anxiety issue for EVs has already been solved, as as the cost. In fact any EV today has a lower TCO (total cost of ownership) than its equivalent ICE counterpart, due the savings on fuel and on maintenance. The number of recharge stations and their location is on its way to being solved, though 90% of EV charging is done at home. Electrical capacity will also be solved. Why? Because of demand. Human ingenuity doesn't operate in a vacuum disconnected from the real world.

Change always has its opponents, that hasn't changed since textile workers threw their sabbots (shoes) into the automated machines that were putting a lot of them out work, a futile attempt at sabotaging the future.

Anyone driving a Camaro today who opposes EVs, just because, is a driving contradiction. Vastly improved specific power output, far lower emissions, fully computerized systems/connectivity (multiple CPUs) and much better collision protection for its occupants; are just a few of the "appliance" improvements.

Since they continue to drive them, the real reason for their opposition to EVs isn't the concept, it's the nostalgia for the good 'ol days. That hasn't stopped progress before, and it won't with EVs.

So yeah, wait 25 years until they become really cheap and all the bugs and kinks get worked out.

Again, maybe you guys are masochists that enjoy paying extra to be Guinea Pigs so they can study how to put lithium fire out(what was that about collision protection again, BTW? Or maybe if you are burned to a crisp, there is no worry about pains anymore) and how braking logic should work (ahem, Tesla). Not me. I am an inpatient guy, but when it comes to spending big money on cars and techs, I can be pretty patient.

Originally Posted by arpad_m

Why can't you electric jockeys just congregate and enjoy your newfound infatuation with the brave new digital futur(e) elsewhere, on a Tesla or "sustainability" forum? No judgment from me, I went through that phase in my early 20s, too, what I don't understand is why you feel the need to spread this "it's inevitable", pardon, "resistance is futile, you will be assimilated" meme everywhere.

This is a Camaro forum, last time I checked, there was no electric Camaro. Once that changes, a new powertrain subforum will indeed be due, maybe that section can be a new home for these conversations.

The textile industry analogy is flawed, too, because it completely disregards the propaganda aspect of this recent transition. You think those who don't embrace this idea with the same zeal are all stupid?

Yeah, it all gets really annoying for enthusiasts.

I get it, too. EVs have their advantages, but shoving it down enthusiasts' throats isn't gonna convince anyone, and this is a problem on a bigger scale as well.

Respecting what other people like instead of walking all over it is a better start if any EV proponents want to get anywhere on any ICE sports car enthusiast forums.

Originally Posted by MBSS1LE

That electric Camaro, if it comes to be, is definitely replacement for displacement. It will outperform the current ICE versions.

Well, you can now buy turbocharged 4-cylinder engines, tune them and get better performance than an NA V8.

But the sound and the feel will NOT match a V8. That's the argument here.

Numbers aren't everything, you know. There is more to cars than just 0-60 wanking.

Being an ex-rotary owner, even I have to agree that, yes, no replacement for displacement.