[Number 3]

Originally Posted by shaffe

True, but they are axing the CT6 and that was the only car on Omega. The CT5 and Camaro need each other to stay alive.



But aren't the residual values of the car already bad? or is it the residual that much different from resale value?



This ^ CT5 and Camaro need each other to survive. How much did omega cost GM to develop and now the only car that was on it is gone after 3 model years.

The CT6 is NOT dead. It is and will continue to be built in China. Just not here.

Also the Cruze continues in Mexico and China, just not here. Like the Buick Verano which is not only still in production, it’s an all new model. Just not here.

Originally Posted by MackSteelPrivateEye

I don't know why people binch about a small back seat and narrow trunk...its not a family car. Its a sporty Coupe, Hi performance coupe. Its beautiful car styling wise. Classic Coke Bottle shape. Its what we all asked for and what we got so why are people now nitpicking. The reason sales are low is because Chevy makes stupid decisions like not advertising and believing people will beat a path to its door. And some people don't even know what a Camaro is....some don't know they are back in production. Chevy has made absolutely no attempt to correct that. Its a nice car but GM has stupid upper management who should be managing a Burger King not an Auto Manufacturing outfit.

You are making excuses. The Camaro is not a Miata (actual sports car) or Corvette for that matter. In a world were everyone is abandoning sedans for SUVs a coupe will need to offer more, not less practicality to survive. GM can’t afford the development dollars for multiple low volume coupes.

The issue isn’t really whether GM keeps the Camaro in production. It needs to simply to help LGR. The issue is whether GM finds the ROIC for doing a Gen7.

And it’s far, far from a Camaro issue. GM has problems on all models getting recognition in the market. On the coasts GM market share was, last I saw data, sometimes below 10%. That is pathetic. I remember seeing data that many didn’t even know GM made cars. Thought they made pickups.

[Aragorn]

Originally Posted by Ray-J

People the Camaro is way more expensive than the Mustang or Challenger. It also does not have the rebates the other two often have. I know I got my 17 Mustang for 21K and still it was not the best I could have done. Your never going to see a Camaro for that price. My plans were to get another Mustang, Eco, this time and it was going to cost me around 23K. Again cheaper!

Probably stating the obvious here, but it depends on the trim. Scat pack and higher trims are not very cheap.

[90503]

I put this whole Camaro/Cadillac thing in the it doesn't make sense with everything else they are doing based on "slow selling models" and the autonomous electric future...column...lol... …

They can continue making models at non-US plants, but have to close US plants that make the same model because those same models just don't sell....Ah, yes...car salesmen to the end...The more I look at it, the less any of it passes the smell test...

[hammdo]

Fix the lame commercials would be a good start. Like watching grass grow — which is more exciting to watch than these generic ones GM puts out...

Making the cars more invigorating would be nice too...

Dodge at least gets some excitement going with theirs...

Yes, lack of fleet sales have impacted the 6th gen sales numbers — still... how about some exciting commercials...

-Don

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by hammdo

Fix the lame commercials would be a good start. Like watching grass grow — which is more exciting to watch than these generic ones GM puts out...

Making the cars more invigorating would be nice too...

Dodge at least gets some excitement going with theirs...

Yes, lack of fleet sales have impacted the 6th gen sales numbers — still... how about some exciting commercials...

-Don

Dodge lies. “Domestic not domesticated”. Cars made in Canada by an Italian company. But yeah they have awesome commercials.

[motorhead]

Originally Posted by Number 3

Dodge lies. “Domestic not domesticated”. Cars made in Canada by an Italian company. But yeah they have awesome commercials.

Not made assembled. All cars are made all over the world. GM might as well be foreign they dont care about the USA anymore than Fiat does. They proved that in this past month.

15,000 US jobs gone. I just saw her today on the hill trying to explain it away. Sorry not biting. They can do what they want. Its their business, but the days of using the American card have long since pasted.

[97cavy22]

I love the way the 6th gen looks but it's not for everyone. I've heard the "cartoonish" looking a few times. It's the best sports car of the 3 yet sales are the worst. Everyone seems to want a black/silver/grey blend in SUV, these cars do not blend in. I think a shift to, and I hate to say this, a little bit more of a practical coupe would help sales numbers. Nothing crazy but better sight lines, a back seat that would fit an adult for a short trip, and a bit more space (cubbies, door pockets etc.) to put stuff around the interior.

[Deputy Dog]

Originally Posted by MackSteelPrivateEye

I don't know why people binch about a small back seat and narrow trunk...its not a family car. Its a sporty Coupe, Hi performance coupe. Its beautiful car styling wise. Classic Coke Bottle shape. Its what we all asked for and what we got so why are people now nitpicking. The reason sales are low is because Chevy makes stupid decisions like not advertising and believing people will beat a path to its door. And some people don't even know what a Camaro is....some don't know they are back in production. Chevy has made absolutely no attempt to correct that. Its a nice car but GM has stupid upper management who should be managing a Burger King not an Auto Manufacturing outfit.

So true.

[Deputy Dog]

Originally Posted by Stex

60-70s Chevelle, GTO /Lemans and Buick version were all bigger than the current Challenger but weighed way less.

The Challenger always been bigger than the Camaro and Mustang since the first one in 1970. Was bigger than the Barracuda also in Wheelbase.

[Deputy Dog]

Originally Posted by CoolbreezeNJ

You don't know how they are bid and what the actual price is. I suspect they are bid in what is called a "Reverse Auction". Both vendors and suppliers get on a web site and put up a price. Many times this means taking a loss on per unit sales. Mostly this is making the cars commodities and nobody makes much money on commodities. The difference is if you think via volume from suppliers that you can make up for the loss on per unit prices.

An alternative approach is to make a better product and keep your margins. Sitting where I am the Camaro is the better product at least in the V8 realms. I suspect the Mustang Eco-Boost could dust the V6 Camaro yet it still can't out handle it. I see no reason at all to buy a V6 Challenger. Challenger is a pig and it should really show up in the V6 Version.

So what if they lose a little bit on each car and I doubt if they are...it would still be effective promotional advertising in showing the product to the public. What would you rather rent a Camaro or a Toyota???

[Deputy Dog]

Originally Posted by 97cavy22

I love the way the 6th gen looks but it's not for everyone. I've heard the "cartoonish" looking a few times. It's the best sports car of the 3 yet sales are the worst. Everyone seems to want a black/silver/grey blend in SUV, these cars do not blend in. I think a shift to, and I hate to say this, a little bit more of a practical coupe would help sales numbers. Nothing crazy but better sight lines, a back seat that would fit an adult for a short trip, and a bit more space (cubbies, door pockets etc.) to put stuff around the interior.

This looks like a cartoon?....

[Idaho2018GTPremium]

Originally Posted by motorhead

I find it funny that when the Camaro was winning the sales race most of this community boasted the importance of these sells numbers. Now we are supposed to say they dont matter? Okay kid.

Anyhow, it really comes down to if the car is worth the effort to GM. Time will tell because none of us really know the real facts. I predict the 19 sales wil be way less than even 18. I dont know a single person outside of this forum that likes them. I see more and more Challengers everyday around here. I know when Im out in the Hellcat, I get a lot more attention than when Im out in the ZL1. They dont care that the ZL1 is more refined and over all a better performer. Fiat has done their homework in keeping an old design relevant and appealing. It proves that you dont have to be the best when it comes to numbers. GM is more concerned with the track and performace numbers than what people really want in a street performace car that mostly never sees a track outside of a few. I can tell you after months of owning a ZL1 and a Hellcat, I appreciate what the ZL1 can do, but the Hellcat is a nicer daily driver.

Interesting perspective. Being a car guy, both Hellcats and ZL1s stand out to me. The Hellcats have a nice look from all angles, except for straight on the back end, the back is too tall and the perspective is off. Impressive that it still catches peoples eye being a 10 year old platform. From a rear 45 degree angle, the back still looks great, and I like the taillights.

I agree most ZL1s will never see a track. Hellcats and Mustang GTs PP1/2s as well. My GT PP1 will probably never see a track.

[Mighty Mouce]

Originally Posted by Deputy Dog

This looks like a cartoon?....

That doesn't look like any cartoon I have ever seen.

[Idaho2018GTPremium]

Originally Posted by Nsxmatt

It's well known and pointed out in every single thread like this but literally nobody here reads it or retains it, but the difference is because the camaro does very little fleet sales and mustang and challenger do a huge amount. There are multiple news stories and articles on the subject.

And nobody will read that either. So now lets have another 5 page thread with people crying the Camaro is going to die and it's not selling and blah blah..

Ford's fleet sales have accounted for 26% of their total sales so far this year. Most likely, the majority of those fleet sales are trucks and SUVs and police cars. That said, even if 26% of the 71,450 mustangs sold were fleet sales, the total to the consumer would be 53,500, 6.5k more than the Camaro. I'm guessing consumer Mustang sales are probably more than 90%, but that's just a guess.

How many Camaros does GM typically sell in a given year? GM is on pace for about 51k. Is that bad or much less than average?