[mitdr774]

Isnt Consumers Report the one that was caught placing a flare under a Chevy truck with a side saddle fuel tank?

[Aragorn]

It looks like transmission paint and trim were there trouble categories.

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by mitdr774

Isnt Consumers Report the one that was caught placing a flare under a Chevy truck with a side saddle fuel tank?

No it was NBC Dateline

https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-...335-story.html

[Jeb114]

All consumer reports does is add up all the questionnaires that you get when you buy a new car and then add up all the service requests the dealers get. There is no incentive for them to make a car better or worse, This world is full of conspiracy theory's,,,,......

[Hops]

Originally Posted by Jeb114

All consumer reports does is add up all the questionnaires that you get when you buy a new car and then add up all the service requests the dealers get. There is no incentive for them to make a car better or worse, This world is full of conspiracy theory's,,,,......

Never heard about the survey independently including dealer service data:
https://www.consumerreports.org/car-...liability-faq/

[mitdr774]

Originally Posted by Number 3

No it was NBC Dateline

https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-...335-story.html

Thank you for the correction.

[Aragorn]

Consumer reports does also say the following:

At a glance, the new Camaro may appear to be the result of a cosmetic makeover, but it is now based on the accomplished Alpha rear-drive platform that underpins the Cadillac ATS and its dimensions are a bit smaller. This pedigree gets the coupe off to a good start. Reduced weight, revised suspension, and sharp steering create an experience unlike any muscle car buyer's expectations. The Camaro feels much more like a fine European sport sedan than anything a typical shopper may be trading in.

[17rsvert]

Originally Posted by Jeb114

All consumer reports does is add up all the questionnaires that you get when you buy a new car and then add up all the service requests the dealers get. There is no incentive for them to make a car better or worse, This world is full of conspiracy theory's,,,,......

According to the CR info linked in the previous post, "A typical model has about 200 to 300 samples for each model year..." All of that information comes solely from on line member surveys. That sample is small enough that the results for a particular brand or model could easily be skewed by setting up bogus (but paid) member accounts and giving bad (or good) ratings. There may not be any incentive for CR to make a car better or worse, but there is certainly incentive for a car company or dealerships to do it. This is known to be a huge problem with Amazon's product ratings.

But on second thought, I guess there is little chance of this actually happening, because car salesmen as a group are well known for their scrupulous honesty.

[17rsvert]

Which reminds me of a joke.

Joe's talking to friend at a bar and says "All car salesman are assholes" A guy next to the friend turns around and says "Hey! I resent that!" so Joe asks " Why? Are you a car salesman?" And the guy replies "No. I'm an asshole"

[Gunkk]

Originally Posted by 17rsvert

According to the CR info linked in the previous post, "A typical model has about 200 to 300 samples for each model year..." All of that information comes solely from on line member surveys. That sample is small enough that the results for a particular brand or model could easily be skewed by setting up bogus (but paid) member accounts and giving bad (or good) ratings. There may not be any incentive for CR to make a car better or worse, but there is certainly incentive for a car company or dealerships to do it. This is known to be a huge problem with Amazon's product ratings.

Given that the A8 transmission was a huge issue, with nearly all 2016-2018 A8 cars affected before the Q1 2019 fluid fix was put in place, the Transmission Minor and Transmission Major 1 ratings are well deserved.

The other issue with the CR ratings is "predicted reliability" which is built on the assumption that history will repeat itself.

We know for the '16-'18 A8 Camaros that the new fluid does indeed fix the shudder issue (burned TC's excluded). And in 2020 we now have the A10. So the "prediction" is very likely not going to come true, and there is no way a post-consumer reliability feedback "predicted reliabiility" rating will ever show this. So the carmaker is indeed punished by this lagging quality indicator and must earn back their reputation.

Only time tells here as the 2020 statistics come in over the next 12-24 months. Those of us who have had CR subscriptions for many years have seen this over and over.

GM has screwed a lot of people with crap quality over the years. The Camaro will earn back the good reliability #s, but it's going to take another year or two to show up.

[c4racer]

Originally Posted by Aragorn

It looks like transmission paint and trim were there trouble categories.

Who is analyzing the paint on the transmission!

[Hops]

Originally Posted by Gunkk

We know for the '16-'18 A8 Camaros that the new fluid does indeed fix the shudder issue (burned TC's excluded). And in 2020 we now have the A10. So the "prediction" is very likely not going to come true, and there is no way a post-consumer reliability feedback "predicted reliabiility" rating will ever show this. So the carmaker is indeed punished by this lagging quality indicator and must earn back their reputation.

Only time tells here as the 2020 statistics come in over the next 12-24 months. Those of us who have had CR subscriptions for many years have seen this over and over.

That is interesting to know. The news articles reporting on CR results really are overly general, and i think malign cars in a bad way. If i'm buying a manual Camaro (a significant percentage of buyers), how reliable will it be to other cars?


I think the CR reliability ratings survey is ok to help key in on particular problem areas on cars, or general knowledge. While i think the survey is probably accurate in differentiating reliability, it probably exaggerates the differences through self-selection and non response bias. More CR subscribers have the car which CR highly rates, and are more likely to fill out the survey when things work out with their CR recommended car, because well... CR is working and my CR car choice is working.
While i admit this isn't rational, I personally used to be a CR subscriber, and their auto ratings survey results didn't correspond to my experience (the acura i owned was the worst car i ever owned, and a BMW the most reliable) . CR lost some of it's reputation with me. And i know that's irrational attitude, as there's always the outlier one can have the misfortune of owning. But i don't subscribe to CR anymore let alone fill out an auto survey.

[DC5]

Originally Posted by c4racer

Who is analyzing the paint on the transmission!

[c4racer]

or maybe I read that wrong....