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Old 07-10-2024, 01:10 PM   #1
Need4Camaro

 
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For those of us tuned to run on E85.. ..Are we 'Carbon Nuetral'?

I have been wondering this, especially with the performance aspect considered. Are we more environmentally friendly than we would be if we ran straight premium, even if we make more horsepower?
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Old 07-10-2024, 01:28 PM   #2
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IMO, no. Fertilizer for the corn and the energy and water needed to make the ethanol isnt green or carbon neutral. IMO, it doesnt matter though. I dont care.
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Old 07-10-2024, 01:32 PM   #3
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From a very narrow point of view the answer is technically yes, but Orgs like Greenpeace, Sierra Club would never think it was enviromentally friendly as they do not want you in a car in the first place no matter how good it is, and that includes Electric because we all know how great they are for the planet.
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Old 07-10-2024, 02:09 PM   #4
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IMO, no. Fertilizer for the corn and the energy and water needed to make the ethanol isnt green or carbon neutral. IMO, it doesnt matter though. I dont care.
This is the right answer. It has actually been proven that adding ethanol to fuel is actually worse for the environment when taking in all of the factors greenzle mentioned. The YouTube channel engineering explained has a great video detailing out how it actually turned out to be worse for the environment.
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Old 07-10-2024, 02:29 PM   #5
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Are we better than gasoline when looking at only tailpipe emissions? yes, for sure.

Are we more carbon neutral that gasoline if you could all of the pieces needed to make ethanol? Nope, not at all. Technically it's the same or worse gallon for gallon. But it might be overall less if you could total emissions/carbon for E85 vs E10.
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Old 07-10-2024, 03:48 PM   #6
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Are we better than gasoline when looking at only tailpipe emissions? yes, for sure.

Are we more carbon neutral that gasoline if you could all of the pieces needed to make ethanol? Nope, not at all. Technically it's the same or worse gallon for gallon. But it might be overall less if you could total emissions/carbon for E85 vs E10.
I'm not sure that's even true. The higher the Ethanol content, the more you need to achieve the same combustion energy as gasoline.

Diesel would actually have the higher "green" potential, the more you can compress a fuel/air mixture, the more work gets done, and the more complete burn you get. Diesel is still dirtier than gasoline when burned, gram for gram. But when your fleet average goes from 18mpg to 48mpg, you consume a shit ton less petroleum.

Todays turbo diesels, once relieved of their emissions equipment, get phenomenal MPG and power per cubic inch. You need far fewer cubes to get the job done. Of course when you factor in emissions equipment, the fact that emissions equipment destroys engines, DEF fluid, ect., it's a non-starter. Hilariously, they've finally accepted that DEF fluid is actually toxic, and polluting to the environment.

Don't run corn to be green, run it because it's cheap race gas!
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Old 07-10-2024, 04:01 PM   #7
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I'm not sure that's even true. The higher the Ethanol content, the more you need to achieve the same combustion energy as gasoline.

Diesel would actually have the higher "green" potential, the more you can compress a fuel/air mixture, the more work gets done, and the more complete burn you get. Diesel is still dirtier than gasoline when burned, gram for gram. But when your fleet average goes from 18mpg to 48mpg, you consume a shit ton less petroleum.

Todays turbo diesels, once relieved of their emissions equipment, get phenomenal MPG and power per cubic inch. You need far fewer cubes to get the job done. Of course when you factor in emissions equipment, the fact that emissions equipment destroys engines, DEF fluid, ect., it's a non-starter. Hilariously, they've finally accepted that DEF fluid is actually toxic, and polluting to the environment.

Don't run corn to be green, run it because it's cheap race gas!
I'm considering more than just tailpipe emissions. Think about the process of extracting, transporting and processing fossil fuels as well. And same goes for Ethanol. There is farming, and chemicals, harvest and processing etc.
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Old 07-10-2024, 04:17 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Megahurtz View Post
I'm considering more than just tailpipe emissions. Think about the process of extracting, transporting and processing fossil fuels as well. And same goes for Ethanol. There is farming, and chemicals, harvest and processing etc.
All of which is still cleaner than making e vehicles and charging them. Hardly anything goes to waste in the refining process to create gasoline. You actually get more gallons of gasoline than base crude was put in at a modern refinery. But in regard to Ethanol, it could be more efficiently made, but we live in a world where material efficiency is tied to money, so if it costs more then it isn't efficient. But I know what you mean.
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Old 07-10-2024, 09:41 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Need4Camaro View Post
I have been wondering this, especially with the performance aspect considered. Are we more environmentally friendly than we would be if we ran straight premium, even if we make more horsepower?
Yes
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Old 07-11-2024, 08:59 AM   #10
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Cleaner out the tail pipe and that is about it. It's not economical at all and only a small percentage of vehicles will benefit from running it. It's basically cheap race fuel.

Now if you blend the percentage way down it makes more sense. The E15 88 octane is good stuff. I can pretty much run the same timing on that as E10 91-93 octane and it costs a nickel a gallon less than E10 87. And there is very little fuel mileage loss.

On my 3.6 LGX XT6, it will only run 20-22 degrees timing on 87. On the E15 88 it will run all the way up to 26 degrees no problem. Which is max timing the stock tune commands.

So imo Ethanol works better overall(mileage and performance) for most vehicles when blended with pump gas in lower percentages. It doesn't take much to increase knock resistance and you get a lot better fuel mileage.

I know this part is off topic but I figured I would share for those wondering.
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