[cdb95z28]

All ZL1s are J6H, whether they are BCD or not and/or a 1LE or not.

BCD is a consumer choice, outside of CA & WA.... I ordered mine specifically with the BCD and I am in PA. I knew what I wanted and my dealer was able to do it.

As far as the rear BCD on my SS 1LE, the calipers and rotors "look" like they are the same as the ZL1 1LE (red color) rear (J6H) components, BCD or not. Whether they are exactly the same is another question.

Thanks for the part #s. My GM parts source had not listed the BCD J6H front calipers yet.

[RUQWIKR]

Originally Posted by cdb95z28

All ZL1s are J6H, whether they are BCD or not and/or a 1LE or not.

BCD is a consumer choice, outside of CA & WA.... I ordered mine specifically with the BCD and I am in PA. I knew what I wanted and my dealer was able to do it.

As far as the rear BCD on my SS 1LE, the calipers and rotors "look" like they are the same as the ZL1 1LE (red color) rear (J6H) components, BCD or not. Whether they are exactly the same is another question.

Thanks for the part #s. My GM parts source had not listed the BCD J6H front calipers yet.

The BCD J6H rear calipers are the regular ZL1 1LE rear (J6H) PN. The rear rotors have a different coating and the pads are obviously different between copper free and not. I have a 22 SS 1LE (BCD J6H) in Texas that I ordered, so, like you, it's available for $500.

[jkerb720]

I currently have a 2023 ZL1 1LE car on order that has been accepted by GM. Should i go ahead and add the copper free option? I live in Tennessee for reference i do not plan to move to California
I will be tracking the car so more or so a question to see if the size upgrade is worth the extra $500.

[Vigilante375]

Originally Posted by jkerb720

I currently have a 2023 ZL1 1LE car on order that has been accepted by GM. Should i go ahead and add the copper free option? I live in Tennessee for reference i do not plan to move to California
I will be tracking the car so more or so a question to see if the size upgrade is worth the extra $500.

I don't know if there has been any real data showing if these cooper free brakes are better on the ZL1.

I wouldn't worry about getting the copper free brakes. When it comes time to replace the pads, order them online. Don't go to the dealer in California as they won't be able to order it the copper free ones.

[cdb95z28]

Originally Posted by jkerb720

I currently have a 2023 ZL1 1LE car on order that has been accepted by GM. Should i go ahead and add the copper free option? I live in Tennessee for reference i do not plan to move to California
I will be tracking the car so more or so a question to see if the size upgrade is worth the extra $500.

I'm not sure you can change your order after it's already been accepted.

Rockauto has the pads in stock and dealers everywhere can get them.

I have more street and track time with them on my '22 SS 1LE. I initially complained about the initial bite and softness of these pads. But then I did my first flush/bleed. I had air come out of the RF caliper. This was there from the factory. So upon getting the system flushed and bled out and after having run some track days, I can say that the copper free option has lots of braking power. Yes, even after the air discovery, I still would like a little bit more initial bite and a little bit of stiffer pedal. But it improved to a point that the feel does not even capture my thoughts like it first did. But once you really get into these brakes they do offer some great power. The pads wear fast but I cannot compare how the wear rate is to the HP1000 pad. Maybe the wear rate is on par with the HP1000s

Also, the heat capacity of the BCD system on my OE 455HP SS 1LE is massive. I put heat temp stickers on my calipers and I had 240*F max on the fronts after a full AutoInterests track day at Pitt Race. Lots of variables dictate the overall result. YMMV. That's not to say that the rotors don't see big temps. They still do. I just wonder if the pad does not transfer as much heat to the caliper. And since it lacks the great heat transfer element (copper) like the HP1000, that makes alot of sense.

Another issue that myself and some buddies also with the BCDs have found is a lack of pad choices. The front pad is either a D1395 or 8091 pad shape. I have a set of Porterfield R4-S street and autoX pads in the proper shape but these are not a track pad. But since the heat capacity and cooling of these brakes are so good, they might work on track.

There is also the choice of running the HP1000 ZL1 pads on the front, but the pad annulus is shorter. Word is Brembo tested this combo and did not have acceptable results.

The rear BCD brakes are essentially the same as what comes on the HP1000 ZL1 setup. Pad selection is wide.

Since the heat capacity is so good, on an SS 1LE, I might not need a race pad. A race pad may never get hot enough to go into adherent friction mode. So it would be in abrasive friction mode and it may quickly wear out a set of rotors.

[Firecaptain]

FWIW..until I see data.....IMO....the Californistan copper free soy brakes are no better at stopping than the standard brakes.......

[cdb95z28]

Originally Posted by Firecaptain

FWIW..until I see data.....IMO....the Californistan copper free soy brakes are no better at stopping than the standard brakes.......

Fair enough, but as far as road course track use, most drivers care about how a system slows a car. Repeatedly with no heat issues.

As I mentioned above, I cannot compare them to the typical HP1000 setup as I ran a Gen5 SS 1LE with Raybestos ST43 pads and the Brembo 370mm 6 pistons. Comparing my braking point from that car to the Gen6 on BCDs, I am close to the same braking point and the car slows enough. There are other variables in play with an initial braking point, tires, driver confident, etc. It is possible I do not need to use as much brake meaning I could brake later. That pertains to both the current car and my Gen5.

[Checkmate1]

I keep hearing the 992 GT3 owners complaining about how their braking performance is not the same since they moved to copper free pads for stock steel brakes and PCCBs.

Thank you California....UGH!!!

[Tay]

Originally Posted by cdb95z28

I'm not sure you can change your order after it's already been accepted.

Rockauto has the pads in stock and dealers everywhere can get them.

I have more street and track time with them on my '22 SS 1LE. I initially complained about the initial bite and softness of these pads. But then I did my first flush/bleed. I had air come out of the RF caliper. This was there from the factory. So upon getting the system flushed and bled out and after having run some track days, I can say that the copper free option has lots of braking power. Yes, even after the air discovery, I still would like a little bit more initial bite and a little bit of stiffer pedal. But it improved to a point that the feel does not even capture my thoughts like it first did. But once you really get into these brakes they do offer some great power. The pads wear fast but I cannot compare how the wear rate is to the HP1000 pad. Maybe the wear rate is on par with the HP1000s

Also, the heat capacity of the BCD system on my OE 455HP SS 1LE is massive. I put heat temp stickers on my calipers and I had 240*F max on the fronts after a full AutoInterests track day at Pitt Race. Lots of variables dictate the overall result. YMMV. That's not to say that the rotors don't see big temps. They still do. I just wonder if the pad does not transfer as much heat to the caliper. And since it lacks the great heat transfer element (copper) like the HP1000, that makes alot of sense.

Another issue that myself and some buddies also with the BCDs have found is a lack of pad choices. The front pad is either a D1395 or 8091 pad shape. I have a set of Porterfield R4-S street and autoX pads in the proper shape but these are not a track pad. But since the heat capacity and cooling of these brakes are so good, they might work on track.

There is also the choice of running the HP1000 ZL1 pads on the front, but the pad annulus is shorter. Word is Brembo tested this combo and did not have acceptable results.

The rear BCD brakes are essentially the same as what comes on the HP1000 ZL1 setup. Pad selection is wide.

Since the heat capacity is so good, on an SS 1LE, I might not need a race pad. A race pad may never get hot enough to go into adherent friction mode. So it would be in abrasive friction mode and it may quickly wear out a set of rotors.

Are you saying that both D1395 and 8091 will work or that its either one or the other and not confirmed?

[cdb95z28]

Originally Posted by Tay

Are you saying that both D1395 and 8091 will work or that its either one or the other and not confirmed?

I bought Porterfield R4-S D1395's and they are very close to the OE shape. About 1mm less on the material annulus measurement. I haven't run them yet. They are the street/autox version of their R4 race pad.
https://porterfield-brakes.com/produ...s/ap1395-r4-s/

The 8091 is a # that at least Pagid uses and it looks to be the absolute match to the BCD. I have not seen that # used anywhere else but Pagid. Pagid does not have the D1395 shape on their website. There are a set of 8091's for sale here on the forums in the RSL1 and RSL29 material.
https://www.pagidracing.com/en/produ...hape-8091.html

Both shapes are usually used on GM and other manufacturer carbon ceramic matrix systems.


At this point I do not know if the D1395 is a perfect cross to the 8091. The small annulus difference is why I cannot say with confidence. FMSI is the brake industry standards organization. OE suppliers and aftermarket brake manufacturers are part of it. Their catalogs also have a second # associated with the backing plate #. This second # relates to the material shape. For example, the 2014-15 Z/28 is a D1395-8503.

The MY 2022 catalog is not available to the public. This could be one way we can confirm the BCD pad shape #. I reached out to FMSI and they couldn't give me the BCD info.

[Mac7504]

Originally Posted by Checkmate1

I keep hearing the 992 GT3 owners complaining about how their braking performance is not the same since they moved to copper free pads for stock steel brakes and PCCBs.

Thank you California....UGH!!!

Don't forget Washington

[cdb95z28]

Originally Posted by Checkmate1

I keep hearing the 992 GT3 owners complaining about how their braking performance is not the same since they moved to copper free pads for stock steel brakes and PCCBs.

Thank you California....UGH!!!

I wonder if it was just a pad change with no other changes to the system. GM in part increased the rotor diameter to help with the brake torque. A larger diameter rotor with the caliper further from the axle centerline will create more brake torque.

[Tay]

Originally Posted by cdb95z28

I bought Porterfield R4-S D1395's and they are very close to the OE shape. About 1mm less on the material annulus measurement. I haven't run them yet. They are the street/autox version of their R4 race pad.
https://porterfield-brakes.com/produ...s/ap1395-r4-s/

The 8091 is a # that at least Pagid uses and it looks to be the absolute match to the BCD. I have not seen that # used anywhere else but Pagid. Pagid does not have the D1395 shape on their website. There are a set of 8091's for sale here on the forums in the RSL1 and RSL29 material.
https://www.pagidracing.com/en/produ...hape-8091.html

Both shapes are usually used on GM and other manufacturer carbon ceramic matrix systems.


At this point I do not know if the D1395 is a perfect cross to the 8091. The small annulus difference is why I cannot say with confidence. FMSI is the brake industry standards organization. OE suppliers and aftermarket brake manufacturers are part of it. Their catalogs also have a second # associated with the backing plate #. This second # relates to the material shape. For example, the 2014-15 Z/28 is a D1395-8503.

The MY 2022 catalog is not available to the public. This could be one way we can confirm the BCD pad shape #. I reached out to FMSI and they couldn't give me the BCD info.

Wonderful.

Thank you so much for information.

[LateBrakeU2]

Originally Posted by Firecaptain

FWIW..until I see data.....IMO....the Californistan copper free soy brakes are no better at stopping than the standard brakes.......

I think they give you less. This was an anamoly for the SS1LE guys as GM got caught out with the two states mandating them and they just opted to upgrade to the top shelf hardware. What a gift and in short time will be seen as a rare gift for the SS crowd fitted with them.