[Ehuerta]

Originally Posted by Nicul15

Escalate to GM.

GM can not force the dealer to pay back the money, I had a similar issue and was told to work it out with the dealer. Even though these cars are bad ass, I wold gladly sell them mine back and pay for mileage driven! too many issues with the 1LE.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by PinHead

+1

How many other comparative HI PO Cars look like this at time of delivery?

GM should Retrofit these corroded parts, INCLUDING THE ALUMINUM BLOCK (if signs of corrosion are present).

THIS IS A DESIGN/MANUFACTURING FLAW..... DUE TO COST CUTTING.

I was just at an auto show....and I made sure to keep my eyes open for this in particular because I was curious.

And literally every manufacturer had an example on the floor where the aluminum was at least corroded lightly on the surface.

BMW, Jag, Ford, Kia, Honda, etc....at least one car from each manufacturer had one part that was like this. Some worse than others. Many of the FWD cars there even had ORANGE (not dark red), but bright-ORANGE rusted exhaust manifolds. I've got some pictures, if you want.

I am usually very middle-of-the-road on these things, mindful of folks' differing opinions...but I'm sorry; after walking around that show, I'm convinced you guys are making an issue out of nothing with this one...this is not a design flaw...it's raw, unfinished aluminum. You may not like it, but it's what it does.

[closs2sx]

Traveling show cars are not new cars

my car has now been built and sitting in a parking lot for 3 weeks. If they cant deliver them in a timely manner they shouldn't build them.
I sent an email to Customer service and got a response back. I ordered my car and the dealer did not have an allocation yet but was getting one and they told me you wont see this car until may (which still may be true due to GM's lack of being able to ship in a timely manner). The response from the Rep was you are lucky we did you a favor and pulled a non allocated sold order in to fill production slots. I responded you did me no such favor as now my car is built and sitting outside in bad weather and you can't even ship it in a timely manner. Furthermore it will now take a salt bath being shipped and I had to jump through hoops financially due to it being sooner than expected (fortunately I can). Works for GM not me. I have never had a new car purchase go smoothly through GM period. Its not the dealers fault its GM's Failure. I told them if the car comes in with oxidation I will refuse it and move on. At this point the joy of buying a new car bubble has deflated. I am already disgusted with the car and it hasn't even shipped yet. He did say to work with the dealer and be present when it arrives and have the dealer reject it if there are issues I plan to do so if there are issues.

[travislambert]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

I was just at an auto show....and I made sure to keep my eyes open for this in particular because I was curious.

And literally every manufacturer had an example on the floor where the aluminum was at least corroded lightly on the surface.

BMW, Jag, Ford, Kia, Honda, etc....at least one car from each manufacturer had one part that was like this. Some worse than others. Many of the FWD cars there even had ORANGE (not dark red), but bright-ORANGE rusted exhaust manifolds. I've got some pictures, if you want.

I am usually very middle-of-the-road on these things, mindful of folks' differing opinions...but I'm sorry; after walking around that show, I'm convinced you guys are making an issue out of nothing with this one...this is not a design flaw...it's raw, unfinished aluminum. You may not like it, but it's what it does.

Not many cars at the Detroit show had their hoods up. I just flipped through my 500+ pictures, but only a few were of engine compartments. Out of those, I didn't find a single car with what I'd consider bad oxidation. Most were what I'd call perfect/excellent, and I only found one with any visible oxidation (not bad though).

I respectfully disagree with the "it's what it does" comment. If this were true, all cars would do it. It's what it can do when exposed to the elements, but not necessarily what it does automatically. I'd give any manufacturer a pass on light oxidation, but when there's pitting on a brand new car that's where I have to draw the line. As long as there are cars available without heavy oxidation, that's where I'll be spending my money.

Of course, we've been back and forth on this before. We'll probably always have different opinions and that's okay.

[PinHead]

Originally Posted by Ehuerta

GM can not force the dealer to pay back the money, I had a similar issue and was told to work it out with the dealer. Even though these cars are bad ass, I wold gladly sell them mine back and pay for mileage driven! too many issues with the 1LE.

I'm awaiting delivery of a ZL1 1LE, but am on the fence due to the unresolved BOG issue.

Care to share a list of your issues?

Thank you

[PinHead]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

I'm convinced you guys are making an issue out of nothing with this one...this is not a design flaw...it's raw, unfinished aluminum. You may not like it, but it's what it does.

I'm glad you don't care about sub-standard NEW Parts, but when I spend $80K USD I expect all parts to be in NEW UN-CORRODED Condition.

Aluminum Corrodes Only when EXPOSED TO A CORROSIVE ENVIRONMENT.

I've worked on Marine Engines that are used in Salt Water that DO NOT HAVE THE CORROSION DEMONSTRATED ON NEW DELIVERED GEN6 CARS because THE MARINE ENGINES USE THE CORRECT FINISHES.

GM IS BEING CHEAP...PERIOD!

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by travislambert

Of course, we've been back and forth on this before. We'll probably always have different opinions and that's okay.

Probably, and yes it is - no hard feelings here.

Originally Posted by PinHead

I'm glad you don't care about sub-standard NEW Parts, but when I spend $80K USD I expect all parts to be in NEW UN-CORRODED Condition.

Aluminum Corrodes Only when EXPOSED TO A CORROSIVE ENVIRONMENT.

I've worked on Marine Engines that are used in Salt Water that DO NOT HAVE THE CORROSION DEMONSTRATED ON NEW DELIVERED GEN6 CARS because THE MARINE ENGINES USE THE CORRECT FINISHES.

GM IS BEING CHEAP...PERIOD!

Maybe...maybe not. There's no period there you can place definitively...you're just upset.

I also work in the marine Industry; I've had my master-level merchant mariner credential for over 6 years, now...Been sailing ships with tiny diesels, turbo-Fiat cats, Mercury outboards, etc...at the helm, in the engine room and/or bilges...the marine world is a totally different animal, and equipment is far better maintained for obvious reasons. You can't expect a car manufacturer to build a car like a boat.

Depending on the purity of aluminum, it will patina and corrode readily when exposed to nothing more than moisture and the air itself. A "corrosive environment" is not required. This is not aircraft-grade 6061 we're talking about. That'd be ridiculous. Perhaps GM could look at the alloys they use? But then, like I said - so would everyone else...this is not a "GM" issue.

And it's not that I don't care about substandard parts. Please don't put words in my mouth...I just don't find an issue with a patina on the finish on a non-aesthetic part when it doesn't affect the structure or function at all. Pitting? Flaking? Yes...that's not right. But 90% of what people are bringing up in here is not that.

And furthermore, I realize that this oxide will occur in time no matter what you do. So while I get the "I want it shiny and new" argument...it's either now or later - and these cars are so damn fun to drive, I just don't feel like waiting!

[PinHead]

Its also VERY interesting that GM Customer Care has responded to other posts on this Forum BUT IGNORES MR. LAMBERT and this post.

Way to go GM Customer Care(Insert Sarcasm)

[Stig eh]

Originally Posted by PinHead

I'm glad you don't care about sub-standard NEW Parts, but when I spend $80K USD I expect all parts to be in NEW UN-CORRODED Condition.

Aluminum Corrodes Only when EXPOSED TO A CORROSIVE ENVIRONMENT.

I've worked on Marine Engines that are used in Salt Water that DO NOT HAVE THE CORROSION DEMONSTRATED ON NEW DELIVERED GEN6 CARS because THE MARINE ENGINES USE THE CORRECT FINISHES.

GM IS BEING CHEAP...PERIOD!

winner winner chicken dinner

you are so right

corrosion is BS on a new car been happening for 2 decades or more



stig eh

[redman]

Chemistry 101.
Aluminium corrosion resistance is very good in untreated aluminium. Untreated aluminium has very good corrosion resistance in most environments. This is primarily because aluminium spontaneously forms a thin but effective oxide layer that prevents further oxidation.
Aluminium oxide is impermeable and, unlike the oxide layers on many other metals, it adheres strongly to the parent metal. If damaged mechanically, aluminium’s oxide layer repairs itself immediately.
This oxide layer is one of the main reasons for aluminium’s good corrosion properties. The layer is stable in the general pH range 4 – 9.

[Sooner Cole]

Originally Posted by travislambert

I attempted to purchase a 2018 Chevrolet Camaro ZL1 1LE from Priority Chevrolet in Chesapeake VA. The car had been previously ordered for dealer stock, but had not yet arrived to the dealership. I gave $1,000 as a good faith deposit for the car, but I wasn’t asked to sign any agreements. I was led to believe the car was “overdue” for delivery, and should be arriving soon. Prior to the deposit I expressed concerns about aluminum oxidation on the car. My concerns continued to increase as time elapsed while waiting for the car to be delivered, and I was very open about those concerns.

About 2 months after production, the car finally arrived. There was no mention of any potential issues with the car. The dealership is located about 8 hours away from my home (~6.5 if not pulling a car trailer), and I made this drive while towing my 2017 ZL1 I intended to trade. Immediately after seeing the car it was obvious the time it had been exposed to the Michigan winter had taken its toll. I politely asked for my deposit to be returned. The dealership not only refused to return my deposit, they immediately became rude and refused to acknowledge any point I was trying to make. They quickly told me that if I wasn’t going to buy the car I needed to leave the property. I tried several times to reason with the manager, but he just kept repeating “we’re keeping the deposit” and “you need to leave the property”. So, I started my 8 hour journey back home.

I have every phone conversation recorded (perfectly legal in WV and VA). I plan to post them at some point, but I haven't had time to redact credit card #s, etc. from the conversations.

This is a recording I captured the following day while speaking with the sales manager, Shaun House.


Here is a document I am compiling to turn over to an attorney. Normally I wouldn't post this, but this issue is so cut and dry the dealership literally has zero chance of keeping the deposit. In VA, if it's for more than $500, it pretty much has to be in writing and signed. There are few exceptions, but none apply here. We have nothing in writing, so none of details about the car's condition even matter.

Attachment 913603 (At least take a peek at the document.)

Attachment 912469

These pictures are comparing the "brand new" 2018 ZL1 1LE to my 1 year old ZL1. (I absolutely did not retouch either photo, both are exactly as they were taken. I even purposely left the dust on my car to show that I didn't attempt to clean it in any way.)

Attachment 912487

Oh, and don't worry, I'll get my deposit back. I have a dispute filed with my CC. I can't see how that won't work out considering I didn't sign anything. If that doesn't work, I'll hire an attorney. I don't care what it cost me. These sleazeballs aren't getting a dime of my money.

subed