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Old 05-02-2019, 05:34 PM   #141
cellsafemode


 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazerbrainz2k3 View Post
"The general public" doesn't care about any of the above, one way or another. Making a big section of the front match color with the rest of it as opposed to having a contrasting gloss black section instead s probably by far the most noticeable difference between one Camaro version and another since the 5th gen was refreshed, and the general public still doesn't care. They almost certainly aren't using the paddle shifters at all, and either way wouldn't see what delay there is as "insane" or anything other than normal.

You seem to be projecting priorities of enthusiasts (who do notice, and do care) onto the general public which does not.

The general public does on occasion read car reviews, from which they get opinions about these cars which sometimes defy objective reality ("you can't see out of it!", as opposed to, visibility is relatively restricted but you can still see everything you need to to operate it safely), so if the general opinion of the refreshed 6th gen changes from the common idea that it's ugly we may see more sales - this remains to be seen. So there can be some value in this change, other than a return to a more traditional Chevrolet (and since the 5th gen, Chevrolet Camaro) front end.

i'm separating out the people of this forum who notice every little thing that's different from the general car public ..which includes the reviewers who will make statements such as "the front end looks ugly" or "the 5th gen is too similar to the 6th" etc.

I dont think if someone looked at those reviews of the 2019 that said it was ugly and then looked at the 2020 car ...that they'd see a real difference. I dont think the reviewers will honestly say it's much different either.

It's visually a bit more appealing, but the people who got really butt hurt over the 2019 are still going to be butt hurt over the 2020 because it's still mostly got the same problems. the front end is too angry looking and got too many angles and fangs and corners.

The reviewers however, if they did have paddle shifters that were useful make make that very known, and even though the general public would probably hardly ever use them, they would respond to the fact that their car had paddle shifters that worked as it sets them apart from all other automatics and is something you only see in sports cars with dual clutch transmissions, etc. It's something they'd brag about or be sold on.

The interior issues would similarly be a huge departure from existing models.

If you can't or have no plan to fix the main issues the public has with the car like size, visibility, rear seats or trunk opening... .then you should try and improve the other things that dont alter the car substantially manufacturing-wise but vastly improve the quality of life. Like interior plastics, gauge area, shifting (for auto's), hand-brake functionality, and the plastic parts they slap on the outside that greatly impact the perception of the car. Classing the car up a bit would go a long way to improving ownership numbers without compromising the performance.

edit: and full disclosure, I'd never buy a new one unless my current one got hit by someone and totalled not because I dont like how the camaro looks or dont like how the 2020 looks, but because I dont want to waste my money by buying a new car every couple years. Chevy doesn't have to worry about selling me a camaro - i'd buy one when the time comes pretty much no matter how it looked. it's the only car i've ever spent money on and i've had multiple generations. But there aren't enough people like me it seems since the numbers keep dropping, so I'm suggesting things that would make it appeal to more than just me. Without alienating people who like it like i do.
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Old 05-02-2019, 06:03 PM   #142
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Originally Posted by Camaro_QC View Post
I wonder what the price of the base model V8 will be in Canada.

45k$ CAD was out of my budget but if it comes closer to the 35k, it will be something I might look for.
It won't be 35k. The V6 starts at 33k. The LT1 will probably be around 41 or 42 grand



Quote:
Originally Posted by cellsafemode View Post
i dont get how they paint the center section and moved the bow tie and somehow that makes the entire front end go from what was apparently universally hated to "amazing and awesome"

It looks the same as 2019 to me. It's going to look the same to anyone else considering most people can't even tell the difference between the 5th gen and 6th gen. If you thought 2019 didn't look good, then there wont be much widespread difference with your opinion of the 2020.
Details make a difference.
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Old 05-02-2019, 06:12 PM   #143
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Do I see brembos?
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Old 05-02-2019, 06:16 PM   #144
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Not gonna lie. I like my 2019 SS better. At least I have a somewhat rare model year now
I'm with you....like mine better, and now 2019 SS models will be a one year production.
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Old 05-02-2019, 06:31 PM   #145
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Originally Posted by lt4camaro View Post
The best news for sure for Camaro and its way overdue.. The ugly 2019 SS front facia and bowtie GONE..., A LT1 powered 1LT base car and the 10 speed auto trans with everything including the sweet 3.6 V6. Gotta love it, I sure do and there will be a 2020 Camaro in my garage soon. This is what Camaro should have done with the 2019 refresh.
Great changes by Chevy. I passed on an SS because with a minimum $10K price increase over the V6, and 40% higher operating cost (20% less mpg and 20% more for premium every fill-up), it just wasn't worth a second less 0-60 than the RS. It took a while for me to find an RS with as few options as possible. Mine has the RS package, V6 with A8, block heater and sunroof.

Camaros are bought for the performance and the styling, so there should be choice on the nice-to-have stuff. Chevy is finally getting the message.
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Old 05-02-2019, 07:04 PM   #146
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Now they just need to bring back Hyper Blue Metallic.
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Old 05-02-2019, 07:05 PM   #147
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Originally Posted by Emoto View Post
WOW! That makes it a much more substantial difference over the direct competitors. Way to go, Chevrolet!
It all depends on if it can run with that base Mustang GT. All Season tires and base brakes from an LT will degrade performance from an SS, it’s a matter of how much and does it still beat the Mustang.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RealG View Post
I agree ,
But Go back and re-read some threads. I was one suggested a low cost v8 and was told with absolute authority by people here that GM could not do that it was impossible for a variety of reasons and also wouldn’t sell anyway and Chevrolet would not be stupid enough to do such a thing. Also go back and read where people said general motors would not change for 2020 that we were all wasting our time hoping for that. No no there is plenty of people who if they’re being honest, are very very surprised by these changes. People with open minds and forward thinking no they’re not surprised by this at all.
I openly admit I didn’t expect this much change. Of course the front really was a no brained based on the SEMA car. The V8 in an LT? Frankly it’s a desperate move to increase sale ps from pathetic. GM May sell more cars but an LT1 will be less profitable than an SS. But maybe they sell a crap load of them and as they say, make it up in volume.

I’m not surprised by the changes as it is simply adding more combinations of existing parts. Not really a big deal. The biggest change is the front fascia as that was an actual change to tooling.

But you are coming across negatively. Good on ya for predicting a bigger change than I expected. But you seem to be negative because I expected less?

Quote:
Originally Posted by cellsafemode View Post
I think you're overestimating how much those visual changes are noticeable.

When the general public can't tell the difference from a 5th gen to a 6th and the changes are much more significant than moving the bowtie a few inches and changing the color of the center beam to be body colored .... these wont make a difference in your opinion if you thought the 2019 looked ugly.

the 10 speed vs the 8 speed isn't going to make a difference unless the 10 speed can do something that the 8speed can't. Can we finally use the paddle shifters without insane delay? if not then the general public isn't going to care between 2019 and earlier and 2020.


Homelink? who cares. Wireless charging? you plug it in for android auto anyway. Nobody has enabled wireless android auto yet. and the placement and size of the wireless charging solution they did come up with initially is inconvenient for passenger devices and unusable for most current gen phones.

I think it's also kinda funny that they put non-runflat all seasons on the lower trims when most people switch to those types of tires first chance they get because it's a daily driver. Runflat summer high performance tires are a great way to see you crashed off the side of a highway while on the way to work.

I'd have liked to see a performance electric hybrid option, drop the V6 as it's price point overlaps too much between the lower V8

I'd have preferred to see a totally different front fascia with less aggressiveness. The camaro doesn't need to look aggressive when it is aggressive ...in pretty much any format it comes in. It bends the perception to being a car driven by immature men more than it needs to be.


And i'd have liked to see all the stupid pretend analog gauges in the dash replaced by a lcd screen that just spans the entire gauge area. With customizable themes you can set and which would adjust based on night/day and ambient lighting pkg automatically.

Either that or a switch from the crap interior plastic to something that doesn't vibrate everywhere whenever you listen to music.
Home link is important to me, not you. Don’t expect because you don’t care no one else does.

You will see a performance hybrid......someday. Just not in a very minor year after the minor.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertAvitia View Post
Do I see brembos?
I doubt it. We can hope but as I read it it’s a V8 in an LT. To cut the price several grand over an SS has to mean it’s an LT chasiss including brakes. But love the optimism.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frankie18SS View Post
Exactly! I have no doubt GM will disappoint me and completely fail to advertise these cars! Dodge has Challengers doing gratuitous burnouts and GM has "real people" discussing the Malibu styling and switching brands for reliability.

It's sad that this forum got so excited to see a Camaro commercial finally showcasing performance only to find out it was an overseas commercial because, of course it was. GM is going out of their way to NOT advertise the Camaro. Develop a world class sports car and then don't tell anyone about it.
As I’ve tried really hard to point out GM has thus far not advertised because it won’t improve sales enough to pay for the commercial and subsequent air time.

But it wouldn’t surprise me as I’ve pointed out the V8 in an LT is a desperation move. And if they are desperate then maybe they’ll advertise. In just doubt they will. If they do, it will make a lot of people on this site really happy....who already either own one or want one. Issue is does it even remotely move the needle for others? This is now a really tiny market segment and advertising for a bigger share of a fixed market is probably a non-starter from a business perspective.
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Old 05-02-2019, 07:09 PM   #148
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Originally Posted by Lithias View Post
As a 19 2SS owner I feel a little mix of emotions. While I love the styling of my car, I feel that with this new redesign, my car will be looked down upon as an ugly step child even though it now becomes unique. Will it affect my resale value when I trade up later?

I could perhaps do a bumper conversion, but that's a hasle, and I can't even find any videos of someone taking apart the 19 front bumper so I could at least see what I'd be up against.

So in the end, I love my car but I'm super disappointed in Chevy for not sticking to there guns and caving to people, who let's be honest, probably wouldn't have bought an SS to begin with.

Guess I'll enjoy my whole 2 extra cubic inches of air flow from the flow tie. I'll just wait for the C8 hype to die down and order one of those in a couple years.....

I get what you're saying. But you liked it enough to buy it! That's worth something. Initially with the 2020 news, i was kinda pissed. But i saw enough 18's 19's next to each other at the dealer, that i came to the conclusion i like them both with a slight preference to the 19's in certain colors. And also thought if the SEMA front end was true... i would like it better, but the 19 is still good


I got to say, while everyone seems to have a preference in which front end they like, i find the radically emotional opinions a little weird. It's like you've found this awesome gal* with all the physical attributes that turn you on (huge pair of cylinder banks for example), and then you reject her because you don't like what she did with her hair.


*sorry i wasn't more inclusive here... but i'm tired
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Old 05-02-2019, 07:18 PM   #149
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That new lt1 model is nice. I prefer the looks of it to the ss.
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Old 05-02-2019, 07:29 PM   #150
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Looks great to me.
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Old 05-02-2019, 07:35 PM   #151
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Originally Posted by Hops View Post
I get what you're saying. But you liked it enough to buy it! That's worth something. Initially with the 2020 news, i was kinda pissed. But i saw enough 18's 19's next to each other at the dealer, that i came to the conclusion i like them both with a slight preference to the 19's in certain colors. And also thought if the SEMA front end was true... i would like it better, but the 19 is still good


I got to say, while everyone seems to have a preference in which front end they like, i find the radically emotional opinions a little weird. It's like you've found this awesome gal* with all the physical attributes that turn you on (huge pair of cylinder banks for example), and then you reject her because you don't like what she did with her hair.


*sorry i wasn't more inclusive here... but i'm tired
You are correct. I do love the 2019 look, and I also love the 2020 look. If I had enough money, I'd own both. It would have been better in my opinion to offer the SEMA front end as an LPO option. I'm more worried about my already low expectations on the resale value of this car in 5 to 6 years time. Is my car now worth less because it's the "ugly" year? The idea that the car would be more valuable or sought after is insanity. I think 1SS owners should also be worried.......Its my opinion that GM should have just let model run its course and introduce these changes with Gen 7, or maybe just gotten 2019 right from the beginning.
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Old 05-02-2019, 07:38 PM   #152
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Interesting moves. I kind of like the LT1 idea. Not for me personally, but I can see how many in the market for a V6 due to budget can stretch up to a V8 without having to pay for the SS. I think that’s a smart move and will likely help sales.

The whole front end change is not that big of a deal for me. I had a 16 2SS and loved it. I now have a 19 1SS 1LE and love it. I think the black front bar works with the 1LE package and also works with certain colors on the SS. Most of the complaints are coming from 16-18 SS owners. Sure, the flowtie looks better in the grill but doesn’t move the needle at all on perform, which is what drove me to purchase the car. These styling issues get way over-blown IMO.
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Old 05-02-2019, 07:50 PM   #153
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It is a great thing that Chevy is having more engine package choices for all the buying public and that the seem to correct the mistake they made with the front fascia on the 2019 models. The 2020 corrected fascia appearance is better than the 2019 models but I personally still prefer the 2016-2018 front fascias.

I think the higher mounting location of the LT1 fender emblems might be higher than I would prefer. However, they are an improvement over the standard Camaro fender badge.


It will be interesting to see the price difference between the V6 RS and this entry level V8 package with a MSRP starting at $35k. Will the V6 have a lower MSRP now? There was a lower starting price on the 2019 vs the 2018 models on the V6 models.
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Old 05-02-2019, 07:56 PM   #154
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Not sure why you own a Camaro? You seem to not like them very much. Maybe if you wanted a "less aggresive front fascia" you should go on over to a Ford dealership and check out a Mustang. They may be more of what you require in YOUR car.
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