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Old 08-29-2023, 12:15 PM   #1
ALMN
 
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CarandDriver 2024 Dark Horse Review vs 2019 Camaro SS 1LE

Caranddriver test is out for the manual 2024 Dark Horse. Even with more rubber and power the results are still little shy of the 2019 Camaro SS 1LE manual they tested back in the day. The car also costs $73K
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Old 08-29-2023, 12:33 PM   #2
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While the quarter mile specs are very similar, I have no doubt in my mind the dark horse will be faster around a track and from a roll. It has a decent amount of extra power, like you said extra rubber (front tire size starts with a 3!) and it costs more. Not to mention the Mach 1 was slightly quicker than the 1le.

An area where Ford has always excelled but Chevy has been behind in is giving their handling specialty pony/sports cars a little extra power. Ford gave the boss 302, gt350 and Mach 1 15-100 extra hp. Chevy only gave the z28 extra power while the 1le and grand sport never got any extra power.

A 6th gen ss 1le with an ls7 would have been the best drivers car ever made.
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Old 08-29-2023, 01:03 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by m6-lt1 View Post
While the quarter mile specs are very similar, I have no doubt in my mind the dark horse will be faster around a track and from a roll. It has a decent amount of extra power, like you said extra rubber (front tire size starts with a 3!) and it costs more. Not to mention the Mach 1 was slightly quicker than the 1le.

An area where Ford has always excelled but Chevy has been behind in is giving their handling specialty pony/sports cars a little extra power. Ford gave the boss 302, gt350 and Mach 1 15-100 extra hp. Chevy only gave the z28 extra power while the 1le and grand sport never got any extra power.

A 6th gen ss 1le with an ls7 would have been the best drivers car ever made.
Keep in mind that the Dark Horse is also 200 lbs heavier, so the added weight offsets the power increase. It also has 100 lbs over the Mach 1. It would be interesting to see a 1le vs Dark Horse comparison on a shorter and longer track with straights, manual vs manual or auto vs auto.
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Old 08-29-2023, 03:53 PM   #4
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better mileage from the camaro too, on top of the better performance
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Old 08-29-2023, 06:01 PM   #5
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Honestly, with this being the last time that the two will share a production year (while both being ICE anyway) I'm surprised that we aren't seeing more same day testing between the two. Historical data is great and is still viable, but seeing them both tear up a strip and track against one another is something, at least, I'd like to see before Camaro goes (on hiatus?).
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Old 08-29-2023, 06:45 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by crysalis_01 View Post
Honestly, with this being the last time that the two will share a production year (while both being ICE anyway) I'm surprised that we aren't seeing more same day testing between the two. Historical data is great and is still viable, but seeing them both tear up a strip and track against one another is something, at least, I'd like to see before Camaro goes (on hiatus?).
I'm sure Throttle House will do it. They're big fans of the Camaro platform and in their Dark Horse review even wished it was more like the Camaro. They actually wanted a "Camstang"
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Old 08-29-2023, 08:22 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crysalis_01 View Post
Honestly, with this being the last time that the two will share a production year (while both being ICE anyway) I'm surprised that we aren't seeing more same day testing between the two. Historical data is great and is still viable, but seeing them both tear up a strip and track against one another is something, at least, I'd like to see before Camaro goes (on hiatus?).
For some reason we never had a same day GT350 or Mach 1 against the SS 1LE comparison. Randy Pobst tried one with the Mach 1 but he had a pre refresh SS1LE with some miles an issues on the brakes. It was also an Auto Mach 1 vs Manual 1LE comparison with Mach 1 edging the 1LE 0.4 seconds( i am not sure on the total time). Throttle House did a track review on the GT350 vs M2 and M2 put down better times. Camaro ss 1le put down faster times than that M2 on a different day.

Now the most interesting thing is CarandDriver put down a faster lap time with a Mach 1 ( i am not sure if it was an auto) than a GT350R, again on a different day. Considering that GT350R has beaten Mach 1 in every performance metric, including being 200+ lbs lighter is very interesting. So then what is really going on? Different day lap times, can they really make that much of a difference? I am hoping that Throttle House can do a same day comparison. Even add the same tires on the cars, auto vs auto or manual vs manual. I am guessing longer the straights and with auto, Dark Horse should pull away from the 1LE. But when it comes to cornering, in and out acceleration, braking, SS 1LE has the advantage.
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Old 08-29-2023, 09:47 PM   #8
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For some reason we never had a same day GT350 or Mach 1 against the SS 1LE comparison. Randy Pobst tried one with the Mach 1 but he had a pre refresh SS1LE with some miles an issues on the brakes. It was also an Auto Mach 1 vs Manual 1LE comparison with Mach 1 edging the 1LE 0.4 seconds( i am not sure on the total time). Throttle House did a track review on the GT350 vs M2 and M2 put down better times. Camaro ss 1le put down faster times than that M2 on a different day.

Now the most interesting thing is CarandDriver put down a faster lap time with a Mach 1 ( i am not sure if it was an auto) than a GT350R, again on a different day. Considering that GT350R has beaten Mach 1 in every performance metric, including being 200+ lbs lighter is very interesting. So then what is really going on? Different day lap times, can they really make that much of a difference? I am hoping that Throttle House can do a same day comparison. Even add the same tires on the cars, auto vs auto or manual vs manual. I am guessing longer the straights and with auto, Dark Horse should pull away from the 1LE. But when it comes to cornering, in and out acceleration, braking, SS 1LE has the advantage.
I think part of the reason why the Mach 1 beat the gt350 R was because VIR got repaved after the gt350ís time. That I believe will make a difference.

Look up pro racers take on YouTube. Andy pilgrim would host it and set lap times in cars around NCM. If you look up the leaderboard youíll see the SS 1le is VERY close to the gt350ís time and about 2 second if I am remembering correctly slower than the R. There is a caveat to this however as both the gt350 and R he tested were 2019ís. Ford made some big improvements to the 19 and 20 models. I also believe the VIR time that people are referring to for the gt350 R was for pre 2019 model.

Even though we never got same day testing I have a hunch for the 6th gen cars it goes gt350R>Mach 1>SS 1LE>gt350>PP2>SS>PP1/bullet>LT1>GT
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Old 08-30-2023, 09:59 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m6-lt1 View Post
I think part of the reason why the Mach 1 beat the gt350 R was because VIR got repaved after the gt350ís time. That I believe will make a difference.

Look up pro racers take on YouTube. Andy pilgrim would host it and set lap times in cars around NCM. If you look up the leaderboard youíll see the SS 1le is VERY close to the gt350ís time and about 2 second if I am remembering correctly slower than the R. There is a caveat to this however as both the gt350 and R he tested were 2019ís. Ford made some big improvements to the 19 and 20 models. I also believe the VIR time that people are referring to for the gt350 R was for pre 2019 model.

Even though we never got same day testing I have a hunch for the 6th gen cars it goes gt350R>Mach 1>SS 1LE>gt350>PP2>SS>PP1/bullet>LT1>GT
Naah, i think on the same tire auto vs auto or manual vs manual gt350r > ss 1le > mach 1, unless the road coarse has a very long straight that mach 1 is taking advantage on that. If you look at Throttle House Lap Times, ss 1le has even faster time than a GT500 without the CFTP. Now Dark Horse, same day comparison would be amazing. I am hoping for Throttle House to do that comparison. They can even add a Nissan Z Nismo into the mix as well.
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Old 08-30-2023, 10:25 AM   #10
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for those who aren't able to get a 1LE, but want a new car, the dark horse seems like an okay alternative. I wonder if Ford doesn't allow mags to run the dark horse in a comparison test against the 1LE .
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Old 08-30-2023, 11:19 AM   #11
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Even IF that were the case, there are multiple reviewer channels/publications out there that don't rely strictly on manufacturer supplied vehicles, using either vehicles they get from local dealers, purchase themselves, or even get from viewers/fans. It just strikes me as odd that these obvious comparisons, of all kinds of makes/models, don't happen.
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Old 08-30-2023, 12:11 PM   #12
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$73k is more than I paid for my ZL1
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Old 08-30-2023, 01:13 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m6-lt1 View Post
While the quarter mile specs are very similar, I have no doubt in my mind the dark horse will be faster around a track and from a roll. It has a decent amount of extra power, like you said extra rubber (front tire size starts with a 3!) and it costs more. Not to mention the Mach 1 was slightly quicker than the 1le.

An area where Ford has always excelled but Chevy has been behind in is giving their handling specialty pony/sports cars a little extra power. Ford gave the boss 302, gt350 and Mach 1 15-100 extra hp. Chevy only gave the z28 extra power while the 1le and grand sport never got any extra power.

A 6th gen ss 1le with an ls7 would have been the best drivers car ever made.
This.
Scream it from the rooftops my friend.
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Old 08-30-2023, 01:57 PM   #14
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A 6th gen ss 1le with an ls7 would have been the best drivers car ever made.
I'd rather see a ZL1 with an LT5.
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