[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by Idaho2018GTPremium

Ha, why do you have to say "almost" 4 and "almost" 6, when it is simply 3 and 5? I mean, just look at the model years and be honest.

If Ford was only concerned with straight line, they wouldn't be offering a big CF wing on the car and talking about how many pounds of downforce it produces. It will be an all-around performer, like the ZL1, but faster.

Refer to your criticism of me...and now, just a few hours later you're doing the exact same thing. If you're gonna criticize me about doing or saying something, then make sure you're not doing and saying the same thing.

Now that that's been said...

GM took a 1 year break from the ZL1 which technically they didn't need to. They probably didn't want ZL1 sales to inhibit SS sales. But nonetheless, the ZL1 was gone for 1 year, 2016. However there was none of this waiting bullshit like Ford put on. We knew it was getting the LT4. It was just a matter of if the output would be 630, 640, or 650 like the Z06. And then they announced it and the MSRP and it went out to dealerships. Ford sat around for well over 5 years making people wait. Playing dumb games like leaking pics of a blower and brakes with someone's hand next to it. Then they had to push it back from 2019 to 2020. Then they made people wait over 6 months to announce the HP. Then the day before they did that they made some stupid comment about "more HP per..." which to me was them trying to mitigate any disappointment that it would not be as high as one would expect from them making everyone wait this long. And after all that, still no MSRP. This is like being in highschool and dating the chick who ain't even all that good looking to begin with but wants to make you wait an eternity and plays all these stupid games before she finally gives it up and it turns out to not even be what you thought it would be. LOL!!

It won't be an all-around performer like the ZL1 because it's price is going to put it well above the performance value. And then there will be markups. Which will put it out of reach of the ones who will be bragging about it. It will likely be priced like the Redeye where the stripped down base model will be low $70K but then every little option will add an extra $2K or more and inflate the price to where even a moderately optioned version will be somewhere in the high $80K to mid $90K range. Similarly optioned against a fully loaded ZL1 and that thing is gonna be priced sky high whereas the ZL1 will still be under $70K. So will the price be worth it? Doubt it.

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by shaffe

I know it is lol. I had a big response typed out to you and some others and just said you know what its the same old discussion we have had before lol.

But since you brought me back in lol

Why do you think it has no chance against the RE? From what I have seen in C&D and Motortrend they haven't come close to the 10.8 that dodge claims. IIRC they both got 11.8s with the RE.

The RE was not 11.8, lol!! Even the standard Hellcat in WB trim has been doing much better than that. TheWB HC ran a 10.9 for the 2018 MYs. The RE is even faster. Plus the Hellcat family is on a chassis and setup dedicated specifically for straight line performance. Building an all around setup like the GT500 with less HP and similar weight is going to put them behind the HC and RE. If they had focused on taking out the RE, then they could have. And likewise, if they had focused on taking out the ZLE, then they could have. But no way it will do both. Not on a chassis that is inferior to the RE in a straight line and inferior to the 6th Gen Camaro chassis.

[DevilsReject97]

Originally Posted by shaffe

You are switching between model year and year it debuted

the GT500 is coming out as MY2020 That would make it 3 model years from ZL1 and 5 model years from hellcat.

The GT500 is coming out in MY2020..

The ZL1 came out in MY 2017. MY2018, MY2019, and MY2020. That's FOUR..not three...

And thats still with GM holding back the ZL1 from 2016...

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by DevilsReject97

The GT500 is coming out in MY2020..

The ZL1 came out in MY 2017. MY2018, MY2019, and MY2020. That's FOUR..not three...

And thats still with GM holding back the ZL1 from 2016...

He was using Mustang math which is a derivative of Ricer Math.

[Idaho2018GTPremium]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

Refer to your criticism of me...and now, just a few hours later you're doing the exact same thing. If you're gonna criticize me about doing or saying something, then make sure you're not doing and saying the same thing.

Now that that's been said...

GM took a 1 year break from the ZL1 which technically they didn't need to. They probably didn't want ZL1 sales to inhibit SS sales. But nonetheless, the ZL1 was gone for 1 year, 2016. However there was none of this waiting bullshit like Ford put on. We knew it was getting the LT4. It was just a matter of if the output would be 630, 640, or 650 like the Z06. And then they announced it and the MSRP and it went out to dealerships. Ford sat around for well over 5 years making people wait. Playing dumb games like leaking pics of a blower and brakes with someone's hand next to it. Then they had to push it back from 2019 to 2020. Then they made people wait over 6 months to announce the HP. Then the day before they did that they made some stupid comment about "more HP per..." which to me was them trying to mitigate any disappointment that it would not be as high as one would expect from them making everyone wait this long. And after all that, still no MSRP. This is like being in highschool and dating the chick who ain't even all that good looking to begin with but wants to make you wait an eternity and plays all these stupid games before she finally gives it up and it turns out to not even be what you thought it would be. LOL!!

It won't be an all-around performer like the ZL1 because it's price is going to put it well above the performance value. And then there will be markups. Which will put it out of reach of the ones who will be bragging about it. It will likely be priced like the Redeye where the stripped down base model will be low $70K but then every little option will add an extra $2K or more and inflate the price to where even a moderately optioned version will be somewhere in the high $80K to mid $90K range. Similarly optioned against a fully loaded ZL1 and that thing is gonna be priced sky high whereas the ZL1 will still be under $70K. So will the price be worth it? Doubt it.

I have no idea what you're talking about. My comments to you this time around were the fact that you pretend that 760 hp isn't impressive, even though it is more powerful than the most powerful car GM ever produced which just came out in 2019. It's not like hp is this unlimited thing that can just be given out without regard to money and emissions. And...hp/liter is a thing. Car companies and magazines use it all the time when talking about the power an engine makes. I use it, my car friends talk about it at times.

I have no problem with speculation, so me speculating that the GT500 will be faster than the ZL1 is fine. And you speculating the opposite doesn't bother me.

Ford has stated that they are constantly tweaking the engine until it was to be certified. They did the same thing with the last GT500 and were able to tweak more power out of it because of it. So, waiting on the hp had an actual reason, not just to string people along. I do believe they need to get on with announcing the weight and MSRP now that the engine is finalized. I'm guessing they could have included those values with the hp announcement. hp and price is what gets the most attention to most people. Weight is secondary to most. Obviously, because the Hellcat still sells (4500 lbs!).

[Idaho2018GTPremium]

Originally Posted by DevilsReject97

The GT500 is coming out in MY2020..

The ZL1 came out in MY 2017. MY2018, MY2019, and MY2020. That's FOUR..not three...

And thats still with GM holding back the ZL1 from 2016...

Last I checked, 2020 minus 2017 is 3 years.

Also, 2020 minus 2015 (Hellcat) is 5 years.

Math

[Idaho2018GTPremium]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

The RE was not 11.8, lol!! Even the standard Hellcat in WB trim has been doing much better than that. TheWB HC ran a 10.9 for the 2018 MYs. The RE is even faster. Plus the Hellcat family is on a chassis and setup dedicated specifically for straight line performance. Building an all around setup like the GT500 with less HP and similar weight is going to put them behind the HC and RE. If they had focused on taking out the RE, then they could have. And likewise, if they had focused on taking out the ZLE, then they could have. But no way it will do both. Not on a chassis that is inferior to the RE in a straight line and inferior to the 6th Gen Camaro chassis.

Well, according to C&D the Hellcat RE widebody was 11.8 @ 125 mph. I don't remember what MT tested. Obviously, it is traction limited on street tires. Just like a lot of powerful cars.

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...e-first-drive/

[13vertss]

Originally Posted by Idaho2018GTPremium

Last I checked, 2020 minus 2017 is 3 years.

Also, 2020 minus 2015 (Hellcat) is 5 years.

Math

2017 zl1, 2018 zl1, 2019 zl1, 2020 zl1 which is 4th model year out when gt500 first model year comes in.

[Idaho2018GTPremium]

Originally Posted by 13vertss

2017 zl1, 2018 zl1, 2019 zl1, 2020 zl1 which is 4th model year out when gt500 first model year comes in.

Oh my. The GT500 literally is coming out 3 years after the 6th Gen ZL1. I don't know how you or anyone could dispute that. 2020 is 3 years past 2017. There were 3 MYs of the ZL1 before the GT500. You don't count the '20 ZL1 because it is the same year as the GT500.

[13vertss]

Originally Posted by Idaho2018GTPremium

Oh my. The GT500 literally is coming out 3 years after the 6th Gen ZL1. I don't know how you or anyone could dispute that. 2020 is 3 years past 2017. There were 3 MYs of the ZL1 before the GT500. You don't count the '20 ZL1 because it is the same year as the GT500.

What I got out of it, he was saying the gt500 is coming out at the 4th model year of the zl1

[hotlap]

Originally Posted by Idaho2018GTPremium

Well, according to C&D the Hellcat RE widebody was 11.8 @ 125 mph. I don't remember what MT tested. Obviously, it is traction limited on street tires. Just like a lot of powerful cars.

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...e-first-drive/

You don’t like cars.com? Careful

Did you know cars.com has the 18 GT A10 press hero pass? ...and the Hellcat press hero pass. ...and the Redeye press hero pass.

Cars.com will also, likely, have the GT500 press hero pass.

FYI - Cars.com never ran the SS or ZL1

Originally Posted by rocket403

Cars Ran a 10.88 at 126 with the Challenger Redeye

https://www.cars.com/articles/going-...1420703398783/

[rocket403]

Originally Posted by Idaho2018GTPremium

Well, according to C&D the Hellcat RE widebody was 11.8 @ 125 mph. I don't remember what MT tested. Obviously, it is traction limited on street tires. Just like a lot of powerful cars.

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...e-first-drive/

Even the challenger 1320 will get 11.80 lol

Check Cars.com for the real story on the RE but just keep thinking that is the best they can do lol

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by Idaho2018GTPremium

I have no problem with speculation, so me speculating that the GT500 will be faster than the ZL1 is fine. And you speculating the opposite doesn't bother me.

Originally Posted by Idaho2018GTPremium

Blaq is already declaring the ZL1 the winner before any tests have been done.

Originally Posted by Idaho2018GTPremium

It will be an all-around performer, like the ZL1, but faster.

You're starting to lose your mind. Every time Ford releases specs you Mustang guys get all worked up and start frothing at the mouth and coming over here talking shit. Cool your heels and chill the hell out.

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by Idaho2018GTPremium

Oh my. The GT500 literally is coming out 3 years after the 6th Gen ZL1. I don't know how you or anyone could dispute that. 2020 is 3 years past 2017. There were 3 MYs of the ZL1 before the GT500. You don't count the '20 ZL1 because it is the same year as the GT500.

Because it is IN it's 4th MY. What do you not understand about that? 2017 was ZL1's 1st MY for the 6th Gen. The GT500 was not present. 2018 was the 2nd MY for the 6th Gen ZL1. The GT500 was not present. 2019 is the 3rd MY for the 6th Gen ZL1. The GT500 is not present. 2020 the ZL1 will be IN it's 4th MY. That is 4, FOUR, MYs for the ZL1. The GT500 will be present. So the GT500 is here while the ZL1 is IN it's 4th MY. You are the only person here who is having a difficult time understanding that. Stop thinking Mustang math and start using real math.