[SomeGeoffGuy]

Originally Posted by Cyrus

thanks for the info. Low miles on the car so hopefully just the flush.

You should be fine. Mine was doing it until 17k miles before flushing it and it is fine now.

-Geoff

[Cyrus]

Went for a drive with the tech today, he noticed the shutter almost right away sitting in the passenger seat. Opened a case with GM to see if I can get this covered since my warranty expired 4 weeks ago. Hopefully having such low miles on the car will help my case. Was told its $900 plus tax to do the flush. They've gone ahead and ordered the fluid. Gotta wait till I get a call back from GM in the next 3 days while its being reviewed. I think best case they cover maybe half the cost for me.

[Cyrus]

Over 5 weeks have passed since my case was opened (July 12). No call from customer service yet. This is pathetic by GM, this a simple yes or no question whether they'll cover the shudder fluid flush. I call every week and get the same answer, a senior ambassador is still reviewing my case and will get back to me asap. When I ask how long they guarantee within 72 business hours. This must be a joke..

[RockerC]

did the flush routine @ 15k with no result. TC replaced to no effect. entire transmission replaced under warranty at 20k. GM did not want to pay and claimed that a dyne tune invalidated the warranty. Dealer went to bat for me and trans got replaced but my entire powertrain warranty is now invalid.

Worked fine until two weeks ago at 41k when shudder suddenly started again: unmistakable symptoms once you've had it. Will make appointment with dealer next week.

[ctrlz]

Originally Posted by Trochoidal

Do you know if the flush service is installing a new trans filter?
I can’t see why they wouldn’t install a new filter but in the same breath I could also see it not happening.

Here's the service bulletin outlining the procedure. Scroll through it and there are specific instructions for the camaro. No mention of filter change.
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/20...63890-9999.pdf

[arpad_m]

Originally Posted by RockerC

did the flush routine @ 15k with no result. TC replaced to no effect. entire transmission replaced under warranty at 20k. GM did not want to pay and claimed that a dyne tune invalidated the warranty. Dealer went to bat for me and trans got replaced but my entire powertrain warranty is now invalid.

Worked fine until two weeks ago at 41k when shudder suddenly started again: unmistakable symptoms once you've had it. Will make appointment with dealer next week.

Your A8 may have been flushed with one of the older, inferior fluids; if the work was done prior to late Jan, early Feb of 2019, it was certainly the wrong fluid, and unfortunately it was only a matter of time before the shudder would return.

Hopefully your torque converter is not damaged too badly at this point, but in all honesty, if I were you, I'd get it replaced and then enjoy peace of mind for the lifetime of the transmission.

[Cyrus]

Update on my shudder issue. I never had this issue till this summer. When I took the car out of winter storage in May on the first ride I noticed a faint shudder. I didn't panic my 5yr powertrain warranty didn't expire till mid June. I barely drove the car in May and only noticed the faint shudder two times maybe. I took sick in June and the car didn't move for about four weeks. Early July I drove the car again and the shudder was much worse. Took it into my GM dealer right away and had the issue diagnosed (Bulletin # 18-NA-355). Dealer said he couldn't cover the flush under warranty because it was a couple weeks expired. Car had 20,000kms. The quote was $878 plus tax for the flush. So I opened a case with GM. They told me they would help but the case needed to be escalated and that I'd receive a call when a decision was made. After 6 weeks of waiting they finally called me and said the dealer would credit me $200 on the fix. But now they added a $200 labor fee in the quote. So still $878 plus tax. Sounds shady to me.

The car has been sitting since early July because I don't want to harm the torque converter till I get the flush done. At this point my frustration isn't even about having to shell out $1000 of my own money for a known transmission issue, its the principal of the whole thing. Maybe it would be different if this was a daily driver with high miles but its a garage queen with super low miles and looks like a brand new car inside and out. And what if the flush doesn't fix the issue, I'm out $1000 wtf.

I have an appointment set for tomorrow for the flush and I don't know what to do. I know I have to get this done to drive the car again plus I can't even sell it till the shudder is resolved so I feel like I'm out of options. I tried to fight it and GM said no. Really upset with GM on this. I tried calling the GM rep back to complain and she said sorry nothing they can do. They plugged my VIN into their system and it shows my car isn't effected by this bulletin. How is it not affected, its a 2017 A8 with the shudder issue !!

Any suggestions or opinons are appreciated.

[Trochoidal]

Cyrus do you have the resources to change the fluid and filter yourself?

You would have to do this twice in order to get the fluid exchanged completely. If you did it yourself my suggestion is to change fluid and filter now and do it again a month later.

I serviced mine twice and it takes 30-45 minutes on a lift.

[arpad_m]

Originally Posted by Cyrus

Update on my shudder issue. I never had this issue till this summer. When I took the car out of winter storage in May on the first ride I noticed a faint shudder. I didn't panic my 5yr powertrain warranty didn't expire till mid June. I barely drove the car in May and only noticed the faint shudder two times maybe. I took sick in June and the car didn't move for about four weeks. Early July I drove the car again and the shudder was much worse. Took it into my GM dealer right away and had the issue diagnosed (Bulletin # 18-NA-355). Dealer said he couldn't cover the flush under warranty because it was a couple weeks expired. Car had 20,000kms. The quote was $878 plus tax for the flush. So I opened a case with GM. They told me they would help but the case needed to be escalated and that I'd receive a call when a decision was made. After 6 weeks of waiting they finally called me and said the dealer would credit me $200 on the fix. But now they added a $200 labor fee in the quote. So still $878 plus tax. Sounds shady to me.

The car has been sitting since early July because I don't want to harm the torque converter till I get the flush done. At this point my frustration isn't even about having to shell out $1000 of my own money for a known transmission issue, its the principal of the whole thing. Maybe it would be different if this was a daily driver with high miles but its a garage queen with super low miles and looks like a brand new car inside and out. And what if the flush doesn't fix the issue, I'm out $1000 wtf.

I have an appointment set for tomorrow for the flush and I don't know what to do. I know I have to get this done to drive the car again plus I can't even sell it till the shudder is resolved so I feel like I'm out of options. I tried to fight it and GM said no. Really upset with GM on this. I tried calling the GM rep back to complain and she said sorry nothing they can do. They plugged my VIN into their system and it shows my car isn't effected by this bulletin. How is it not affected, its a 2017 A8 with the shudder issue !!

Any suggestions or opinons are appreciated.

Cyrus, you have nearly 300 posts here over 5 years and you must have known your car would be affected (every single A8 is), why didn't you take it in at the first faint sign, when the car was still under warranty? Even if they had rejected, there would be a record of your complaint, which would come in very handy now.

Anyway, now that this ship has sailed, let's look ahead instead. I think your best option for now is getting the TSB done, it looks like you've only just began to experience the shudder for real, so the torque converter can be saved.

An additional option is to get the transmission tuned, now that you know you no longer have any meaningful warranty coverage, a proper tune (to get rid of the built-in slip) will likely also help.


BTW, this dealer seems to be messing with you, the fluid costs about $15 (US) per quart and the TSB lists 20 quarts, so that's $300 (US) for material, the rest must already have been quoted as labor at a (super) high rate for about 1.5 hours of work, not sure how they arrived at that extra $200 they waived...

[Trochoidal]

Originally Posted by arpad_m

Cyrus, you have nearly 300 posts here over 5 years and you must have known your car would be affected (every single A8 is), why didn't you take it in at the first faint sign, when the car was still under warranty? Even if they had rejected, there would be a record of your complaint, which would come in very handy now.

Anyway, now that this ship has sailed, let's look ahead instead. I think your best option for now is getting the TSB done, it looks like you've only just began to experience the shudder for real, so the torque converter can be saved.

An additional option is to get the transmission tuned, now that you know you no longer have any meaningful warranty coverage, a proper tune (to get rid of the built-in slip) will likely also help.


BTW, this dealer seems to be messing with you, the fluid costs about $15 (US) per quart and the TSB lists 20 quarts, so that's $300 (US) for material, the rest must already have been quoted as labor at a (super) high rate for about 1.5 hours of work, not sure how they arrived at that extra $200 they waived...

I’m also going to pile on to what you said and mention my investment was 13 quarts ($195) 6-1/2 each time came out and went back in. I replaced the pan gasket each time ($29) and the filter ($19).

So I’m only in $250 each time.

[Cyrus]

Originally Posted by Trochoidal

Cyrus do you have the resources to change the fluid and filter yourself?

You would have to do this twice in order to get the fluid exchanged completely. If you did it yourself my suggestion is to change fluid and filter now and do it again a month later.

I serviced mine twice and it takes 30-45 minutes on a lift.

I don't have the resources no. However I do know a local garage that could do it if I supplied the fluid. But the GM dealer made the process sound difficult. Fluid temp must be at the proper temp each time you drain and it has to be drained 3 times and each time the car needs to be driven then cooled down again. So, I figured its best to have the dealership do this. Didn't think any garage would want to follow the bulletin's instructions. Also, what if that doesn't fix it, at least at a dealership they would be responsible.
Maybe I'm wrong.

[Cyrus]

Originally Posted by arpad_m

Cyrus, you have nearly 300 posts here over 5 years and you must have known your car would be affected (every single A8 is), why didn't you take it in at the first faint sign, when the car was still under warranty? Even if they had rejected, there would be a record of your complaint, which would come in very handy now.

Anyway, now that this ship has sailed, let's look ahead instead. I think your best option for now is getting the TSB done, it looks like you've only just began to experience the shudder for real, so the torque converter can be saved.

An additional option is to get the transmission tuned, now that you know you no longer have any meaningful warranty coverage, a proper tune (to get rid of the built-in slip) will likely also help.


BTW, this dealer seems to be messing with you, the fluid costs about $15 (US) per quart and the TSB lists 20 quarts, so that's $300 (US) for material, the rest must already have been quoted as labor at a (super) high rate for about 1.5 hours of work, not sure how they arrived at that extra $200 they waived...

arpad, always respect your feedback thanks. And yes I was well aware of the issue even before I purchased the car 3 years ago. Didn't think every A8 was affected. I read that the late 2017 builds had a much less chance of being affected so I rolled the dice. My build date was May 2017. And with such low miles plus I only put 2000 - 3000kms a year on the car I thought I might be in the clear with this problem. Thus when I first thought I noticed the shudder in the spring in my head I guess I wanted to believe it was something else like flat spots on my tires from sitting all winter. Anyways I was wrong and in hindsite I shouldn't had taken a chance and gone straight to the dealership. Plus the fact I was ill for a couple weeks in June while the warranty expired luck was not on my side. I also hate taking my cars into garages because they always comes back with a scratch or two. So I only go if I'm 100% I have too.

Agreed my torque converter should be fine I only have maybe 50kms on the car since I noticed this. Dealership is only 3kms away from my house for tomorrows appointment.

I've heard about the tunning fix. And I'm open to that but I've already read that a tune isn't 100% going to get rid of the issue.

What happens if the problem comes back say next summer. Does the dealership provide any type of warranty on this fix.

My dealer said the fluid cost $878 CAD and $200 CAD labor, plus tax. Not sure how I can verify if that's an accurate price in Canada. Everythings much cheaper in the US and I'm not talking about the exchange rate.

[arpad_m]

Originally Posted by Cyrus

arpad, always respect your feedback thanks. And yes I was well aware of the issue even before I purchased the car 3 years ago. Didn't think every A8 was affected. I read that the late 2017 builds had a much less chance of being affected so I rolled the dice. My build date was May 2017. And with such low miles plus I only put 2000 - 3000kms a year on the car I thought I might be in the clear with this problem. Thus when I first thought I noticed the shudder in the spring in my head I guess I wanted to believe it was something else like flat spots on my tires from sitting all winter. Anyways I was wrong and in hindsite I shouldn't had taken a chance and gone straight to the dealership. Plus the fact I was ill for a couple weeks in June while the warranty expired luck was not on my side. I also hate taking my cars into garages because they always comes back with a scratch or two. So I only go if I'm 100% I have too.

Agreed my torque converter should be fine I only have maybe 50kms on the car since I noticed this. Dealership is only 3kms away from my house for tomorrows appointment.

I've heard about the tunning fix. And I'm open to that but I've already read that a tune isn't 100% going to get rid of the issue.

What happens if the problem comes back say next summer. Does the dealership provide any type of warranty on this fix.

My dealer said the fluid cost $878 CAD and $200 CAD labor, plus tax. Not sure how I can verify if that's an accurate price in Canada. Everythings much cheaper in the US and I'm not talking about the exchange rate.

Yeah, I hear you and your assumption wasn't unreasonable... unfortunately this is a design flaw and while one might not witness bad enough deterioration on some cars used in fortunate (dry and warm) climates, not everyone has the luck of the draw.

I checked what Amazon charges for the fluid in Canada, it's $22 CAD per quart (see https://www.amazon.ca/Mobil-124715-S.../dp/B07Q3H159N), so only about 10% more than in the US, your quote has a significant markup by this dealership if they want another $4-500 CAD on top of that for the job (and that's after waiving $200 CAD).

The procedure itself is pretty involved, just read the TSB, plus GM expects the use of a specific flush machine, I don't know if I'd want an independent shop to perform this. I had it done by my dealership twice, once shortly after taking delivery back in 2018, then again in 2019 when the new (and still latest) fluid came out.

A tune plus a flush with the new 2019 fluid should prevent the issue from occurring if torque converter clutches aren't already damaged much, but this can't be determined without pulling the transmission and looking into the TC, which is pretty expensive, I think most people who go this far just roll the dice and say they'll get a new TC if the shudder still returns.

Saying this isn't an ideal situation would the understatement of the year, but at least you do have options.

[cjperformance]

Dealer isn't guaranteed to do it right anyway. Had dealer do mine under warranty. They flushed it once, not 3 times... fixed it for just long enough to get out of warranty, then it came back. Plus found out later, they left it 4-5 quarts low when I had my TC replaced with a stall converter at a performance shop. They expected it to take 1-2 quarts w/ the TC swap... it took 6 qts....

In hindsight, I would have flushed it myself or taken to a reputable shop to get the flush done, then do the tuning change. The setting is in the TCM, so you would need to pull the TCM and send to HPTuners for an unlock. Then pay the license fees for at least the TCM. Not sure if you need ECM too. Anyway, the setting to update is super easy.

I can vouch that the tuning change works, at least for the short term. If you plan on doing other mods, go the tune change route because you'll need everything unlocked anyway. If you don't plan on doing any other tune changes, just do the flush, wait for it to come back, then put a replacement converter in it.

It's a tough choice and it sucks on an otherwise stellar car. I have a 50th also