11-14-2017, 02:05 PM | #15 |
Drives: 2020 ZL1 1LE M6; previous 2018 ZL1 Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Southern Ontario, Canada
Posts: 162
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From the guys that have run the Goodyear 3R's this what I think we've learned so far about the 3R's:
Back to you guys. |
11-14-2017, 02:13 PM | #16 | |
Drives: 2020 ZL1 1LE M6; previous 2018 ZL1 Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Southern Ontario, Canada
Posts: 162
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Quote:
Not to turn this into a camber plate adjustment / alignment setting thread, but I assume you're running top camber plates that allow you to quickly adjust camber from a street setting to a track setting. What alignment settings, including toe, have you found works best for track ? Thanks. |
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11-14-2017, 02:16 PM | #17 | |
I used to be Dragoneye...
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Let us know what you find out. |
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11-14-2017, 02:17 PM | #18 | |
Drives: 2020 ZL1 1LE M6; previous 2018 ZL1 Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Southern Ontario, Canada
Posts: 162
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Quote:
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11-14-2017, 02:42 PM | #19 |
Drives: '19 RivrsdBlu 1LE ('17 1LE HB sold) Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Seattle
Posts: 1,686
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The difference between the NT01s and used-slicks/fresh R7s is about 1-1.5 second on a 2 min course so I would expect the new 3R tires to fall in somewhere between NT01 and R7s in terms of lap times. NT01 and/or R888R will last a lot longer from what I hear from others here and it's not surprising as they're built to compete with Cup2s.
I have been using 305/325-30-19 NT01s and they've been pretty good as expected from my previous experience with them. My close friend who's been racing for years and tracking his cars switched from NT01 to R888Rs and says they were pretty close to NT01s in terms of grip level and consistency with maybe a slight advantage of R888R over the NT01s. People's experience on TireRack is also pretty similar to his. I had RE71Rs and didn't like them personally as they didn't do anything better than the NT01s (lap times, consistency, wear, cost..etc). For someone who is looking for a "compromise" tire that allows him/here to drive in the rain and DD, it may be a good alternative though. I personally don't like compromise tires and have a dedicated track setup for the reasons I mentioned above. On a 650hp car, I would definitely go with the widest avaiable tire to get the most out of that power. Even on my 1LE, the amount of confidence and rear grip compared to 305 G3s tires and Trofeo Rs was very noticeable.
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11-14-2017, 02:49 PM | #20 |
Drives: E46 S54 race car, 964C2 Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Southern Indiana
Posts: 912
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There is a whole lot more than just your steering rack that would move around. Upper/lower control arm bushings/ toe arms/ wheel bearings/ upper strut/damper mounts, all these components will ever so slightly shift around and take a set the first time you put load through a chassis. Additionally, toe will change over time if you track your car regularly. I aligned my SS 1LE yesterday for the first time since May- my toe was completely jacked.
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11-14-2017, 05:02 PM | #21 |
Drives: 2022 SS 1LE Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Houston
Posts: 228
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Based on my experience I cannot help but agree. I saw the numbers on the alignment rack and got the printout. I know my toe plate measurements aren't as accurate as a good rack, but it is good enough that I can tell big toe out from toe in. Curiously the front moved and not the rear. Of course the front takes the brunt of any <ahem> curb surfing that might occur on track. The front has settled a small amount on the springs. The rear appears to be the same height (within the noise level of my measurements anyway).
Anyway, I'll be taking the alignment stuff with me and watching it this weekend when I head up to MSR-Cresson. After this weekend I'll have 5 track days and things should be settled in a bit. I'll realign it then, and keep watching it. My Gen 5 1LE was pretty stable once I found a shop that would actually torque the rear adjusters properly. No substantial change over the last year or so of track use. It also has 50,000 miles on it...so stuff is pretty settled in Thanks Mr. Wyndham for the scoop on the toe change with the plate. I'll let you know what I see. Always learning! |
11-15-2017, 05:17 PM | #22 | |
Drives: 2020 ZL1 1LE M6; previous 2018 ZL1 Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Southern Ontario, Canada
Posts: 162
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Quote:
As for the NT01 being similar in lap time to the Toyo R888R, I would agree with your comment based on my experience. I've found the Toyo to be slightly faster. This makes sense as Toyo makes the Nitto, and as far as I can determine they both us the same 'GG' compound. |
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11-15-2017, 05:23 PM | #23 |
Drives: 1LEs Join Date: May 2009
Location: DFW - Texas
Posts: 1,319
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I am on my second set of 19" G3R's but have no reference point other than to the 20" G3's. Wear on the back on the SS 1LE has been very good and even across with -1.7 to -1.8 camber at rear. My last track day of the year is on Friday and could have probably squeaked the day out of the rear. I have the new rear set on now but saved the others.
Fronts - after the first set corded early on the outside rotating after every track day side to side, I think I am going to try flipping inside out this second set up front - for the dry only. Running -2.7 to -2.8 camber. I'd like to try the NT01 or R888R next then go off the deep end and put a set of Hoosier R7's on. |
11-15-2017, 08:59 PM | #24 | |
Drives: 93 RX-7, 17 SS 1LE, 04 RX-8 Join Date: May 2017
Location: MD
Posts: 270
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Quote:
http://www.tiresdirect.net/Webpage.aspx?WebpageId=48 Not affiliated, and haven't ordered from them but will probably grab a set of R888R's for next season. |
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11-15-2017, 10:15 PM | #25 |
#becauseracecar
Drives: 2016 SS Sedan, 2016 Camaro SS Join Date: May 2015
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 2,959
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When I moved my camber at the plates (and left knuckle camber the same) by -1.5° (-3 to -1.5) it moved the toe from zero to 3/16 toe in so yours is pretty close to what I saw.
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11-16-2017, 02:03 AM | #26 | |
Drives: '19 RivrsdBlu 1LE ('17 1LE HB sold) Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Seattle
Posts: 1,686
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Quote:
I am almost sure that 3Rs will be slightly faster than NT01/R888R but am definitely sure they're not on the R7/used slicks league so if I had to guess I would put them in between those two categories but closer to the lower end. Less than a second on a 2 minute course maybe? when it comes to price/performance R888R/NT01 choice is a no brainer IMO, I think that's something everyone can agree The life on those two will be remarkably better than 3R or Cup2s from what I can tell especially when you can get 305/325s (wider the tire longer the treadwear even more on a heavier more powerful car such as ZL1). The other benefit of the NT01/R888R is that since they're very predictable and consistent it allows to me to focus on improving one corner at a time. It is not possible with hero tires since just when I think I improved something tires are overheated so I feel that I need to back down. There was a similar discussion and I posted the below picture, NASA's time trial rules booklet and points for certain tires. This is what I believe is a good reference to get an idea in terms of tire performance classification
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11-16-2017, 06:59 AM | #27 |
I used to be Dragoneye...
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Good to know. It was an interesting feeling being "alone" that early in terms of comparing cars to get familiar.
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11-16-2017, 08:40 AM | #28 |
Drives: 2020 ZL1 1LE M6; previous 2018 ZL1 Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Southern Ontario, Canada
Posts: 162
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Thanks for sharing your experiences guys. Sounds like the Total Toe changes by 1/16" for every 1/2 degree camber change when done on both sides. This is a great reference for someone wanting quickly change from say a street setting of a 1/16" in to 1/16" out for track use. Or whatever your secret set-up happens to be.
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Tags |
19" track tires for zl1, goodyear f1 3r, nitto nt-01, toyo r888r |
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