[Chutzpah]

Originally Posted by keep_hope_alive

I've been in mobile audio design/install since the mid 90's, and it's been a passion the entire time. I've met plenty of people who are still stuck on sound being behind them in a car despite being in front of them everywhere else. I get it, it's just what some people love about a car stereo - it seems to come from all around them. I still build sound system for people that do this, because it's their car and they get what they want. I understand that it can seem hollow or weird to not have sound behind you when that's what you're used to.

This statement captures me to a T.

[Msquared]

I really like the way keep_hope_alive thinks. I will ditto everything he said about keeping the sound coming from up front. In my minimalist upgrade to my 1SS 1LE, I didn't bother upgrading or adding an amp to the rear-side speakers. I just move the fader all the way to the front and focused on improving those four speakers and adding an amp and DSP to them.

I guess as a reference, my home audio is:

• The aforementioned Michell Mycro and Moerch vinyl rig
• Assemblage DAC 3 and D2D upsampler fed by Audio Alchemy DDS Pro transport
• Jeff Rowland Consonance preamp
• Brown Electronics Labs 1001 mk2 amp (best amp nobody's heard of)
• Vandersteen Quatro speakers

All this stuff is at least old, and some is ancient. It all still performs amazingly well: realistic, refined, detailed, never fatiguing, and exceedingly musical. Other than needing to get into the streaming/server era, I've been off the upgrade train for 15 years now.

[Grimlock212]

For the type of music I listen to (metal), I really like the Bose. I have no clue why every single Camaro I’ve sat in has the EQ maxed in all three bands. Once you level things out, I think it sounds great. It’s much better than the Bose in my Z06, better than the “Premium” audio in my Focus RS, or the stereo that came in my Charger SRT.

I’d much rather get a good stereo from the factory rather than going aftermarket. It just a hassle to get everything right when dealing with audio shops.

[Aaron07]

I like the Bose system in my '17.

[paradigm]

How difficult is to add a sub and amp to the base stereo? Is there a preamp out, or where else can i get a signal from the factory system to drive a sub? Id like to put a small 10” integrated box along the back or side of trunk and feed it with an efficient amp.

I am OK with the base stereo at lower volume but it definitely distorts at higher volumes. I do not want to rip apart door panels and other panels to change the factory system on my new 1LE however.

[Msquared]

Originally Posted by paradigm

How difficult is to add a sub and amp to the base stereo? Is there a preamp out, or where else can i get a signal from the factory system to drive a sub? Id like to put a small 10” integrated box along the back or side of trunk and feed it with an efficient amp.

I am OK with the base stereo at lower volume but it definitely distorts at higher volumes. I do not want to rip apart door panels and other panels to change the factory system on my new 1LE however.

I recall there being some threads on the topic in the "Audio, Video, Bluetooth, etc" forum. You should search there. I don't want to hijack this thread on the Bose upgrade, but the very short version is there are no preamp outs: you'll have to take your signal from the speaker level outputs to the front four speakers (the rear speakers don't get a full-range signal). I don't really get why everybody's first recommendation is to add a sub to everything: if you don't like the quality of sound coming from your current stereo, adding a sub isn't going to change that. It's just going to add deeper bass frequencies to sound you already don't like.

[SomeGeoffGuy]

I am glad to hear that some people think the newer convertibles sound better than the old ones. My 2016 sounds average at best. If you look at the 5th gen, they had a 10" sub behind the rear seat in the convertibles, but on the 6th gens they dropped it - probably because the top motor is behind the rear seat now.

Originally Posted by jamala00

Ya, I can't find any documentation that GM changed anything with the Bose system in the Camaro from 2016 to present.

The only thing I could find (besides them changing all the harness connectors) is that signal is not sent to the Bose amp in the same format- that is why the 2016 NAV-TV units won't work on the newer cars. Maybe it picked up some fidelity?

-Geoff

[SomeGeoffGuy]

Originally Posted by GAbobcat2ss

BTW the system in my Jeep Grand Cherokee trailhawk by comparison sounds way better to me plus it has HD radio that I really like. I wish GM would add HD radio the standard FM in the 2SS is just Meh.

You can add HD radio - there is a vendor that does it but you have to send him some of your electronics. I totally agree with you about the signal improvement and how poor XM sounds - streaming from my phone sounds 10x better.

-Geoff

[ember1205]

Originally Posted by SomeGeoffGuy

You can add HD radio - there is a vendor that does it but you have to send him some of your electronics. I totally agree with you about the signal improvement and how poor XM sounds - streaming from my phone sounds 10x better.

-Geoff

Sirius/XM will -never- sound good. The sheer volume of data they are transmitting through a single "pipe" of limited size means they have to compress the daylights out of it. To me, everything sounds like it's underwater because the compression absolutely kills the sound quality.

[Chutzpah]

Originally Posted by Msquared

I recall there being some threads on the topic in the "Audio, Video, Bluetooth, etc" forum. You should search there. I don't want to hijack this thread on the Bose upgrade, but the very short version is there are no preamp outs: you'll have to take your signal from the speaker level outputs to the front four speakers (the rear speakers don't get a full-range signal). I don't really get why everybody's first recommendation is to add a sub to everything: if you don't like the quality of sound coming from your current stereo, adding a sub isn't going to change that. It's just going to add deeper bass frequencies to sound you already don't like.

He’s 100% right on the rears, they don’t get a full signal.

[ctrlz]

Originally Posted by Msquared

I don't really get why everybody's first recommendation is to add a sub to everything: if you don't like the quality of sound coming from your current stereo, adding a sub isn't going to change that.

Well, I've got a sub and amp from my old car sitting in my basement corner, and it never made it into the Camaro for reasons you stated.
This thread hasn't heard from Saberscar223 in a while.

[WhiteMale]

Reminds me of my 4th Gen 1994 had a Bose system and as I remember it, it was garbage and no one that listened thought it was any good. I want to say it only had 3 speakers but it was a very long time ago.

[keep_hope_alive]

Originally Posted by Msquared

I really like the way keep_hope_alive thinks. I will ditto everything he said about keeping the sound coming from up front. In my minimalist upgrade to my 1SS 1LE, I didn't bother upgrading or adding an amp to the rear-side speakers. I just move the fader all the way to the front and focused on improving those four speakers and adding an amp and DSP to them.

I guess as a reference, my home audio is:

• The aforementioned Michell Mycro and Moerch vinyl rig
• Assemblage DAC 3 and D2D upsampler fed by Audio Alchemy DDS Pro transport
• Jeff Rowland Consonance preamp
• Brown Electronics Labs 1001 mk2 amp (best amp nobody's heard of)
• Vandersteen Quatro speakers

All this stuff is at least old, and some is ancient. It all still performs amazingly well: realistic, refined, detailed, never fatiguing, and exceedingly musical. Other than needing to get into the streaming/server era, I've been off the upgrade train for 15 years now.

Thanks, Matt. I have a buddy in Saint Charles and when I'll let you know when I'm down with the completed setup if you want to give it a listen.

Nothing wrong with older audio considering Analog peaked in the 80's. Other than maybe needing to replace electrolytic capacitors, it can last a very long time and perform at a high level.

[Msquared]

Originally Posted by SomeGeoffGuy

The only thing I could find (besides them changing all the harness connectors) is that signal is not sent to the Bose amp in the same format- that is why the 2016 NAV-TV units won't work on the newer cars. Maybe it picked up some fidelity?

The entire communications protocol throughout the Camaro changed for 2019 from MOST to an ethernet-based protocol. I'm sure this allowed for a higher bitrate over the lines, and it looks to me like the Bose system uses the Radio and HMI modules to send a digital signal to the amp in the trunk, which means the amp is also a DAC. This is unlike the base (1SS 1LE) system, where the Radio module does the amplification and sends music directly to the speakers; or the mid-tier (SS with amp in trunk but no Bose) systems, where the Radio module sends low-level analog signals to the amp, which then does the traditional amplification and sends music to the speakers. So it is possible that higher bit depth and sample rate improve the sound quality? Maybe...I don't know.

But yes, that's why the older NAV-TV units only work in cars up to the 2018 MY.