05-28-2021, 01:56 PM | #85 | |
Retired from GM
Drives: 2017 Camaro Fifty SS Convertible Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Detroit
Posts: 5,421
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Quote:
total available resources (people with appropriate skills, plant capacity and equipment, dollars), competitive placement and performance in the market (new entry, leader, lagging) ability to meet compliance requirements (nail in the coffin for F-body in 2002) financial considerations (cost/unit, revenue/unit, margin/unit, warranty performance/unit) alignment to corporate strategy For every decision to add, maintain, or drop a product, there is a veritable book of backing data and study and the story is different for every one of them. In the case of some of the sedans being discussed, what would you do in the following scenario? You are selling tens of thousands of Vehicle A that was on the low end for cost to produce, required a moderate amount of people resources to continue, and that provide several hundred dollars per vehicle of profit versus Vehicle B that would cost more to produce, would require more people resources, including many of those assigned to Vehicle A, but with sales projected in excess of 100,000 per year and margins of several thousand dollars per vehicle? You cannot keep both vehicles in the portfolio. Do you keep Vehicle A or drop it and add Vehicle B? This is a gross over-simplification of the planning process. Now do this with every vehicle that is in the portfolio and every vehicle that wants to get in the portfolio.
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2017 CAMARO FIFTY SS CONVERTIBLE
A8 | MRC | NPP | Nav | HUD | GM Performance CAI | Tony Mamo LT1 V2 Ported TB | Kooks 1-7/8” LT Headers | FlexFuel Tune | Thinkware Q800 Pro front and rear dash cam | Charcoal Tint for Taillights and 3rd Brakelight | Orange and Carbon Fiber Bowties | 1LE Wheels in Gunmetal Gray | Carbon Fiber Interior Overlays | Novistretch bra and mirror covers | Tow hitch for bicycle rack | |
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05-28-2021, 06:31 PM | #86 |
Drives: 2014 2LT RS Summit White Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Cincinnati
Posts: 622
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I think one reason that GM chooses to get out of sedans is because they can’t make any money selling them. Often they have to discount them / offer incentives to be able to compete with Toyota and Honda. Fewer sales at an ever shrinking margin is just not worth it so they exit the space.
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05-28-2021, 07:27 PM | #87 |
Drives: 2013 ZL1 Convertible A6 BRM Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Dayton Ohio Area
Posts: 499
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GM either cannot or won't build a quality small car with a 4 cylinder engine. Unfortunately Toyota or Honda does build these. Seems to me that once people buy one, they won't go back to GM for a similar such vehicle.
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2013 ZL1 CONVERTIBLE BRM A6
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05-28-2021, 07:43 PM | #88 |
Retired from GM
Drives: 2017 Camaro Fifty SS Convertible Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Detroit
Posts: 5,421
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Gotta disagree with that one. The Chevy Cruze was as good as any vehicle in its class until GM took it down. Honda had to short cycle the Civic to match the Cruze fuel economy. Then GM doubled down with a diesel version. And Cruze was pretty much trouble free. I was shocked when GM dropped it because it was still a strong seller and was very competitive. And there was apparently no plan to use Lordstown for anything else. Malibu is competitive with Camry and Sonata, though Sonata has upped the game with some really cool technology. But I doubt that the core market for midsized sedans gets too excited about “Smaht Pahk” and smartphone key. Personally I love those technologies, but they belong further upmarket. Hyundai is gutsy putting them on a midsized sedan.
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2017 CAMARO FIFTY SS CONVERTIBLE
A8 | MRC | NPP | Nav | HUD | GM Performance CAI | Tony Mamo LT1 V2 Ported TB | Kooks 1-7/8” LT Headers | FlexFuel Tune | Thinkware Q800 Pro front and rear dash cam | Charcoal Tint for Taillights and 3rd Brakelight | Orange and Carbon Fiber Bowties | 1LE Wheels in Gunmetal Gray | Carbon Fiber Interior Overlays | Novistretch bra and mirror covers | Tow hitch for bicycle rack | |
05-28-2021, 08:17 PM | #89 |
Drives: 2013 ZL1 Convertible A6 BRM Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Dayton Ohio Area
Posts: 499
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Of course you would disagree with that, I would expect no less from a GM retiree. I am talking about building cars that last many miles and many years. I am well aware that GM vehicles are competitive with T and H vehicles but they just don't go the distance in time and miles. This is very unfortunate for workers in the industry and for our country. I am from the cradle of GM automotive country and heard that Japanese vehicles are junk wish/lie for decades that I even believed it myself, until I started buying new cars. Yes people will buy whatever, if it is competitively priced, but that alone doesn't keep them from falling apart. Only quality parts and quality builds does that. Yeah you might buy a Chevy priced at or lower than a similar T or H but the repairs after warranty will make that initial savings in price disappear. So in the long run you lose. Believe me Sir it pains me deeply to state this as an evident truth.
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2013 ZL1 CONVERTIBLE BRM A6
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05-29-2021, 09:38 AM | #90 |
Drives: multiple cars Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 506
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I haven't seen reliability complaints for the 2nd gen cruze. I've had good luck with my (older) GM econoboxes, but realize T/H's profits (pricing in repairs that need not be) are based on GM fwd's nickle and diming people for too long.
Everyone has a sister/cousin/aunt, that used to own GM, and nearly panics at a trim panel squeak in your car, but not theirs. Buick weathered the bad reliability years better. 3.8s were GM most trusted fwd engine. (Maybe because of the 3.8 turbo history) Buick's audience was/is more accepting of advanced-jargon powertrains, catering to EPA test loops. That same EPA sword hurts keep-it-simple-stupid wanting Chevy buyers. |
05-29-2021, 10:59 AM | #91 | ||
Drives: 2011 2SS/RS LS3 Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Torrance
Posts: 14,457
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Ending a decently priced and good selling car like the Cruze that is indeed profitable, but just not as much, because it's in the way of making more profitable cars in the consumer's mind....that sucks. What happened to expanding production, instead of decreasing it for higher profits? GM is boasting about ending one line in favor of another that makes more money. I see it as brand loyalty is absolutely no concern or priority for GM or Chevy anymore. Your purchase today will be tomorrow's unwanted step-child. What a lousy image for a car company to promote. Enjoy the profits and keep losing customers. Great strategy. |
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05-29-2021, 11:16 AM | #92 |
Drives: 2014 2LT RS Summit White Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Cincinnati
Posts: 622
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I had a Cruze for about 10 days when the dealer was replacing my shifter under warranty for the “key out” issue common to 2014-15. Why this wasn’t a one day fix is another story but in my time with the Cruze, it was a decent little car, decent acceleration, comfortable, etc. It does feel like maybe a notch down from a Civic or Corolla though and that’s the difficulty for GM I think. It’s hard to change people’s minds unless you knock it out of the park. But overall, a good car and I like the hatchback version even more so sorry to see it go.
My dad has a 15 Impala. Fantastic car, has the LFX V6 similar to my Camaro (tuned a little different). Great to drive. Sorry to see that one go also. I have a 2005 Camry SE V6 with over 160k that I drove for years and now my son is driving. That thing is rock solid, very few issues over the years. That said, I enjoy driving my other son’s 2004 Monte Carlo more despite the fact that we’ve had the dash out 3 times (gauge cluster, multi-function/turn signal stalk and hazard switch repairs), the tranny slips a little, we fixed the rear defrost, the dash is cracking, etc. But like I said, much more stylish, more fun to drive, feels good to drive vs. the appliance feel that the Camry has. |
06-01-2021, 04:26 PM | #93 | |
corner barstool sitter
Drives: 08 Mustang GT, 19 WRX Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Eastern Time Zone
Posts: 6,990
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Quote:
That last one could easily be at the mercy of 'whim'. Norm
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'19 WRX 6M (the family sedan . . . seriously) |
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