[TrackClub]

Originally Posted by TheRealJA105

Hellcat definitely had less cooling. I run the SS track deflectors and splash shields all the time (and tell 1LE, ZL1, and ZLE guys they should do the same for better cooling and get arguments that their cars don't need it, blah blah don't need but why not get better cooling for a $16 kit, sorry for the minor rant) I doubt the lines are different with the factory 6 piston upgrade kit and the exact same rear brakes. I will probably upgrade my lines, but idk if i can justify paying more than twice the stainless price for the CF lines.

I even hacked up my rear splash shields to remove them everywhere there isn't a suspension bushing and am considering buying C8 rear brake ducts. https://www.camaro6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=574985 More brake cooling is always better in my book.

Ya i agree, yet obviously there is a substantial difference in cooling between a 1LE and an SS as the latter requires extra parts to make it track capable. My calipers still look brand new, but that's with stock pads But i agree with your opinion on cooling et al.

Having said that, do you run the deflectors all the time? Do they affect ground clearance? My summer access road is unpaved and very rough (woods!) so that's an important detail for me. I already pick up crap with the under tray...

[OhioRiderAaron]

Originally Posted by TrackClub

Ya i agree, yet obviously there is a substantial difference in cooling between a 1LE and an SS as the latter requires extra parts to make it track capable. My calipers still look brand new, but that's with stock pads But i agree with your opinion on cooling et al.

Having said that, do you run the deflectors all the time? Do they affect ground clearance? My summer access road is unpaved and very rough (woods!) so that's an important detail for me. I already pick up crap with the under tray...

If your calipers still look new you're not braking hard enough


I may give the deflectors a shot as I don't think the stock brake cooling is all that good on the SS1LE.

[TheRealJA105]

Originally Posted by TrackClub

Ya i agree, yet obviously there is a substantial difference in cooling between a 1LE and an SS as the latter requires extra parts to make it track capable. My calipers still look brand new, but that's with stock pads But i agree with your opinion on cooling et al.

Having said that, do you run the deflectors all the time? Do they affect ground clearance? My summer access road is unpaved and very rough (woods!) so that's an important detail for me. I already pick up crap with the under tray...

The substantial difference is the stock SS 4 piston fronts. That's why GM includes the additional cooling kit. I don't have that problem and still run them. Yes i leave them on all the time and yes they do hang down pretty low so that sounds like not a good option for you. However they are only held on the control arms with 3 small bolts and if I were you i would buy them and install for trackdays if you can. The kit also comes with the tiny splash shields and you could leave them on with no issue. GM recommends removal of both for ground clearance and potential water issues during rain driving affecting the brakes. The splash shields are the item that takes significant work to remove/reinstall as you have to remove the calipers and rotors.

[TrackClub]

Originally Posted by OhioRiderAaron

If your calipers still look new you're not braking hard enough


I may give the deflectors a shot as I don't think the stock brake cooling is all that good on the SS1LE.

Haha! Maybe you brake too hard?!

To be fair, I should re-phrase my comment about 1LE cooling: it is absolutely sufficient with stock pads. It also seems absolutely sufficient with high torque pads with Ti shims. It is also sufficient with just high torque pads if one doesnt mind their calipers turning into Brownbos and having them rebuilt every couple of seasons or so.

Of course, trying a $16 part is a no brainer. So is using SRF. Or using shims and vented pistons for high torque pads. Etc. That's common sense and i completely agree with it.

When i first tried ST43s on a track notoriously hard on brakes, i thought my fronts were gonna catch on fire Nascar style after one session I also cooked the fluid, which was just fine with stock pads (Willwood 570). Went back with stock pads, zero heat issues and got a new PB, which still stands as a 1le record there, incl times posted during provincial Time Trail competition (just in case your next suggestion were to be that i am not fast enough

Cheers!

[OhioRiderAaron]

Originally Posted by TrackClub

Haha! Maybe you brake too hard?!

To be fair, I should re-phrase my comment about 1LE cooling: it is absolutely sufficient with stock pads. It also seems absolutely sufficient with high torque pads with Ti shims. It is also sufficient with just high torque pads if one doesnt mind their calipers turning into Brownbos and having them rebuilt every couple of seasons or so.

Of course, trying a $16 part is a no brainer. So is using SRF. Or using shims and vented pistons for high torque pads. Etc. That's common sense and i completely agree with it.

When i first tried ST43s on a track notoriously hard on brakes, i thought my fronts were gonna catch on fire Nascar style after one session I also cooked the fluid, which was just fine with stock pads (Willwood 570). Went back with stock pads, zero heat issues and got a new PB, which still stands as a 1le record there, incl times posted during provincial Time Trail competition (just in case your next suggestion were to be that i am not fast enough

Cheers!

Just poking good fun at you. Sorry I meant that the stock cooling is sufficient for almost any pad, but could be better as to extend the life of those particular pads and rotors. I'm a cheap bastard so anything that improves the longevity outta $600-700 pads is worth looking into. And I probably do over-brake at times

[TrackClub]

Originally Posted by TheRealJA105

The substantial difference is the stock SS 4 piston fronts. That's why GM includes the additional cooling kit. I don't have that problem and still run them. Yes i leave them on all the time and yes they do hang down pretty low so that sounds like not a good option for you. However they are only held on the control arms with 3 small bolts and if I were you i would buy them and install for trackdays if you can. The kit also comes with the tiny splash shields and you could leave them on with no issue. GM recommends removal of both for ground clearance and potential water issues during rain driving affecting the brakes. The splash shields are the item that takes significant work to remove/reinstall as you have to remove the calipers and rotors.

Thanks for the detailed info. Yep the 4 pot...it makes sense now.

It seems i would need to jack her up...Well, the main reason why i switched from my trailered C5Z was to go back to the very early beginnings of zero PITA and "arrive and drive" style. And ive been loving it for 3 seasons now.
Empty the car, take license plate off, put a toe hook in, lower tire pressures and i am good to go!

I dont run any enduros. 30min sessions are most common. Up to 45mins max. I really have zero braking issues. My pace is competitive for top HPDE groups and Time Trial comp. Maybe it is my style. Who knows. Some are harder on brakes, while others aren't - even in pro leagues. Ditto re: tires. Ive been tempted to go with track rims and softer tires, but that would put me on a reverse course and sooner vs later a new trailer. I know me too well

But that's not my strategy these days. Neither is friggin with the car twice each day. That's what old age does to ya...beware! Lol!

[TrackClub]

Originally Posted by OhioRiderAaron

Just poking good fun at you. Sorry I meant that the stock cooling is sufficient for almost any pad, but could be better as to extend the life of those particular pads and rotors. I'm a cheap bastard so anything that improves the longevity outta $600-700 pads is worth looking into. And I probably do over-brake at times

I know. Ditto here

Not sure what pads you are referring to at this price level, but even upgraded 2500s are about $280 for a F set. Stockers are the same price (looks like both of us are cheap bastards, eh? LOL!).

[cirpower]

Originally Posted by TrackClub

Looking fwd to an entertaining vid and 40s

Keeping the fingers crossed I can get a clean lap and improve my driving supported by better alignment/brakes. The higher temperature at the end of June might not help though.

[TrackClub]

Originally Posted by cirpower

Keeping the fingers crossed I can get a clean lap and improve my driving supported by better alignment/brakes. The higher temperature at the end of June might not help though.

Stop hedging and start studying that 360 vid until ya can play it out with you eyes closed as if you were driving (literally). 40s in the bank

I know, easy for me to say, eh? But seriously, effective visualization (of a perfect lap in complete detail) is a tremendous tool to increase pace.

Cheers!

[cirpower]

Originally Posted by TrackClub

Stop hedging and start studying that 360 vid until ya can play it out with you eyes closed as if you were driving (literally). 40s in the bank

I know, easy for me to say, eh? But seriously, effective visualization (of a perfect lap in complete detail) is a tremendous tool to increase pace.

Cheers!

The 360 vid has already helped me tremendously, I am pretty sure I know where the time is at.

[TrackClub]

Originally Posted by cirpower

The 360 vid has already helped me tremendously, I am pretty sure I know where the time is at.

Yay!

[LESS1]

Originally Posted by TheRealJA105

See this is what I really don't understand with my car. Even switching from Motul 600 to SRF before last season i still get a long pedal. This along with everyone in the CF brake line thread saying the lines give them the rock hard pedal they are seeking really makes me want to swap my lines out. I don't think the stock lines are as good as some are making them out to be. I have never felt as confident with the brake pedal feel in the Camaro as I did in the Hellcat on the track. The Hellcat pedal was firm and high up until late in sessions even with Motul 600!

I cannot speak from experience with Camaro SS or 1LE but all of my other cars that ended up Frankentrack experiments used stainless steel lines front and rear. In each case, this made a significant improvement in braking and pedal feel. Late last year I switched out Motul for SRF and the two times on track with SRF I didn't get a long pedal. However, in both cases, ambient temps were the 30s - 40s and the track I ran on is not that hard on brakes. As I posted earlier the stock lines are not reinforced with steel as some have speculated. And in my experience, the OEM lines will get spongey when you are really using the bakes hard.

[LESS1]

Originally Posted by TheRealJA105

Hellcat definitely had less cooling. I run the SS track deflectors and splash shields all the time (and tell 1LE, ZL1, and ZLE guys they should do the same for better cooling and get arguments that their cars don't need it, blah blah don't need but why not get better cooling for a $16 kit, sorry for the minor rant) I doubt the lines are different with the factory 6 piston upgrade kit and the exact same rear brakes. I will probably upgrade my lines, but idk if i can justify paying more than twice the stainless price for the CF lines.

I even hacked up my rear splash shields to remove them everywhere there isn't a suspension bushing and am considering buying C8 rear brake ducts. https://www.camaro6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=574985 More brake cooling is always better in my book.

Not sure about the differences between SS and 1LE lines. But this much I know... brother you need bigger brakes on that beast. Stating the obvious your at or near ZL1/ZLE power levels on tiny (relative) brakes. Really surprised you're going as fast as you do in your videos with this handicap. In regards to CF vs SS lines, I agree the price is rather steep for CF.

[LESS1]

Originally Posted by OhioRiderAaron

Just poking good fun at you. Sorry I meant that the stock cooling is sufficient for almost any pad, but could be better as to extend the life of those particular pads and rotors. I'm a cheap bastard so anything that improves the longevity outta $600-700 pads is worth looking into. And I probably do over-brake at times

Something to keep in mind is bake cooling isn't just a function of airflow over the rotors. In actuality, the rotors themselves and to a lesser extent the pads are heatsinks, and depending on rotor diameter, thickness, cooling vanes...etc as well as pad thickness, contribute to cooling. If you go too far over the rotors and pads capability to absorb and release heat. It doesn't make much difference how big/effective the cooling ducts are.