[Petrol Head]

Originally Posted by MBSS1LE

That electric Camaro, if it comes to be, is definitely replacement for displacement. It will outperform the current ICE versions.

Some people say the sound of Ferrari’s V-12 from about 4500-7000 rpm is the most beautiful sound of any engine on earth. There are many Ferraris that outperform a Camaro SS.

There’s still no replacement for displacement.

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by UnknownJinX

I could do that theoretically, but one thing I find is that having multiple manual cars can be tricky due to every car having different clutch bite points.

Never found that to have been any problem at all. Neither did my wife. And we've had as many as four different MT cars in the driveway at the same time, four different makes.

And heh, if it's supposed to be a toaster, there is less feeling involved and more financial calculations. EVs are good for drive it and forget it type of deal.

That must be where we differ. No way was I ever going to buy a car as a mindless transportation appliance. With any amount of money on the line, I've got to actively enjoy driving it, not merely tolerate it or suffer through the experience.

... for personal use there are other factors to it. Yeah, manual enthusiasts all know that there aren't many objective reasons to drive one anymore, but emotions also play a part.

Exactly. And there's no need to make sacrifices on the subjective side even in the DD. Consider it part of maintaining the entertainment of it all.



Norm

[Rock-It Man]

Originally Posted by Aragorn

For me it’s also the exhaust note and rowing through the gears.

Rowing through the gears is already obsolete in the realm of supercars. Soon the exhaust note will be too, along with throwaway plastic bottles and single use plastic bags.

Instead, enormous torque and zero to 60 in 2.0 seconds will be the standard for a muscle car.

[bigd1276]

Originally Posted by Rock-It Man

Rowing through the gears is already obsolete in the realm of supercars. Soon the exhaust note will be too, along with throwaway plastic bottles and single use plastic bags.

Instead, enormous torque and zero to 60 in 2.0 seconds will be the standard for a muscle car.

And hopefully these stupid disposable masks.

[CodeCody]

Electric cars will kill the street kings when even the common passenger vehicle can go 0-60 in under 4 seconds. Hell some SUVs are already doing that. I would get an electric Camaro. I just wouldn't replace my current one to get it.

[UnknownJinX]

Originally Posted by Norm Peterson

Never found that to have been any problem at all. Neither did my wife. And we've had as many as four different MT cars in the driveway at the same time, four different makes.

That must be where we differ. No way was I ever going to buy a car as a mindless transportation appliance. With any amount of money on the line, I've got to actively enjoy driving it, not merely tolerate it or suffer through the experience.

Exactly. And there's no need to make sacrifices on the subjective side even in the DD. Consider it part of maintaining the entertainment of it all.

Norm

I once tried my friend's 2013 Civic Si and the bite point on that car was really low, and it also has the rev hang where you have to wait half a second between shifts because the RPM won't drop immediately after you clutch in. When I hopped back into my own Camaro, it took me a little bit to get used to it again. I also hopped back and forth between my C7 and beater Accord for a little while. Takes me a few minutes to get used to.

There was another time where I travelled to Costa Rica and drove a 5-speed Suzuki Jimny for a week. When I came back to my RX-8, I started it up, buckled the car twice before finally stalling as the clutch on the RX-8 is a lot heavier compared to the Jimny.

I haven't had to deal with it on a regular basis so I don't really know if I can handle it, but from my limited experience, it sounds like it could be an issue, at least for me.

Again, all hypothetical. Just not financially sensible for me at the moment.

Originally Posted by Rock-It Man

Rowing through the gears is already obsolete in the realm of supercars. Soon the exhaust note will be too, along with throwaway plastic bottles and single use plastic bags.

Instead, enormous torque and zero to 60 in 2.0 seconds will be the standard for a muscle car.

Supercars are a different story as most of them aren't owned by enthusiasts. They are more treated as status symbols so the numbers matter, and as a lot of YouTube fail videos would show, a lot of their owners don't even know how to drive those things with an automatic/DCT, let alone a manual. I mean, you don't see a lot of supercars regular track days.

And why would throwaway bottles be obsolete? I don't support them but it's silly to think they will be obsolete. People sometimes need water on the go and forget to pack.

Finally, we see another 0-60 wanking on display here. Yes, 0-ticket/impound lot/jail in 2 seconds sounds fantastic. Most people can't even handle cars slower than that, now you want 2-second 0-60 car to be commonplace? Welp, I hope you won't be the first victim to some kid driving a super fast EV, losing control and bursting into difficult-to-extinguish flames...

Originally Posted by CodeCody

Electric cars will kill the street kings when even the common passenger vehicle can go 0-60 in under 4 seconds. Hell some SUVs are already doing that. I would get an electric Camaro. I just wouldn't replace my current one to get it.

A grandma will drive a ZL1 as slowly as her 99 Corolla. Performance numbers don't mean much in passenger cars. Efficiency does.

And again, I think our driver education and infrastructure needs to see a huge step-up if you wish fast cars to be commonplace. YouTube fail videos are all fun and games until you are the guy in that Silverado that got flipped over by that Hellcat Challenger...

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by CodeCody

Electric cars will kill the street kings when even the common passenger vehicle can go 0-60 in under 4 seconds.

Not a good enough reason. There's always been somebody faster than you, and this won't change that.

But it is a particularly tasty flavor of kool-aid for those who can't see past 0-60 times and such.


Norm

[Petrol Head]

Originally Posted by Rock-It Man

Rowing through the gears is already obsolete in the realm of supercars. Soon the exhaust note will be too, along with throwaway plastic bottles and single use plastic bags.

Instead, enormous torque and zero to 60 in 2.0 seconds will be the standard for a muscle car.

And yet, people my age who weren’t even born when the car was built are paying 6 figures for muscle cars with 7 second 0-60 times.

Gee, I wonder why

[Smokin19]

At my age, I am blessed with owning the best Camaro ever made and it will be my last one.

[Aragorn]

Originally Posted by Rock-It Man

Rowing through the gears is already obsolete in the realm of supercars. car.

Im sure , but I find it enjoyable.

[Pupilbone]

Originally Posted by Puddin

Well I hate to be the bearer of bad news but it looks like the Camaro is going to have to go to electric if it wants any chance of survival. This website will just have to make an extra sub section when it eventually happens.

Long live that sub section.

[Petrol Head]

Originally Posted by Pupilbone

Long live that sub section.

No, let that be their own forum.

The 6th Gen Camaro drinks dead dinosaurs. Long live THIS forum - about drinking dead dinosaurs!

[raptor5244]

I have owned a number of Corvettes and Camaros over the years and I totally get the thrill of rowing your own gears and listening to the sweet V8 soundtrack. I bought a Tesla Model 3 Performance a couple years ago to see what all the fuss is about. In my experience if your are a true muscle car fan then yes you will miss the vibration, sound, rowing your own gears, etc. however these performance electric cars are able to entertain in other ways.

For example, the instant torque you get from a performance EV is pretty remarkable and satisfying. I have never been thrown back in the seat of a car like my Tesla. The passing power is effortless, it really feels like you have an unfair advantage when on the street when your torque curve looks like a square wave. Good or bad, there is no drama either. The traction control is much more advanced with electric motors, you just plant your foot and you rocket forward. And a 300 mile charge costs about $5 in electricity. The Tesla M3P also has a fully customizable Track Mode with granular control of the stability control and front rear bias so you can drift if you want. Regen braking is also pretty cool once you get used to it. I rarely have to use the friction brakes on the street as the motors will bring you to a full stop with brake hold. Some guys say they actually appreciate the fact there is no exhaust noise since they can actually hear what the tires are doing on track.

I will surely miss a true ice based muscle car but lately we have so much crap tech that gets in the way. If we only had a choice between a Camaro with start stop V8 with part time V4 and tons of nannies or an less restrictive EV Camaro I know which one I am picking. Let’s hope GM gets it right.

[Petrol Head]

Originally Posted by raptor5244

I have owned a number of Corvettes and Camaros over the years and I totally get the thrill of rowing your own gears and listening to the sweet V8 soundtrack. I bought a Tesla Model 3 Performance a couple years ago to see what all the fuss is about. In my experience if your are a true muscle car fan then yes you will miss the vibration, sound, rowing your own gears, etc. however these performance electric cars are able to entertain in other ways.

For example, the instant torque you get from a performance EV is pretty remarkable and satisfying. I have never been thrown back in the seat of a car like my Tesla. The passing power is effortless, it really feels like you have an unfair advantage when on the street when your torque curve looks like a square wave. Good or bad, there is no drama either. The traction control is much more advanced with electric motors, you just plant your foot and you rocket forward. And a 300 mile charge costs about $5 in electricity. The Tesla M3P also has a fully customizable Track Mode with granular control of the stability control and front rear bias so you can drift if you want. Regen braking is also pretty cool once you get used to it. I rarely have to use the friction brakes on the street as the motors will bring you to a full stop with brake hold. Some guys say they actually appreciate the fact there is no exhaust noise since they can actually hear what the tires are doing on track.

I will surely miss a true ice based muscle car but lately we have so much crap tech that gets in the way. If we only had a choice between a Camaro with start stop V8 with part time V4 and tons of nannies or an less restrictive EV Camaro I know which one I am picking. Let’s hope GM gets it right.

That’s another good reason to get a manual - no DOD and our crap tech that gets in the way is easily defeatable with a $15 resistor