[RobbyBeefcake87]

Originally Posted by minn19

That’s why it is useless to talk to people like you. I never brought up magazine times to you. I quoted you about a completely different topic, which you ignored to bring up/start this weird diatribe.

You buy used cars and don’t quote magazine times. Good for you, why even bother posting in this thread at all then?

It's really hard to debate people who ignore points made and just move on like nothing happened. Happens a lot here.

[RobbyBeefcake87]

Originally Posted by NW-99SS

Disagree - this isn't going to happen even in ZL1 ideal conditions. The GT500 makes much less torque at launch RPM than the ZL1 = better launches and then it's HP to weight and DCT advantage takes over.

GT500 will be the faster 1/4 mile car in all "real" scenarios, all things being equal.

The video I posted was in my anticipation of the road course testing. Yes I go to the road course, yes I go to drag race tracks. Yes the 3 cars in the video are the road course packages for their respective platforms. What I am looking forward to, is seeing how the A10 ZLE stacks up against a CFTP GT500. Yes price is a factor - if it wasn't, no one would argue to buy used over new...

I think in street surfaces magazines have shown them to be 11.5 cars, but after the 1/4 the gt500 will gap the zl1 with over 5mph trap speed advantage.

At the strip the gt500 should win almost all the time.

[RobbyBeefcake87]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-car...eye-drag-race/

That's the same Edmunds video

[minn19]

Originally Posted by RobbyBeefcake87

It's really hard to debate people who ignore points made and just move on like nothing happened. Happens a lot here.

It happens on every forum, but I've got to say here is pretty good compared to other ones I've been on.

[RobbyBeefcake87]

Originally Posted by bradmo9

Pretty impressed the GT500 gapped the zl1 pretty bad every time.

It did gap it everytime, don't know who expected otherwise. They're autos, the winner of one will most likely win all the runs over and over again.

There's no denying that the gt500 won by a good .3 margin every time. At least 2 cars lengths maybemore. What I find funny is the same people that are celebrating this gapping by a more powerful car are a lot of the same people that will tell you the .3 gap the m6 ss puts on an m6 GT is a drivers race lol between cars of more or less the same power.

[NW-99SS]

Originally Posted by RobbyBeefcake87

I think in street surfaces magazines have shown them to be 11.5 cars, but after the 1/4 the gt500 will gap the zl1 with over 5mph trap speed advantage.

At the strip the gt500 should win almost all the time.

I just don't see any ZL1 besting the GT500 side by side unless there is an error or failure of some kind for the GT500. It's simply the faster car in a straight line as it should be some 5 years later, additional 110hp, and DCT (can't get over that terrible Ram 1500 gear selector to this day).

[RobbyBeefcake87]

Originally Posted by minn19

It happens on every forum, but I've got to say here is pretty good compared to other ones I've been on.

I mostly stick to this one and fb. This is definately better than YouTube comments lol.

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by shaffe

Fair enough, would you pay 75K+ for a Camaro? Me I probably wouldn't I would probably go Corvette in that price range.

It depends on the Camaro, the level of performance, and the price of the competition. The ZL1 was already in that price range and I thought it was a great value based on the price of the Z06 and the fact that the ZL1 had tons of standard features.

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by shaffe

Of course it could, thats why we want to see them tested together to see what happens!

Originally Posted by Laststandard

C'mon man. 'X' car could always beat 'y' car if the driver blows it off the line or for whatever other reason, but you know that on average the GT500 will be faster than the ZL1.

And how is the GT500 affected more by conditions?

No I'm not talking about driver error. If you wanna seriously discuss this then I will oblige. I'll repeat what I said before.

The GT500 is affected by conditions more so than the ZL1. It isn't about defying physics. We have already seen it. Ford claims 10.7 on a prepped track in optimal conditions. Usually when a Mustang runs we hear "oh well if the DA was better" or "well in cooler late year temps" and similar comments all alluding to the fact that if it is run in better conditions then it will do much better. And it has done that. Remove those conditions and it is an 11.3-11.5 sec car as we have seen. The ZL1 regardless of conditions (not conditions like rain in case someone wants to be a smartass) has maintained mid 11s in testing. In those runs we often are not told what the DA or temps were. And it is not often on a prepped track from what I understand although I could be wrong on that point. In any case we have typically seen it run 11.3 to 11.6 with even the M6 equipped versions running 11.6-11.8 I believe. So we are seeing around a 7-9 tenths difference with the GT500. Some are even saying the 500 could run 10.4s bone stock which would be a 1.1 sec difference all based on conditions. With the ZL1 we are seeing more of a 2-4 tenths difference. The testing we are discussing now showed 11.3 (GT500) and 11.6 (ZL1). Now if you were to put both cars on a prepped track and run them in optimal conditions then apparently you could shave almost a full second off the 500 based on claims of 10.4 to 10.6. With the ZL1 it might be more around 3-4 tenths.

Now this is open to debate. But when a pro runs a 10.6 and then a kid who claims to have never driven on a track before runs 10.6 both on prepped tracks...but other pro-level drivers on an unprepped track and in hotter climates run 11.5 (all Base 500s), then that kinda proves the point. We are seeing much wider ranges in GT500 times as opposed to ZL1 times. (See the comment I quoted from shaffe who typically disagrees with me).

Now I hate trying to explain things to Mustang guys because all you guys do is troll. But I am not saying that the GT500 is not the faster car. I am saying that if it is not in conditions that are to it's advantage, then it will suffer. The ZL1 in those same conditions will not be affected as largely. Again, see the examples above.

Also of note is that on an unprepped track the C8 (not a Camaro of course) was able to run faster than the GT500. 11.1 (CF) to 11.3 (CF 500) and 11.5 (Base 500). It isn't about defying physics. Rather, physics would explain why this happens.

[TreedYou]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

No I'm not talking about driver error. If you wanna seriously discuss this then I will oblige. I'll repeat what I said before.

The GT500 is affected by conditions more so than the ZL1. It isn't about defying physics. We have already seen it. Ford claims 10.7 on a prepped track in optimal conditions. Usually when a Mustang runs we hear "oh well if the DA was better" or "well in cooler late year temps" and similar comments all alluding to the fact that if it is run in better conditions then it will do much better. And it has done that. Remove those conditions and it is an 11.3-11.5 sec car as we have seen. The ZL1 regardless of conditions (not conditions like rain in case someone wants to be a smartass) has maintained mid 11s in testing. In those runs we often are not told what the DA or temps were. And it is not often on a prepped track from what I understand although I could be wrong on that point. In any case we have typically seen it run 11.3 to 11.6 with even the M6 equipped versions running 11.6-11.8 I believe. So we are seeing around a 7-9 tenths difference with the GT500. Some are even saying the 500 could run 10.4s bone stock which would be a 1.1 sec difference all based on conditions. With the ZL1 we are seeing more of a 2-4 tenths difference. The testing we are discussing now showed 11.3 (GT500) and 11.6 (ZL1). Now if you were to put both cars on a prepped track and run them in optimal conditions then apparently you could shave almost a full second off the 500 based on claims of 10.4 to 10.6. With the ZL1 it might be more around 3-4 tenths.

Now this is open to debate. But when a pro runs a 10.6 and then a kid who claims to have never driven on a track before runs 10.6 both on prepped tracks...but other pro-level drivers on an unprepped track and in hotter climates run 11.5 (all Base 500s), then that kinda proves the point. We are seeing much wider ranges in GT500 times as opposed to ZL1 times. (See the comment I quoted from shaffe who typically disagrees with me).

Now I hate trying to explain things to Mustang guys because all you guys do is troll. But I am not saying that the GT500 is not the faster car. I am saying that if it is not in conditions that are to it's advantage, then it will suffer. The ZL1 in those same conditions will not be affected as largely. Again, see the examples above.

Also of note is that on an unprepped track the C8 (not a Camaro of course) was able to run faster than the GT500. 11.1 (CF) to 11.3 (CF 500) and 11.5 (Base 500). It isn't about defying physics. Rather, physics would explain why this happens.

Related question about the whole un-prepped/prepped surface thing that comes up a ton.


Where else but a drag strip can you get a 1/4 time for you car?

Saying "ran the 1/4 on an un-prepped surface" doesn't make any sense because where else are you going to run the quarter mile?

I mean you're at the drag strip to begin with to get the best time out of the car you came there with so I'm a bit confused about that whole line.

At the drag strip there is never an un-prepped surface, you're at a drag strip.
And on the street there is no tree with time traps...


------


Also to pepper in something else, talking about times on these cars that have automatically shifting transmissions can't you just take any driver skill out of the conversations?

All you really have to do is keep your hands on the steering wheel. So saying "pro-driver" in an automatic car that does all the works sounds a bit off, nah mean jelly bean?
What can one driver in an automatic possibly do that a trained monkey can't do? hold the steering wheel straighter?

[minn19]

Originally Posted by RobbyBeefcake87

I mostly stick to this one and fb. This is definately better than YouTube comments lol.

That is the worst, but not too far off from M6G.

[shaffe]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

It depends on the Camaro, the level of performance, and the price of the competition. The ZL1 was already in that price range and I thought it was a great value based on the price of the Z06 and the fact that the ZL1 had tons of standard features.

I could completely understand that line of thinking but not me, because all out performance isn't the determining factor to me. I have said numerous times here I wouldn't care if the camaro/mustang/challenger was faster then a vette at same price point. That is more to just having a love for Corvettes. Maybe after owning one my mindset would change lol, but a Corvette has long been a dream car of mine.

[minn19]

Originally Posted by TreedYou

Related question about the whole un-prepped/prepped surface thing that comes up a ton.


Where else but a drag strip can you get a 1/4 time for you car?

Saying "ran the 1/4 on an un-prepped surface" doesn't make any sense because where else are you going to run the quarter mile?

I mean you're at the drag strip to begin with to get the best time out of the car you came there with so I'm a bit confused about that whole line.

At the drag strip there is never an un-prepped surface, you're at a drag strip.
And on the street there is no tree with time traps...


------


Also to pepper in something else, talking about times on these cars that have automatically shifting transmissions can't you just take any driver skill out of the conversations?

All you really have to do is keep your hands on the steering wheel. So saying "pro-driver" in an automatic car that does all the works sounds a bit off, nah mean jelly bean?
What can one driver in an automatic possibly do that a trained monkey can't do? hold the steering wheel straighter?

Please please go repeat this post in this M6G in this thread. I double dog dare you.

https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/thr...ro-zl1.134714/

[TreedYou]

Originally Posted by minn19

Please please go repeat this post in this M6G in this thread. I double dog dare you.

https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/thr...ro-zl1.134714/

I think it makes universal sense for internet arguments, but I see nobody has brought it up.

And like I said I don't frequent there.