[2010SSRSM6]

Originally Posted by Milk 1027

Oh, I know.
that's why I said "want" and realisticly its way out of my price range.

Stay away from all things Magnum Research, especially "that" one. Huge POS.

Best thing to do is find an indoor range and rent everything. See how they feel, break down, shoot, etc. They aren't cheap, so make sure you do your homework.

Next time you come south let me know and we'll go shoot all mine so you can get a better idea.

Personally, I like Sig and H&K.

[11BEE]

Originally Posted by Milk 1027

Thinking of buying my first handgun.
Any tips or suggestions.

I know everyone is going to have their own preferance, but I just want to hear opinions.

Congratulations on deciding to buy your first gun. You will enjoy this hobby. You are right that everyone will give you a different answer and a different preference. Guns are like cars, you will not get a Volvo if you want to run a 1/4 mile, but you don't get a Camaro if you have 5 kids and no other vehicle.

Before you buy any gun, you need to determine what you need if for. Is it for handgun hunting, self defense at home, concealed carry, plinking, just for fun or maybe competition such as IDPA? Each of these will require a different type of gun.

I have many different guns for many different purposes. Here is a partial list:

-Ruger LCP for deep Concealment.
-Glock 26 and 19 for self defense and concealed carry.
-Glock 34 for competition shooting with IDPA. It is also a fun range gun.
-Colt Police Positive .38 Special for home defense. A revolver is the easiest gun to operate especially when you are woken up to an intruder.
-Beretta Neos .22LR for plinking and just having a blast with in the woods or at the range.
-Kimber and Llama 1911's for range fun and they enable me to customize the guns with many different parts. You can call me an amateur gun smith.

As you can see each has a different purpose. I do not like to shoot the Ruger at the range often. It is small and light and kicks like a pissed off mule.



Now for my advice.

First, don't fall into the macho bravado of buying the biggest baddest gun first. I have never met a person that does not get hooked by this hobby. If you buy the best first, there is noting left to grow into or buy later.

Second, remember that ammunition costs money and you will need to buy a lot of it. You can get a box of 500 rounds of .22 LR for about $17. I just bought a lot of 50 round boxes of 9 mm Luger for $9.99 a box. it starts getting expensive when you move to .40 or .45 ACP where a box of 50 will set you back $18-$20. I would personally buy a gun in 9 mm that has a conversion kit of .22 LR for my first gun. This is what I did and it enabled me to shoot 100 rounds of 9 mm then another 200 rounds of .22 every time I went to the range. This is how you get good quick, putting a lot of lead down range.

Third, buy what fits your hand. Every gun is different. I would suggest you go to a gun show and pick up every gun you can. This will give you an idea of what feels right.

Fourth, I would get a full size gun like the Glock 19 or S&W M&P 9mm. The plastic guns are very reliable. The longer barrel will give you more control and they are easier to aim. I have never had a Glock fail, this is why I am partial to them. I would avoid a 1911 for the first gun. They usually take a lot of time to break in will jam in the first 500 rounds a number of times. As a newbie, you don't want to have to clear jams. The plastic guns are usually better for first time or new shooters. Any of the big name newer guns will be just fine for you.

Finally, always remember the 4 rules of guns. Print this out and keep it with your gun until you can recite them by memory.

The 1st Law - The Gun Is Always Loaded!

So EVERY TIME you pick up or draw a gun, inspect it in a safe manner (control your muzzle) and always treat it as a loaded gun. Alway check to see if it is loaded. Even if someone hands you a gun and they checked it, assume there is a bullet in the chamber and check yourself.

The 2nd Law - Never Point The Gun At Something You Are Not Prepared To Destroy!

The only safe way to operate is to assume the Worst Case Scenario: Pretend that your "empty" gun is loaded and that it's going to function perfectly. When you press the trigger it will FIRE! Since you are prepared for that, you only point the gun in a Safe Direction. This way, when Brainfade does result in an AD, it will be into a safe impact area and there won't be a tragedy.

The 3rd Law - Always Be Sure Of Your Target And What Is Behind It!

Bullets can penetrate lots of things, many of which will surprise you. Identify your target before firing - even before dry-firing at home. If you are not sure, DON'T FIRE! Even though you have checked and double-checked your gun, you should still treat your gun as though it is loaded.

The 4th Law - Keep Your Finger Off The Trigger Until Your Sights Are On The Target!

Almost all of the ADs are caused by a finger on the trigger when you were not ready to fire.

Good Luck.

[VASCAR2]

If you intend on shooting very much it makes a lot of sense to shoot 22 rimfire. Shooting is all about sight alignment and trigger control. This is true whether you are shooting pistol, rifle or shotgun. The pistol I carry the most is a Glock 27 compact 40 S&W and I carry a Glock 22 when in uniform. The pistol I shoot the most is a Glock 22 with an Advantage Arms 22 conversion kit. I usually have an AR 15 close at hand and I also have a couple of dedicated 22 rimfire AR 15's I use for training. I shoot a lot and have shot the biggest and baddest including the 500 S&W, 50 AE, 44 Mag Destert Eagel, 454 Casaull and 475 Linebaugh handguns. I've also shot 50 BMG bolt action rifles 460 Weatherby Magnum and 458 Winchester Magnum. My point is I can tolerate recoil but it really does nothing for my shooting ability and helps induce flinch. My recommendation would be to buy a 22 pistol or revolver and shoot it for the enjoyment. Once you've mastered the 22 and want to take the responsibility to carry concealed and train with a centerfire pistol you will have learned the basics. Like the previous poster stated shooting can become a very enjoyable addictive hobby. Here are some pictures of a few of my guns in 22 rimfire.




Rock Island 1911 with AA 22 conversion slide and different grips






DPMS AR 15 dedicated 22 rimfire upper with E O Tech sight





Savage 22 rimfire bolt action rifle with 3 X 9 AO scope






AKT 98 dedicated 22 rimfire training rifle.

[Milk 1027]

Guys. I know I'm not getting the DE.
What I do want is something for
1. self defense
2. shooting range/plinking.

I am thinking of going to a shooting range and taking a begginer's course before deciding.
I think it will help me make a sound decision and not regret it. But I think I am leaning more towards glock.

Thanks for the help guys.
And if you have anymore suggestions/tips, keep them coming.

[Steppenwolf1980]

I also work as a design teacher at a design school, located in Ferlach/Austria. The headquarters and factory of Glock is about one minute footwalk away from the school and some of my pupils currently are working on a diploma thesis for Glock. They are designing some new accessories for them, so I guess you guys will be able to buy them in 2012.

The school also enjoys a good reputation for its department of weapon/gun technology. We have some workshops, firing range and great connections to some of the best weapon manufacturers.

[MaRoFreK]

Originally Posted by helmincamaro

The FNP/FNX40 is a stretch as a CCW.... Its roughly the same size (according to my hands and eyes) as the full size M&P 40. Depends on where you carry it at and how big you are. I got a Galco shoulder hoster I picked up at a yard sale for $6.... not sure what its made for, but the M&P 40 full size fits great in it (and has 2 spare mags). My only issue with that holster is its made for someone a bit smaller than me, the X piece (don't think thats the technical term) in the back tends to ride high up near my neck.... and if carrying it all day, starts to get uncomfortable (sore on the upper back and neck). I need to play around with it a bit and see if I can make it any bigger/fit better. I got a little under 2 months til I'm 21, so no CCW yet... once I get it, I might look for a better holster. I only use it now when hiking or hunting as a backup weapon. The FNP45..... I'd say absolutely no for just about anybody for CCW.... that thing is THICK! a 15 round magazine in .45ACP.... that takes up a lot of space. I'm thinking about picking up a M&P .40 compact for CCW, just makes it a bit easier to hide than the full size... and the full size mags do fit in the compact... so short in the gun, full size as backups..... sounds like a plan to me. Another good holster option I like is the Galco "summer comfort" holster.... its an IWB (inside the waist-band) holster, has 2 fasteners that clip over the belt and can mount anywhere around you (side, back etc). Comes in both left and right handed, and has a good forward cant to it for a faster draw.


The new Bodyguard series from S&W looks promising to me. The .380 is small for me... hides well, but probably not real comfortable to shoot much (my ring and little finger has to fit under the butt). They also make a 5 shot .38 Special in that series.... both have a laser sight built into the frame with ambi 3 position switches mounted right where your finger rest when its off the trigger (I like it because it helps teach proper trigger control, IE off the trigger til ready to fire). It has ON, Flash, and Off positions, and I can't remember off the top of my head how long it last on a charge, but that sucker is BRIGHT! Fairly cheap too, just wish they'd chamber it in something bigger than .380

I looked into the Colt Defender as a CCW it looks like it might just work. Also looked into a Ruger LCR 357. The Body Guard 380 you mentioned I have already talked to my wife about one of those for her to carry but I might pick on up myself. Im not a huge guy 6' 1" 200lbs but I think i could probably hide that FNX. My dad carrys a M&P 45 but he really dont care about concealing it cause he's a Trooper. But he always told me if I'm gonna carry a pistol to carry a 45,38, or a 357. lol

[helmincamaro]

Originally Posted by MaRoFreK

I looked into the Colt Defender as a CCW it looks like it might just work. Also looked into a Ruger LCR 357. The Body Guard 380 you mentioned I have already talked to my wife about one of those for her to carry but I might pick on up myself. Im not a huge guy 6' 1" 200lbs but I think i could probably hide that FNX. My dad carrys a M&P 45 but he really dont care about concealing it cause he's a Trooper. But he always told me if I'm gonna carry a pistol to carry a 45,38, or a 357. lol

yeah, I agree there... I'd take a .38 special over a .380 anyday. To me, .40 is a happy medium between velocity and bullet mass. A .45 is a big heavy slug that only moves around 850fps if I remember correctly (although it does vary by loading). The .40S&W is a faster velocity round, but its very effective at transfering energy. 9mm is a great penetrator, but in a home defense scenario.... you really don't want a projectile that will penetrate heavily and possibly go through a wall and hit something or someone in the next room. A .40S&W with a Jacketed Hollow point won't travel through most walls, and when it hits someone, they won't go far .


The FNX9 or 40 you could probably conceal in a shoulder or IWB hoster, although the .45 would probably be a bit large and heavy. btw, I'm 6'-2" 195

[MaRoFreK]

Originally Posted by helmincamaro

yeah, I agree there... I'd take a .38 special over a .380 anyday. To me, .40 is a happy medium between velocity and bullet mass. A .45 is a big heavy slug that only moves around 850fps if I remember correctly (although it does vary by loading). The .40S&W is a faster velocity round, but its very effective at transfering energy. 9mm is a great penetrator, but in a home defense scenario.... you really don't want a projectile that will penetrate heavily and possibly go through a wall and hit something or someone in the next room. A .40S&W with a Jacketed Hollow point won't travel through most walls, and when it hits someone, they won't go far .


The FNX9 or 40 you could probably conceal in a shoulder or IWB hoster, although the .45 would probably be a bit large and heavy. btw, I'm 6'-2" 195

I might carry my dads Colt snub nose.38 for awhile and see if i like it. But I think I'll try the Shoulder or IWB hoster and carry my S&W 45 and 40 and see how the 2 feel and go from there. considering we are the same size I'll take your advice lol. Thanks man

[Lawdog1911]

Finally got the Bayonet. Now, I have another toy to look forward to, Kel-Tec 12 Ga Pump with 14+1 capacity.

[helmincamaro]

Originally Posted by MaRoFreK

I might carry my dads Colt snub nose.38 for awhile and see if i like it. But I think I'll try the Shoulder or IWB hoster and carry my S&W 45 and 40 and see how the 2 feel and go from there. considering we are the same size I'll take your advice lol. Thanks man

I checked out the smallest compact 45 M&P a few weeks ago.... there's nothing compact about that thing . The compact in the .45 is almost the same size as the Full sized 9/40/357. Another cool thing about the .40 is its exactly the same as the .357, other than the barrel.... you can actually swap barrels and shoot both from the same gun (.40's much cheaper than .357 sig). The .357sig is overlooked by a lot due to the price of it, but its a really hot round. The .357 actually uses the same magazines as the .40, the back of the case is the same size, its just necked down to .357. Since the military or police don't use the .357 sig, there's not a surplus of brass like 9, .45 or even 40.... so cheap target reloads aren't really an option (unless you load yourself).

[helmincamaro]

Originally Posted by Lawdog1911

Finally got the Bayonet. Now, I have another toy to look forward to, Kel-Tec 12 Ga Pump with 14+1 capacity.

ok, 2 questions..... what shotgun is that.... and where the hell did you get that knife??? Hard to tell in the pics, but it looks a lot like the Mossberg 500 or 590. I got a 500, that knife is wicked!

[bob vogel]

Originally Posted by VASCAR2

If you intend on shooting very much it makes a lot of sense to shoot 22 rimfire. Shooting is all about sight alignment and trigger control. This is true whether you are shooting pistol, rifle or shotgun. The pistol I carry the most is a Glock 27 compact 40 S&W and I carry a Glock 22 when in uniform. The pistol I shoot the most is a Glock 22 with an Advantage Arms 22 conversion kit. I usually have an AR 15 close at hand and I also have a couple of dedicated 22 rimfire AR 15's I use for training. I shoot a lot and have shot the biggest and baddest including the 500 S&W, 50 AE, 44 Mag Destert Eagel, 454 Casaull and 475 Linebaugh handguns. I've also shot 50 BMG bolt action rifles 460 Weatherby Magnum and 458 Winchester Magnum. My point is I can tolerate recoil but it really does nothing for my shooting ability and helps induce flinch. My recommendation would be to buy a 22 pistol or revolver and shoot it for the enjoyment. Once you've mastered the 22 and want to take the responsibility to carry concealed and train with a centerfire pistol you will have learned the basics. Like the previous poster stated shooting can become a very enjoyable addictive hobby. Here are some pictures of a few of my guns in 22 rimfire.




Rock Island 1911 with AA 22 conversion slide and different grips






DPMS AR 15 dedicated 22 rimfire upper with E O Tech sight





Savage 22 rimfire bolt action rifle with 3 X 9 AO scope






AKT 98 dedicated 22 rimfire training rifle.

this is very well said and to the point. i've been shooting since i was 5 yrs old, start out with a 22 and still have fun with a 22 and it's 55 yrs later.

[MaRoFreK]

Originally Posted by helmincamaro

I checked out the smallest compact 45 M&P a few weeks ago.... there's nothing compact about that thing . The compact in the .45 is almost the same size as the Full sized 9/40/357. Another cool thing about the .40 is its exactly the same as the .357, other than the barrel.... you can actually swap barrels and shoot both from the same gun (.40's much cheaper than .357 sig). The .357sig is overlooked by a lot due to the price of it, but its a really hot round. The .357 actually uses the same magazines as the .40, the back of the case is the same size, its just necked down to .357. Since the military or police don't use the .357 sig, there's not a surplus of brass like 9, .45 or even 40.... so cheap target reloads aren't really an option (unless you load yourself).

I thought it was the .38 and .357 Cause i know with dads 357 we use 38+p rounds. And the 9mm is close to the .380 but there is a slight difference to were you can't use them in the same gun. And I know you can use a 38 round in a .357 but can't use a .357 round in a .38 cause the difference in lenght.

[Lawdog1911]

Originally Posted by helmincamaro

ok, 2 questions..... what shotgun is that.... and where the hell did you get that knife??? Hard to tell in the pics, but it looks a lot like the Mossberg 500 or 590. I got a 500, that knife is wicked!

Mossberg 590 and the knife is from Ebay. I like this one cause it looks really aggressive.