[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by Idaho2018GTPremium

All the reviews have talked about how awesome the car is on a track and curvy roads, and not focused as much on the 1/4 mile times. Why else would both C&D and MT compare it to a 911 GT2 RS? I think it was MT that said it has a good chance of winning the best driver's car next year - and it will get compared to super cars in that competition.

The C8's 11.1 is impressive and no doubt helped massively by the ME layout, but the base GT500's 133 mph trap speed is more impressive, at $74k whether you like Evan's 10.6 sec run or not (975' DA). No other car in the world comes close to that 133 mph trap speed for the same money. The very best Redeye test I've seen is 128 mph. Slap some slicks on the GT500 and it's likely a low 10 sec. car. Slap some slicks on the C8 Z51 and it's still a 11.1 sec car (or maybe 11.0).

Or another scenario - a C8 Z51 pulls up next to a base GT500 at 40 mph on the highway...what happens? The GT500 will destroy it, indicated by the +10 mph trap speed in the 1/4 mile. It will also beat a Hellcat, ZL1, GTR, M5/AMG vehicles, Viper GTS, C7 Z06, 911 Turbo, 911 GT3, Audi R8 V10, C6 ZR1, etc. in that scenario. It traps more speed than all of them and is cheaper than most of them. Short of a Demon, C7 ZR1, and current exotic supercars, nothing will touch it on the road. And this isn't me being biased, it's just numbers. I love all of those cars, esp. the Viper, 911 Turbo, and the C7 Z06. I wouldn't be surprised if it was just as fast as the Demon in that scenario, and if the GT500 happened to get a slight jump on a ZR1 from a roll, the ZR1 may not even be able to reel it in before shutting down.

It's that freaking fast; for $74k, and it will hold it's own very well on a road course (unlike the Dodge offerings). Now, according to some of the people who have driven it, the CFTP is essentially a super car for $93k.

On top of its acceleration potential, according to people that drive and test cars for a living, it's mind blowing on a race track.

I'm excited, if you couldn't tell.

It is impressive to you. In your opinion. Don't try to tell me that I should be impressed with it. I'm not. And that is in my opinion. I don't care what Evans does in that car just like I didn't care what he did in the 18 GT. He impresses me even less.

Sure the GT500 will outrun a C8 Z51...up until 180 MPH that is. After which the Vette will catch up, walk past it, disappear in front of it, and the GT500 will never be seen again. But see one at a light and the $94K CF GT500 will get utterly embarrassed by a $65K Corvette!!

The reviews talked about how well it handles on the road. But again, that is only in the opinions from the reviewers. There is no data at this point on how well it actually performs on a track. I don't care how well they say it is on track, until they post the numbers their opinions and $1 is worth a Snickers bar.

I'm glad you're excited. Good for you. Personally, I don't care about any cars I don't own or don't plan to own. If you're that happy for the GT500 then you do you. But don't sit here thinking I'm gonna do the Blue Oval song and dance with you. The GT500 does not impress me one bit.

Originally Posted by bobby35ny

GM doesn't have to respond, if they do we a F***ked pricewise.
The Ford guys can brag all they want because it seems like money in no object for them.

I paid 58k+ tax for my car. similar Gt500 without ALL my options would cost me 87k+ tax. Why would we want to pay $30k more for a GT500?

$87K MSRP. But you're not going to get one at MSRP. Which is a shame. I actually wanted one and held out for one. I was going to add it to my ZL1 and HC. But the price disappointed me. And the dealerships already started adding markups months ago. It became a lottery. If you wanted one you had to get in contact with a dealership selling one and hope you got to them early enough to buy the allocation. Most allocations were sold separately from MSRP and are not getting deducted from the MSRP. So that is $5K to $10K down the drain already. On top of that some dealerships were also adding a markup. So that is an extra $5K to $10K. At that point your chances of getting on another list are slim to none. If you did get lucky enough to get on a second list then you'd have to worry if they had markups too and if those markups were higher than the previous dealership's. So a lot of people dropped out from the list. But these cars are all still going to sell and the dealerships WILL get their markups. Some already had contracts signed up to $20K weeks to months ago, lol!!

Originally Posted by RobbyBeefcake87

They praised it as it seems to be a great car but it is odd how they basically interchanged the positives of the carbon fiber track pack and the base as if they were the same. They pretty much said the base slides around all over the place but that's ok lol. Maybe the cftp just blew their skirts up that hard that they forgave the base for it's fault or the fun factor of the whole press event got them hyped lol.

...the most likely scenario...

Originally Posted by Idaho2018GTPremium

You should know me, I own up when I am wrong. We were talking about the drag times, and I meant the ones that were running on the drag strip were all base models since we were talking about the drag strip times. The track got the CFTP vehicles.

I didn't speculate it ran 10s. I was told by people who were there it ran 10s. There's a difference between being informed by those in the know and speculating. Now we know it ran 10.89 @ 4,100' DA. And 10.61 @ 133 mph at 975' DA.

You didn't own up and you still haven't. I don't care what you meant because I can't read minds. I posted exactly what you said. If you meant something different than what you said then that is your fault. And regardless of what you were told, you commented on something that you had no proof of and behaved as if it was etched in granite by Moses. I expressed my doubts which I had every right to and you started trash talking. I don't care who says it ran 10s at that time. There was absolutely no proof posted anywhere that it did. You took their word for it because you are a Mustang fan and that is fine. I am not a Mustang fan. Yet you think your doubts and opinions are the only ones that matter.

Originally Posted by Idaho2018GTPremium

You think the reviewers love it because of the 1/4 mile? Did you read the articles that talked about it's handling and balance?

No I didn't because I couldn't care less what a reviewer has to say about a car they'll drive a handful of times and never again. They can sing it's praises to high heavens and to me it is just a stranger's opinion.

Originally Posted by Idaho2018GTPremium

You're delusional if you think the objective performance data shows the ZL1 as a superior sports car. The GT500 is already running mid 10s at 133 mph. How is that objectively worse than the ZL1 1/4 mile performance? Track tests haven't come out so that is TBD.

Price, availability, performance. The only data you have for the GT500 is that it costs $74K MSRP, it's top speed is 180, and that it is faster in the quarter mile. You have nothing other than that except some rabid reviewer who pretty much is frothing at the mouth. The ZL1 has a 202 MPH top speed with an official top speed of 198 MPH. It has track times out. And it can be had at MSRP of $64K or below MSRP based on "heavy discounts" like newmoon likes to say. If you want a ZL1 you can buy one. On the other hand, face it, you are not getting a GT500 any time soon. So based on all the info we have available right now, the ZL1 is superior.

[RagingHawk]

I'll take a C7 Z06 over this new GT500 any day. A lighter true coupe with a 7 speed manual is going to be more fun on the streets of Michigan where the roads are so patchy and uneven that you can't put the power down in most places.

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by newmoon

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Sorry you can't use the data from the fast list as there is absolutely no proof that the cars were in fact 100% stock. Way to easy to be hiding mods tunes, E85, etc, etc. Go back and read the early ZL1 forums and the issues everyone was having trying to get the cars to 60', then a few claim to figure it out and magically gain 3-5 tenths over what everyone else is running. Following that even ZL1 with dragpacks couldn't duplicate those times.

Not for nothin, but Evans is testing the GT500 privately at a track. So there is no way to tell if he is lying or hiding mods either. Especially when he is known to modify cars in a certain manner and call it "stock". He is not on the same level as MT or C&D. So don't try to paint him as such. The statement made was that Evans run is more closely compared to the fast lists since he is not an official reviewing source either.

But I will give you this, I am willing to count Evans run as official IF and only IF someone tests both cars on the same track and same day. The results from same day same track testing stands as to what the difference is between them as opposed to what Evans runs on his private track compared to mag runs. But I'm betting you wanna count Evans special and compare it to whatever MT gets from the C8 and ZL1...that way you can be happy and claim the GT500 runs a 10.6 to the C8's and the ZL1's 11.7 or 11.5 or whatever you claim they struggled to get out of the ZL1...

[SlitherByU]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

Dodge still has the sale going on for the Hellcats and Redeyes. The Hellcats get a $7170 discount off MSRP and the Redeyes get a $7970 discount off MSRP. I do not think they will do more than that. The fact of the matter is that their sales are not in any danger. The GT500 is very limited in production, will carry huge markups, and are not going to be available at this point. The allocations are all gone. And any allocations that may be available likely have a waiting list 10 people deep. And my bet is that the dealerships are going to sell to the highest bidder. This is all in comparison to going to any of several dealerships right now and buying a Redeye with an original MSRP of $92K for only $84K and driving off immediately. So they will be fine. But my hope is that they do offer an extra little incentive. Maybe if they do, maybe just maybe I'll budge and get one!!!!

Couple things. The CF Track Pack is very limited. Nothing about the Base GT500 is said to be limited. Ford will probably pump out 5k of the Bases. I just talked to a dealer with an allocation still available for a Base at $15k ADM. I wasn't interested in it I was just looking at a truck and we got to talking Shelby's. As far as Shelby's go, Ford has always had that dedicated following for their higher end Mustang Platform. They'll sell them and people will pay ADM's now and they'll still command mostly MSRP for Bases on into the next two years. There will always be the outlier dealerships who decide they need to move metal eventually and undoubtedly some folks will get a nice deal under MSRP in a year or so. Patience and good search skills can surely bring reward. I'm proof of that with getting my R under MSRP.

[Laststandard]

Can't wait for Motortrend to dyno the GT500 and report 900 to the wheels

[LostM]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

The thing is that the Redeye has a drag race setup. It was built specifically for drag racing and has some Demon features. The ZR1 is extremely lightweight. The GT500 has neither of those things going for it. It is not lightweight and it is not drag specific. Also it does not have the HP Redeye nor the TQ of the Redeye and ZR1. I think it will be fast with a tire. But I don't think we'll see it match what those cars can do.

lol

Originally Posted by RobbyBeefcake87

Anybody who calls the zl1 and 11.4 or 11.5 car should refer to the gt500 as an 11.2 car. Because that 10.6 run is no different than a 10.9 hero run four tu e zl1 on the fast list or the zr1s 10.2 fast list time.

what about 10.8/ & 10.9 s at 130+ from other drivers in vegas? I was there

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

I hope GM does not try to respond with the Camaro in this Gen. That is the mistake Ford made with the S550 which is ultimately why they had to wait 6 years for something remotely respectable. The ZL1 proved itself. At it's price and for what you get it is still the king. GM needs to continue what they do best, keep moving forward.

Your faculties must be diminished. You gave incorrect info about the track event. You said there were only Base GT500s and you were wrong. Posted in case you try to lie.

There were Base AND CF GT500s there. Which I said. Then I posted this
Nothing I said was incorrect because I said "maybe" and "perhaps". I said nothing definitive about what was ran. At that event they did not say which version of the GT500 was ran and they only posted 2 runs...one was 11.07 and the other was a slower time. You then speculated that one ran 10s. There was no proof of that at the time because nobody was allowed to post that info. So you made speculations and I did as well. Nowhere did I make a definitive statement on what was ran. So your criticism is a bit uncalled for when you did the exact same effing thing bro. You're just mad because my speculation was contrary to yours and you want us over here to play cheerleader to the GT500. Ain't gonna happen.
You seem like that is something you want to believe. And that is fine with me.

yes, base for the strip, cftp for the roadcourse. they are fast, very very fast. some of the fastest cars ive been in, and its been plenty

If acknowledgement is what you want then sure, the reviewers seem to be madly in love with the GT500 based solely off what it did in the quarter mile. Taking nothing else into account the car performed as well as a 760 HP Mustang that costs $74K should perform. So congrats to Ford for building a GT500 that did what it should do.
thanks, they deserve the credit

The reviewers also seemed very disappointed in how the C8 Z51 performed. It ran 11.1 with only 495 HP and can be had for $65K and it beat the outgoing Z51 around a track by almost a full second as well as almost a full second in the quarter mile. But the understeer which prevented them from drifting the car around a corner and the reduced braking ability relegated the C8 to basically a piece of crap that GM could have made much better despite the price tag and inherent costs of switching to a ME design.

LOL! Just joking to show you what a petty statement would look like.

I'm not concerned with any subjective views on any of these cars shaffe and you know that. I've not once taken those statements seriously even when it was in favor of the Camaro. Like when they posted favorably in regards to how the SLE feels compared to the GT PP2. I never took those statements to be anything other than someone else's opinion. You know that fully well also. I have always taken the objective data as being the only relevant information for me. And I have always stated that the performance of these cars is all that matters. The objective data and the performance so far shows the Z51 and the ZL1 as being superior cars to the GT500. I have not seen anything to change my mind on that. If you'd care to debate it then I'll do so. But don't try to paint me as some petty whiny punk who is mad about a favorable review for the GT500. Hell, they loved the GT350R and placed it as the winner of the H2H and I've acknowledged that time and again. In fact I am glad that they love the GT500 as much as they do. Ford has been soo far behind the game for soo long that they need this win. Good for them. But you need to give me some credit here man.

Originally Posted by RagingHawk

I think we're looking at a minimum of 100K OTD to get into the base GT500. All the way up to 130K OTD for the Track Pack. Which is a lot of money. And I'm not the type to put down a car like this for the price then turn around and tell you a 90K Cayman is worth it. Neither are worth those price tags to me. But that's because I don't see a reason to spend more than 100K on a car like I used to as a kid. If I'm spending anything more than 100K it has to be a special two door coupe with a weight well below 4200 LB's.... Something like a C7 Z06 or something very flashy like an Hurucan or McLaren GT.

mine was 83 + 3k tax.

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

The best it did so far was 11.1 and I think that was at 121 or 122 MPH.

what about 10.8/ & 10.9 s at 130+ from other drivers in vegas? I was there
I notice that whenever they run a Mustang they make sure to detail every single thing that might make it look better. 10 MPH Headwind, humidity, whatever. When the ZL1 ran 11.4 we didn't hear any excuses on why. When the C8 did 11.1 I don't remember any details on the run. So the GT500 did a 11 flat period. Plain and simple. If it happens to go faster at some other point in time then so be it. But to sit here trying to make it look better than what it looks like is silly.

yes, i like the data, not unlike SAE dynojet corrections.. lol at 550hp c8+121 trap speed

Not for nothin, but at this point it is only 4 tenths faster than the ZL1, 1 tenth faster than the C8 Z51, a little over 1 tenth slower than the C7 Z06, and slower than the ZR1. Each of those cars with exception of the ZR1 and Z06 is significantly cheaper BTW (Z06 is right around the same price). And it is slower than the RE and slower than what we have seen from the Hellcat.

I would say at this point it ain't lookin good for the GT500 if the best it could do is 11 flat. If it gets a 10.9 then that still isn't really all too impressive. It is even worse if that is the CF version which I assume it is since they don't mention it.

base is faster in the 1/4 than cftp

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

Neither did the GT500.

yes it did, several times

[newmoon]

Originally Posted by RagingHawk

I think we're looking at a minimum of 100K OTD to get into the base GT500. All the way up to 130K OTD for the Track Pack. Which is a lot of money. And I'm not the type to put down a car like this for the price then turn around and tell you a 90K Cayman is worth it. Neither are worth those price tags to me. But that's because I don't see a reason to spend more than 100K on a car like I used to as a kid. If I'm spending anything more than 100K it has to be a special two door coupe with a weight well below 4200 LB's.... Something like a C7 Z06 or something very flashy like an Hurucan or McLaren GT.

The dealer who I just purchased my GT350 from sold their GT500 base allocation at MSRP + $2,500.00. No where near 100k. The CF models will command the big ADMs just as the GT350R did, the base models will be much more reasonable.

[newmoon]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

Not for nothin, but Evans is testing the GT500 privately at a track. So there is no way to tell if he is lying or hiding mods either. Especially when he is known to modify cars in a certain manner and call it "stock". He is not on the same level as MT or C&D. So don't try to paint him as such. The statement made was that Evans run is more closely compared to the fast lists since he is not an official reviewing source either.

But I will give you this, I am willing to count Evans run as official IF and only IF someone tests both cars on the same track and same day. The results from same day same track testing stands as to what the difference is between them as opposed to what Evans runs on his private track compared to mag runs. But I'm betting you wanna count Evans special and compare it to whatever MT gets from the C8 and ZL1...that way you can be happy and claim the GT500 runs a 10.6 to the C8's and the ZL1's 11.7 or 11.5 or whatever you claim they struggled to get out of the ZL1...

I know this the car ran 10:80s and 90s @ 131+mph in bad DA at a track that is known to be significantly slower than east coast tracks, after running pass after pass all day and not being allowed be shut off or cooled down. I have no doubt in good DA, good track prep, and given time to properly cool between passes this car will run similar times, maybe even better once the negative DA sets in.

Also I never claimed the ZL1 only ran a 11.7 or a 11.5, I don't recall who but somebody got a 11.4 out of it.

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by LostM

lol

Originally Posted by LostM

base is faster in the 1/4 than cftp

Nobody knew that when I made that comment.

Originally Posted by LostM

yes it did, several times

There was no proof when I made that comment. I'm not sure what points you're trying to make...

Originally Posted by newmoon

The dealer who I just purchased my GT350 from sold their GT500 base allocation at MSRP + $2,500.00. No where near 100k. The CF models will command the big ADMs just as the GT350R did, the base models will be much more reasonable.

I've seen examples of Base GT500s with up to $20K markups.

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by newmoon

I know this the car ran 10:80s and 90s @ 131+mph in bad DA at a track that is known to be significantly slower than east coast tracks, after running pass after pass all day and not being allowed be shut off or cooled down. I have no doubt in good DA, good track prep, and given time to properly cool between passes this car will run similar times, maybe even better once the negative DA sets in.

Also I never claimed the ZL1 only ran a 11.7 or a 11.5, I don't recall who but somebody got a 11.4 out of it.

I want to see what the GT500 and C8 and ZL1 all do when tested together. The C8 has already hit an 11.1. It can do better. And I think it can beat the GT500 in the quarter mile if both are mag tested.

[RagingHawk]

Originally Posted by LostM

mine was 83 + 3k tax.

Is that a promise for an allocation or an actual order? If it is an actual order then congrats to you, it is a great performing car and fits lots of peoples needs. Me personally I just would prefer lighter sports cars after my experience with the 5th gen Camaro.

[RagingHawk]

Originally Posted by newmoon

The dealer who I just purchased my GT350 from sold their GT500 base allocation at MSRP + $2,500.00. No where near 100k. The CF models will command the big ADMs just as the GT350R did, the base models will be much more reasonable.

Well that's crazy if it is only a 3k adm, everywhere else it seems to be 10-20K for the base. It's still an expensive car though, lol.

[LostM]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

Nobody knew that when I made that comment.
We all knew it. Well, thos of us that pay attention
There was no proof when I made that comment. I'm not sure what points you're trying to make...
Owens said it months ago, and repeated it on every occasion
I've seen examples of Base GT500s with up to $20K markups.

And? Realistically, most are paying sticker. Not oit fault the car is so phenomenal and in high demand the market corrects itself.

There is no single car in its price range, currently, that can hold a candle to it. All around world class performance at an affordable price

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by LostM

We all knew it. Well, thos of us that pay attention

No you didn't. Don't try to BS anyone. I've been following this car since day one. On every FB group and page and forum where this car was discussed the general consensus was that the CF version would be faster. However, since the Base is faster, it's kinda dumb that anyone would pay an extra $20K to have a slower car.

Originally Posted by LostM

Owens said it months ago, and repeated it on every occasion

I don't give a flying eff what Owens said. I don't even know who the Hell he is. At the time I made those comments, there was no proof posted anywhere that it ran a 10. Since you know soo much, where were you when these discussions were taking place? Now all of a sudden you show up after the fact talking about what you knew days ago? Sure bro.

Originally Posted by LostM

And? Realistically, most are paying sticker. Not oit fault the car is so phenomenal and in high demand the market corrects itself.

You realize you just completely contradicted yourself right?

No, it isn't your fault that the car is in high demand. It IS your fault if you're dumb enough to pay extra for it.

Originally Posted by LostM

There is no single car in its price range, currently, that can hold a candle to it. All around world class performance at an affordable price