[Revalot]

If GM produce a 1000 hp camaro, a 1200 hp corvette, and kept upping hp by a large margin, how would they be able to study R and D research, would you pay 80K, then 100K a few years later ?
They want people to come back, time and time again. If someone gives you all they have up front why would you come back ? Supply and demand !

[Rnovrit]

Originally Posted by 2010REDSS

You nailed it.

The Ford boys choked on their own spit when the ZL1 1LE debuted....they are still scrambling to get a GT500 that can top it.....and stay in one piece.

Every track event I'm at a GT350 grenades. The Voodoo can't stay together on the track.

Dodge is making some great cars....great in a straight line that is. They have nothing that corners.

Chevy is doing really well in the current muscle car wars. Imagine having your "best" Mustang ever topped by Team Camaro one year later and still trying to figure out how to catch up.

I want an even more badass 6th Gen too.....don't get me wrong.....but we have lots to be happy about.

Just my $0.02.

This comment makes me smile for a couple reasons. First is it is completely true. The ZL1 1LE is definitely ahead of the competition if looking at the big picture. The other part that also makes me laugh is the Ford guys comment. I have always been appreciative of all makes of muscle cars though I come from the mustang crowd. I sold my low mileage modified 03 Cobra to get the Camaro. It is very interesting being on both sides of the equation. I will say that after a lot of research, the camaro appears to better in most sections compared to the new mustangs. Neither is a bad choice but the camaro seams to just be better sorted. Just the view of a Ford guy that jumped ship and bought an awesome car.

[Richard0nee]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

Hellcat...slower than the ZL1 stock for stock by almost a half a second.

717 HP Hellcat...not even out yet.

GT500...not even out yet. And it won't be available until MY 2020 at which point the ZL1 will have been out for 3 MYs. The GT500 by all means should be faster.

Redeye...not even out yet. And MSRP with gas guzzler tax is $71,350 which is almost $10K more expensive than the ZL1. On top of it not being available until 2019 MY at which point the ZL1 will have been out for 2 MYs. Plus the ZL1 will destroy it around a track.

So what I don't get is why everyone is freaking out. GM built the ZL1 to such devastating specs that the competition too 2 MYs (3 for the GT500) to catch up. And in each case they each cost much more than the ZL1 does. One of those cars, the Hellcat/Redeye, will only be able to beat the ZL1 in a straight line and that is IF it can. I have my doubts. If it does it will probably be by only about 2 tenths which makes it a driver's race. The GT500 might beat the ZL1 in a straight line too but it won't touch the ZL1 1LE around a track. And still, IT TOOK 3 YEARS TO BEAT THE ZL1!! And I repeat, each of these cars cost way more than the standard ZL1.

Basically, GM is building cars that perform as well or better than the competition and at a lower price and with full options. So no, we do not need more HP. GM is working on the 7th Gen which will again shatter everyone and leave them playing catch up for 2-4 years. Now am I interested in a Redeye? Sure. Might I get one? I think so. GT500? Nah. But would I give up my ZL1 for either of these? Nope. Maybe for a Z06 or ZR1 but nothing else. But right now and for this segment in Muscle/Pony Car history the ZL1 is the absolute king.

Good points love it! All those cars can't touch the ZL1 in terms of going to the drags and at the tracks. GM makes a car that does both, which is not easy to do.

I do give credit to Dodge that they can make a crazy drag car and a track car.. But see how much that ACR cost though. GT350r can track but falls way short in the drags (of course we know it's not meant for it).

ZL1 best bang for your buck than can do well in drags and at the tracks. The overall combination of the ZL1/ZL1 1LE is unmatched for now in terms of drag, tracks and price.

Only car that can do better is the big brother Z06 and ZR1.

GM doesn't need more power.

[Boost or bust]

Originally Posted by Chris Edwards

No, what GM should be focusing on isn't more power, it's better quality control.

Fuc*ing BIG time! Agreed!

[kttxz06]

Originally Posted by kropscamaro16

lol 650 isnt enough for you? then get a tune or different pulley or e85 and you will be up there with those guys

That.



But then, if the other cars do the same, I guess you are still out classed. Eh, at the end of the day, it's about the $. Anyone can make any of those cars beat the other. It just depends on how far you want to push it.



Stock for stock tho. No way would I give up the Zl1 for any of those.

[RSFR]

Dropping the LT5 into the ZL1 would be a fairly easy and straight forward solution for GM to give the Camaro an extra bump.

[Can'tHave2MuchHP]

Originally Posted by RSFR

Dropping the LT5 into the ZL1 would be a fairly easy and straight forward solution for GM to give the Camaro an extra bump.

No, not it wouldn't be. It would require an entire re-engineering of 50%+ of the car and that's not what we need at model year 3-4.

I'd rather they put the time and money into an EVEN BETTER Gen 7 Camaro that's hopefully LIGHTER (No models crossing 4000 pounds wet). If they can find a way to take 300 pounds off this thing, it would be an animal. And before you bring up Vettes, Vettes need to go on a big time diet too. They're way too heavy and that's honestly why their performance is a bit mediocre compared to the current Supercar lineup. With a ZR1 pushing 3600-3700 pounds, its really getting away from its roots. Corvettes need to be in the 3000-3100 pound range MAX and Camaros in the 3600-3800 range. It's time to start upping the build quality, transmissions (DCTs!!!), and engine capability too (TT V8s). If they do that, they'll be ridiculously ahead of every car in the game that's even $200,000 away in price. Of course, all wishful thinking.

The C8 Corvette is getting active aero, DCT transmissions, and TT V8s, that I know for sure. Even AWD rumored in the ZR1 model.

Why do you think the McLaren 720S is so fast? Sure it makes a lot of power, but it WAY over performs for it's 680-700 RWHP. High 9s, pulls on 1000 HP cars on the highway, walks away from any Super car like it's nothing. Aero, weight, TT V8. The secret sauce.

[IneedAZ]

Originally Posted by Can'tHave2MuchHP

Why do you think the McLaren 720S is so fast? Sure it makes a lot of power, but it WAY over performs for it's 680-700 RWHP. High 9s, pulls on 1000 HP cars on the highway, walks away from any Super car like it's nothing. Aero, weight, TT V8. The secret sauce.

I think for half that money i would do a resto mod 68 or 69 Camaro

[EDFHOBBIES]

its coming the mustang and others already have DI and port injection.. so far only the vette I bet we see that lt5 in camaro soon

[IneedAZ]

Originally Posted by EDFHOBBIES

its coming the mustang and others already have DI and port injection.. so far only the vette I bet we see that lt5 in camaro soon

I would buy a LT5 Camaro if they can not add weight doing it. I will be looking to add another car in 2020.

[WCKD 1LE]

*Sneeze* ZR1

I think they did.

[Johnny Camaro]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

Hellcat...slower than the ZL1 stock for stock by almost a half a second.

717 HP Hellcat...not even out yet.

GT500...not even out yet. And it won't be available until MY 2020 at which point the ZL1 will have been out for 3 MYs. The GT500 by all means should be faster.

Redeye...not even out yet. And MSRP with gas guzzler tax is $71,350 which is almost $10K more expensive than the ZL1. On top of it not being available until 2019 MY at which point the ZL1 will have been out for 2 MYs. Plus the ZL1 will destroy it around a track.

So what I don't get is why everyone is freaking out. GM built the ZL1 to such devastating specs that the competition too 2 MYs (3 for the GT500) to catch up. And in each case they each cost much more than the ZL1 does. One of those cars, the Hellcat/Redeye, will only be able to beat the ZL1 in a straight line and that is IF it can. I have my doubts. If it does it will probably be by only about 2 tenths which makes it a driver's race. The GT500 might beat the ZL1 in a straight line too but it won't touch the ZL1 1LE around a track. And still, IT TOOK 3 YEARS TO BEAT THE ZL1!! And I repeat, each of these cars cost way more than the standard ZL1.

Basically, GM is building cars that perform as well or better than the competition and at a lower price and with full options. So no, we do not need more HP. GM is working on the 7th Gen which will again shatter everyone and leave them playing catch up for 2-4 years. Now am I interested in a Redeye? Sure. Might I get one? I think so. GT500? Nah. But would I give up my ZL1 for either of these? Nope. Maybe for a Z06 or ZR1 but nothing else. But right now and for this segment in Muscle/Pony Car history the ZL1 is the absolute king.

That's why I said with the refresh 2019 Camaro --->> also not even out yet. But it will be together with the Hell Cat and the Red eye so that's why I started this. ( they say this fall they will come)
Ok it was in the lead for those couple of model years ...so now when the competition steps up I would expected a upgrade on the refresh model what is relatively easy to do.
And it is maybe different bc I like the vert here in SWFL I don't do track days with it I just want awesome power when I floor it on the road the more the better with warranty. How many of the ZL1 guys do track days anyways, they bought the 1LE right.
That being said also as a daily American roads are famous about not having many curves anyways so for a Red Eye it will be "easy" to outrun the Camaro. All I'm asking is 75 more horsies without a whole redesign of the car, just to keep up (out run) the competition.
BTW track imo is overrated bc that's all about the driver and less about the car or you have to be at the track almost every day.

[Aliveguy5]

This has to be a troll job guys don't bite.

Originally Posted by Johnny Camaro

IMO GM is getting behind on the hp scale between his competitors top models.
717hp Hell Cat,797hp Hell Cat Red Eye, 750+?hp Mustang GT 500, why didn't GM put a little more horsies in the Camaro refresh to keep up a little ( like just over 700).
And before you guys talk and the ZO6 then ?? Do the same upgrade the engine can handle that easily anyways and would have give us the consumers more raison not to shop anywhere else for more hp under warranty right ?

So GM if you're reading this step up it's not to late !!
I want to buy the refresh Camaro ZL1 vert in the fall (now driving the 2013 ZL1 vert with 87.000) Bring me the exiting news ASAP.

[Chris Edwards]

Originally Posted by Can'tHave2MuchHP

No, not it wouldn't be. It would require an entire re-engineering of 50%+ of the car and that's not what we need at model year 3-4.

I'd rather they put the time and money into an EVEN BETTER Gen 7 Camaro that's hopefully LIGHTER (No models crossing 4000 pounds wet). If they can find a way to take 300 pounds off this thing, it would be an animal. And before you bring up Vettes, Vettes need to go on a big time diet too. They're way too heavy and that's honestly why their performance is a bit mediocre compared to the current Supercar lineup. With a ZR1 pushing 3600-3700 pounds, its really getting away from its roots. Corvettes need to be in the 3000-3100 pound range MAX and Camaros in the 3600-3800 range. It's time to start upping the build quality, transmissions (DCTs!!!), and engine capability too (TT V8s). If they do that, they'll be ridiculously ahead of every car in the game that's even $200,000 away in price. Of course, all wishful thinking.

The C8 Corvette is getting active aero, DCT transmissions, and TT V8s, that I know for sure. Even AWD rumored in the ZR1 model.

Why do you think the McLaren 720S is so fast? Sure it makes a lot of power, but it WAY over performs for it's 680-700 RWHP. High 9s, pulls on 1000 HP cars on the highway, walks away from any Super car like it's nothing. Aero, weight, TT V8. The secret sauce.

First off, there is a direct correlation between curb weight and price. Making mass produced vehicles like the Camaro and Corvette significantly lighter is simply not going to happen. Emissions standards get stricter, crash test certifications get more complicated, and amenities keep being added.

Even writing McLaren and Camaro in the same sentence is a joke LOL. A Camaro is a pavement pounding, block rockin' redneck tire spinner with poorly fitting bumpers and headliners and a fantastic motor (if the oil pump doesn't go out) and the price to match.