[Tremek]

Yes, read the posts above, we discussed that, a GT is $25k and a Premium is $31k.

Examples:
$25k GT
$31k GT Premium (I called the dealer and verified this is real)
$34k GT Performance Package - while on the phone I asked the dealer if they had any perf pack cars, and this is at their sister store

If anyone is aware of a way to get a '18 2SS 1LE <$40k, please let me know. Otherwise, as I do this research, I won't lie - I think I'm going to go drive a GT tonight...

[Zodiac]

Originally Posted by Tremek

Yes, read the posts above, we discussed that, a GT is $25k and a Premium is $31k.

Examples:
$25k GT
$31k GT Premium (I called the dealer and verified this is real)
$34k GT Performance Package - while on the phone I asked the dealer if they had any perf pack cars, and this is at their sister store

If anyone is aware of a way to get a '18 2SS 1LE <$40k, please let me know. Otherwise, as I do this research, I won't lie - I think I'm going to go drive a GT tonight...

As a previous owner of a 15 GT it's a hell of a car for the money and leaves you with plenty saved to mod to your liking if that's your thing.

[ICEing]

Eh 31k for a GT might as well buy a barely used SS.

That Roush Mustang is quite tempting though. I don't live anywhere near that dealership but I suppose I could have it shipped .

[Skerj]

Originally Posted by ICEing

Eh 31k for a GT might as well buy a barely used SS.

At least to me, that's not an apples to apples comparison for purchase, and I bet many others would feel the same. No matter how you slice it, a V8 from Ford is cheaper than a V8 from Chevy, when on a similar mileage or useage. Basically you can get a better performing car for more money up front or pay less and have a car that is still pretty good. We'll see what the refresh brings though when both have likely similar power as well as adjustable suspension and dual mode exhaust.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by Tremek

Who cares what MSRP is, when the cars are widely available at a significant discount? This is my point re: MSRPs (and frankly it applies to Ford as well as GM) - the MSRP is irrelevant when the cars transact at a far lower price.

Yes, but this conversation seems to be about an MSRP price drop. Hard to compare apples to apples at that point....

[SS 1LE]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

Yes, but this conversation seems to be about an MSRP price drop. Hard to compare apples to apples at that point....

Agreed, this thread turned into total fail. Comparing MSRP's to fully discounted cars with rebates and incentives you may not even qualify for...makes no sense.

[Tremek]

Originally Posted by SS 1LE

Agreed, this thread turned into total fail. Comparing MSRP's to fully discounted cars with rebates and incentives you may not even qualify for...makes no sense.

What? Those GTs transact all day at these prices and have since 2011. The very fact that Chevy isn't even offering anything compelling in turn on the Camaro right now AND is far more expensive are two (very valid) strikes against them.

[IMadeYouReadThis]

It's fine I bought the V6 Camaro for more than I could have got a V8 Mustang for but the Camaro was just a better car. The Mustang is not in the same category at this point. I could have also got an RT Challenger still the V6 Camaro is a better car. The SS Camaro is in a completely different League it is a beast on wheels the Mustang and Challenger have nothing on it

[Tremek]

That's, uh... A lot of hyperbole. The cars are direct competitors. No doubt the SS is a better car, but by inches, not miles. I haven't paid any attention to the V6 Camaros, but it looks like they start around $21k. I'd be mightily tempted to look at a $25k GT for a V8 if I was in that market.

SS 1LE: I went digging to see if there's anything to people not qualifying for the incentives, and it looks to be pretty common for people to get $5-10k off MSRP.

In other news, I spoke with a Chevy dealer today and while dealers typically know nothing, the guy I spoke with mentioned that Chevy seems to be upping the frequency of incentives announcements to 2-3 times a month. He implied that he would not be surprised if significant incentives were announced on many, or all 2017 Chevy models, "soon" (next few months.)

If Chevy also drops the MSRP hubris, then maybe they can push back the losses..

[L99BEN]

Originally Posted by Tremek

Chevy/GM are in serious trouble if they keep increasing MSRPs. Why?

A brand-new Mustang GT is $25k, and GT Premiums are $31k. That's why.

The vast majority of car buyers out there have weak brand loyalty. I'm one of them. I buy the best cars I can get for my needs and for the price. Mustang GTs being $10k cheaper than the cheapest SSs out there doesn't bode well for SS sales.

Edit: changed the link above to reflect that yes, there are $25k new 2017 Mustang GTs and not just mis-labeled Ecoboosts.

Those prices are always misleading. All possible rebates are applied. You still need to add in freight, rebates you don't qualify for, dealer fee, tax..

[WhyUMad1LE]

I don't think the Camaro would be a big seller even at $15k tbh. It's not a very appealing car for non-enthusiasts.

[O-Tag]

I wasn't an enthusiast before I bought mine. I compared "apples to apples" across the big three, as well as pretty much any other sports car in the 60K range. The Camaro was the best bang for the buck IMO.

[IMadeYouReadThis]

Originally Posted by Tremek

That's, uh... A lot of hyperbole. The cars are direct competitors. No doubt the SS is a better car, but by inches, not miles. I haven't paid any attention to the V6 Camaros, but it looks like they start around $21k. I'd be mightily tempted to look at a $25k GT for a V8 if I was in that market.

SS 1LE: I went digging to see if there's anything to people not qualifying for the incentives, and it looks to be pretty common for people to get $5-10k off MSRP.

In other news, I spoke with a Chevy dealer today and while dealers typically know nothing, the guy I spoke with mentioned that Chevy seems to be upping the frequency of incentives announcements to 2-3 times a month. He implied that he would not be surprised if significant incentives were announced on many, or all 2017 Chevy models, "soon" (next few months.)

If Chevy also drops the MSRP hubris, then maybe they can push back the losses..

Why mustang is ugly does not handle as well and is only slightly faster then the V6 Camaro 0 60 in 5.1. slap an RS pkg and a NPP on the 6 and you have the new poor mans king.


from motortrend

Our testing regimen revealed that compared to the 2015 ’Stang, it was business as usual for the 2016 Ford: 435 hp and 400 lb-ft of torque from the 5.0-liter Coyote V-8 with a six-speed manual sending the power rearward through a 3.73 rearend that spins a pair of 275-series Pirelli P Zeroes. Sixty mph comes in just 4.6 seconds, the quarter mile in 12.9 at 110 mph flat. Slamming on the brakes will haul the yellow coupe to a stop from 60 in just 109 feet. A lap around our figure eight took just 24.4 seconds at 0.82g average.

There’s a give and take going on. The independent rear suspension setup definitely improves the car’s handling, but the weight gain slows it down, and on the track there’s more pitch and roll than we’d like. Looking back into the archives at a 2013 Ford Mustang GT with the Performance package we tested confirmed some suspicions: 0-60 mph in 4.4 seconds, quarter mile in 12.7 seconds at 111.9 mph, and a figure eight of 25.0 seconds at 0.77g average. Weight difference? 207 pounds per our scales in the old-timer’s favor.

If you lined up with an “old” Mustang at your local drag strip (let’s pretend it’s stock, too) we’re talking more than just a nose ahead. The older and lighter Mustang will be trying to show you some taillights. Just don’t eat a big meal beforehand.

[Tremek]

If you care about quarter mile times and/or are drag racing, a GT (or an SS) becomes a 10-second car with $5-10k additional into either one. Any of the lesser Camaros or Mustangs? Nope.

Re: a track day car, I bet a 1LE V6 is a blast. For driving on the street though, that V6 has to rev all the way to its redline to make sufficient power:



That's pretty anemic when compared to a LT1:



Off-idle, the 6.2 is making more than 130 ft/lbs torque more than the V6's peak...

What about the 5.0 Coyote?


Even off idle the little 5.0 is 50 ft/lbs above the LGX's peak and by 3500rpm is at least 100 ft/lbs over it.

I myself live at altitude and torque (or the lack thereof) is that much more noticeable. Torque alone would be the reason to go with the V8 for me, but I also recognize that the V6 Camaro's performance is far better than it's ever been. Just still not enough for me.