[FarmerFran]

Originally Posted by TTown918

No chance in hell GM is going to spend the time or dollars to make a 7th Gen Camaro three different ways - ICE, hybrid and all electric.

They make 4 now.

[arpad_m]

Originally Posted by ModernCamaroZ28Fan

You made it sound like the apocalypse is coming, not saying that I don't believe you.

Naw man, it's just that I think some bells need sounding. Once you taste freedom, you don't want to just let it go and lie down without a fight.

[Crushin_LT1]

I would love a turbo-diesel camaro, that would be tight. Pop in the 6.6L Duramax?

[MR2Aaron]

I actually traded in a Tesla Model 3 for my 2021 Camaro.

I liked everything about the Tesla except for Tesla (the company) itself. Every single thing about dealing with them is a pain in the ass. They somehow managed to make buying the car a pain in the ass, despite having eliminated the dealer. Buying parts is a pain. Service is a pain. Also, most other Tesla owners' couldn't even manage to check their own tires without help, or relying on the TPMS. It wasn't much of an enthusiast community, in the sense most of us here probably think about it.

The icing on the cake is that, as several have mentioned, you don't really even own the car. They pushed out a software update around Christmas time that totally ruined the experience of driving the car for me, and refused to revert my car to the previous version. So I traded it in for the Un-Tesla.

I have a lot of optimism for the future of an EV Camaro, though. The fundamental driving experience in the Model 3 is excellent (BMW-like), so it's not like it isn't possible to make an electric sports car, and the big problem I had with Tesla is that they operate more like a company that sells fitness monitor wristbands than a car company. For all of their faults, I have faith that Ford and GM (in that order) will probably operate with a bit more discipline and restraint.

Unrelated, this Camaro is the shit. SOOOOO much fun!

[Crushin_LT1]

Originally Posted by MR2Aaron

I actually traded in a Tesla Model 3 for my 2021 Camaro.

I liked everything about the Tesla except for Tesla (the company) itself. Every single thing about dealing with them is a pain in the ass. They somehow managed to make buying the car a pain in the ass, despite having eliminated the dealer. Buying parts is a pain. Service is a pain. Also, most other Tesla owners' couldn't even manage to check their own tires without help, or relying on the TPMS. It wasn't much of an enthusiast community, in the sense most of us here probably think about it.

The icing on the cake is that, as several have mentioned, you don't really even own the car. They pushed out a software update around Christmas time that totally ruined the experience of driving the car for me, and refused to revert my car to the previous version. So I traded it in for the Un-Tesla.

I have a lot of optimism for the future of an EV Camaro, though. The fundamental driving experience in the Model 3 is excellent (BMW-like), so it's not like it isn't possible to make an electric sports car, and the big problem I had with Tesla is that they operate more like a company that sells fitness monitor wristbands than a car company. For all of their faults, I have faith that Ford and GM (in that order) will probably operate with a bit more discipline and restraint.

Unrelated, this Camaro is the shit. SOOOOO much fun!

I cross-shopped Tesla 3s initially, but the reports and feedback I was hearing was not encouraging, plus the cost was insane.



I sat in a family friend's Model S (their original/hi-po model) and the interior was wildly low quality. A coworker had a Model X (the hatchback?) for a while, he was not a fan of the QC and ended up going back to Bimmers.

[FarmerFran]

Originally Posted by Crushin_LT1

I would love a turbo-diesel camaro, that would be tight. Pop in the 6.6L Duramax?

LOL! 95/5 weight distribution

[MR's 2SS]

Originally Posted by arpad_m

Naw man, it's just that I think some bells need sounding. Once you taste freedom, you don't want to just let it go and lie down without a fight.

No need to qualify your statement. Your absolutely correct. Growing up in the 60s and 70s and knowing the level of freedom we still had then. And comparing that to now... I dont even mean 2021 now.... I mean the last almost 20 years. Its disturbing.
Others are looking at the EVs from a standpoint of progress. But I think progress is market driven. Steam locomotives ran on coal. It was cheap and plentiful. They were the epitome of modern travel and for the first time capable of moving freight across the country quickly and efficiently. They are all gone now because diesel electrics could do the same job 1000 times better... faster... and cheaper.
This mass movement of the worlds mode of transportation is not market driven. Or populous drivin in and large way. It has more in common with Mao revolutionizing farming in China by requiring the farmers to plant the crops closer together to triple production...
Im sure that all sounded great to the intellectuals. And Im sure the farmers who complained went off to re education camps if they were lucky. Scorned and ridiculed for not getting with the program.
Right up until the crops failed and millions died of starvation.
We will be forced into EVs regardless of our opinions or organic market reasoning. Tax on gas will be increased and U.S. energy independence will be crushed again... so the cost to drive will literally be a burden on the economy as a whole. Trucking companies will need to be subsidized to operate. Fuel Surcharges will once again be the norm.
Then theres the fact that the existing power grid is ancient and poorly maintained in most of the populated areas of the country. There is ZERO planning to build new power plants that could efficiently meet the demands of a major increase in power consumption.
Wind generation is good. I guess. As long as the wind is blowing. Solar is good. As long as theres sunlight. The pieces necessary to build those systems by and large will come from China... hmm
The Kestone pipeline oil will return to rail transport owned by billionaires.
The Russians are building a pipeline for NG to Germany.
We hold 80% of the worlds NG but our government is stalling any attempt to export that. And to my knowledge ZERO plans to build NG power plants.
So... yay. EV Camaro. Im overwhelmed with excitement.

[FarmerFran]

You would come in here and think it was the end of the world as we know it.

Fallout EV...

[MR's 2SS]

Originally Posted by FarmerFran

You would come in here and think it was the end of the world as we know it.

Fallout EV...

Thats accurate I think. In fact I would change your comment to the world as we knew it. The debate is how far gone it already is and how far gone it will go.
Or how far it will be pushed before something irreversible takes place.
Kind of like a great reset?

[cellsafemode]

Originally Posted by arpad_m

The naive mistake you're making is you extrapolate the current model of vehicle ownership and driving arrangements onto the new technology. If only the goal were to enhance the driving experience or even to "save the planet".

I have no doubt the time of driving for fun is ending. It's going to happen no matter what kind of motor or engine your car has. That writing has been on the wall for a while now.

The hope against hope is that we can still get a little bit of it in by being early-ish adopters before it's totally bound by laws and manufacturer decisions.

[c4racer]

It's one of those things that has been slowly happening while we have all been busy with our own stuff to do, and then you wake up one day and realize - hey wait, how did this happen exactly? I read an interesting article about ranking countries for freedom and the US came in 26th place - and that was 3 years ago. The Nordics were all tied for first place. which is interesting and sad at the same time....

But yay - EV Camaro. Super cool. Sign me up.
NOT

[MR's 2SS]

https://www.americanprogress.org/iss...ucing-oil-use/

I put this up earlier in the thread. These are the kinds of glowing assessments presidents who follow the plan get in the press. Give it a read to see if any single bit of it looks true in retrospect. Plus... we should be in the years predicting 54.5 MPGs.
The relentless grim propaganda generated towards anything not in line combined with the equally aggressive misinformation campaigns to bolster support for the agenda make honest well informed decisions by law makers as well as the voting public impossible.
I could be thrilled at the infiltration of EVs into the market as competition to existing products. Driving advancement and cost savings. The things were disusing here are not about competition. Its purely political.

[Hops]

Originally Posted by MR2Aaron

I actually traded in a Tesla Model 3 for my 2021 Camaro.

I liked everything about the Tesla except for Tesla (the company) itself. Every single thing about dealing with them is a pain in the ass. They somehow managed to make buying the car a pain in the ass, despite having eliminated the dealer. Buying parts is a pain. Service is a pain. Also, most other Tesla owners' couldn't even manage to check their own tires without help, or relying on the TPMS. It wasn't much of an enthusiast community, in the sense most of us here probably think about it.

The icing on the cake is that, as several have mentioned, you don't really even own the car. They pushed out a software update around Christmas time that totally ruined the experience of driving the car for me, and refused to revert my car to the previous version. So I traded it in for the Un-Tesla.

I have a lot of optimism for the future of an EV Camaro, though. The fundamental driving experience in the Model 3 is excellent (BMW-like), so it's not like it isn't possible to make an electric sports car, and the big problem I had with Tesla is that they operate more like a company that sells fitness monitor wristbands than a car company. For all of their faults, I have faith that Ford and GM (in that order) will probably operate with a bit more discipline and restraint.

Unrelated, this Camaro is the shit. SOOOOO much fun!

What a first post! Did you find the driving experience with an electric car something the wore off over time? I had a Bolt loaner for a couple days, and really thought it was way better than my expectations, but wondered if after a while it wouldn't be exciting.



Years ago, i thought tesla was fighting the good fight over dealer state laws, but now i think they are way worse with right to repair issues(Rich builds), and stories like yours. I've also been thinking people have underestimated repair issues with EV's. An ICE power train is certainty more complicated and needs more repairs, but it's not like that's the only repair issues with cars. Most of the issues i've had with cars in the past are NOT with the powertrain.

[Crushin_LT1]

Originally Posted by FarmerFran

LOL! 95/5 weight distribution

Well there are ways around that lol