[gm_joe]

We are at the peak of another muscle car cycle. Everyone, enjoy while you can. After the new CAFE standars start to take effect, the cars will once again become aniemic (mustang II, Chevette, Polara)

[2001ragtop]

Originally Posted by strych9

Defcon douche level 1 achieved!

If it's such a waste, why did you bother to post? I gleaned a lot of cool opinions and information from this post, which was my intent. You could have skipped over it...but you didn't.

Thank you for sharing your opinion.

I have just seen about 2000 posts talking about this topic which is why initially I didn't feel empathetic about the subject and sounded the alarm to close the thread.

However, I did read how your car had some issues and I would have been upset also. It sucks that you can't get a car that is brand new, which is free of defects. It sounded like you are having it fixed.

Hope you get your car fixed or get the car you want so you can have fun on the road. I have had my share of bad experiences at dealerships as well.

[SVT Murrocket]

Originally Posted by Rangore

2012 ZL1 > 2012 GT500
2012 ZL1 < 2013 GT500 at first glance... I want to see the test comparisons, but the HP difference is enough to make the claim.

So...I take it as Ford answered with their 2013 since their car wasn't gonna cut it in 2012 for comparison.

I've said it before...Mustang was very lacking while Camaro was not around. They didn't improve their car till they had to. It's the same thing with their 2013s. As FbodFather said...they wouldn't be making the current cars if they didn't have to.


.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well Ford did come out with the GT 500 during that time, which was the most powerful Mustang ever produced to date, that's far from lacking...Also, producing a car, when your competition isn't, is not considered "lacking." It means you won the battle because you are still producing the car...

ALso, the stock '12 Gt 500 will easily run with a ZL1 - so it would have "cut it". However, it would not dominate like the '13's have a chance to do...

Having said that - competition makes everything better - look no farther than the ZL1 and GT 500. Both are FANTASTIC!

[KKreme15]

Originally Posted by rpepka

Out performmed??? Ride? Skid Pad? No Automatic. Have to disagree on that one.

He said nearly

[ffrcobra_65]

Originally Posted by 2012ZL1

OMG who gives a rats @ss about the Shelby?. Last time I looked this was a Camaro site. I come here to discuss Camaros not blankety blank Shelbys. If I wanted a Shelby I'd buy one. I don't want a shelby. They could make 5000 hp, be dipped in gold and smaell like a field of roses and I'd still buy a CAMARO.

Originally Posted by Bad@ssCamaro

THAT'S TELLIN' THESE IDJUTS!!!

(amen, brother, amen)

I guess you are calling out many Camaro owners here in C5 who keep posting and starting threads about Mustangs. So are you calling the OP an "idjut" for starting a Shelby thread in the ZL1 section? For the most part, the Mustang guys are simply replying to these posts/threads. Just saying.

[FNBADAZ06]

Originally Posted by Rock36

Correct me if I am wrong, but the 662 bhp is an SAE certified number.

I don't believe you can underrate the engine and advertise an SAE certification.

Otherwise, why not just leave the rating at 650 bhp? What would Ford really gain by uprating it to 662 bhp, yet still leaving it underrated?

Again, I'm pretty sure for SAE certified numbers the manufacturer has to advertise a number within a tight range of what the third-party observer also witnesses, but I'm not totally positive on that.

You are correct....SAE Certification requires a deviation no greater than 1% of advertised output.

[MauriSSio]

Originally Posted by 69bossnine

This has been a humorous exercise for me... A lesson in abject denial, and the silliness it can create..

For months the denial has been that a Camaro with a 7.15 lb/hp ratio could overcome a Mustang with 5.84 lb/hp by virtue of bigger tires, magnetic shocks, and launch control.

Then the humor moves to all of the disbelief that the 2013 Shelby is running exactly what you'd FIGURE it would run just doing the simple bench-racing math. What a surprise!!

And now, I see Chevy faithful, a historically proud and race-savvy bunch, dismissing 5-7 mph trap speed differentials between the two cars as "not making it any quicker" and "not that big of a difference"... The kind of lame, shoulder-slouching-toe-tapping nonsense I'm used to seeing on Honda Civic forums.

And what about the hypocrisy? If there's a ZR1 magazine comparo, and a Porsche GT3 gets higher-ratings for its steering feel, fun-to-drive quotient, and overall handling characteristics, the whole notion gets dismissed as "mamby-pamby-limp-wristed-nonsense" since the ZR1 just throws down like a hammer of Thor. You laugh at people who worry about "feel" and "turn-in" and "balance", and just grunt like Tim Allen about the ZR1..

Now the 2013 GT500 starts making the rounds, throwing down some beastly times (as EVERYONE expected, it's no surprise ferchrisake), and all these Chevy forum guys are putting on their tu-tu's, their ballet slippers, their tiaras, and grabbing their bejeweled wands, and skipping around the dance floor talking about the "balance and feel and versatility and nuance" of their top-line hot-rod.

It's either funny, or pathetic, however you might look at it.

If you didn't like all of the lame excuses the 4.6 Mustang GT guys made when the SS hit the road, then go back and re-read your identical pablum here, and re-evaluate where you're at. Somewhere along the line, you put down your beer, and picked up a frosty bottle of Zima...

strong!!

in the end theyre both great cars. GT500 is just faster and a better deal IMO.

[DJ Red Barron]

Originally Posted by 69bossnine

This has been a humorous exercise for me... A lesson in abject denial, and the silliness it can create..

For months the denial has been that a Camaro with a 7.15 lb/hp ratio could overcome a Mustang with 5.84 lb/hp by virtue of bigger tires, magnetic shocks, and launch control.

Then the humor moves to all of the disbelief that the 2013 Shelby is running exactly what you'd FIGURE it would run just doing the simple bench-racing math. What a surprise!!

And now, I see Chevy faithful, a historically proud and race-savvy bunch, dismissing 5-7 mph trap speed differentials between the two cars as "not making it any quicker" and "not that big of a difference"... The kind of lame, shoulder-slouching-toe-tapping nonsense I'm used to seeing on Honda Civic forums.

And what about the hypocrisy? If there's a ZR1 magazine comparo, and a Porsche GT3 gets higher-ratings for its steering feel, fun-to-drive quotient, and overall handling characteristics, the whole notion gets dismissed as "mamby-pamby-limp-wristed-nonsense" since the ZR1 just throws down like a hammer of Thor. You laugh at people who worry about "feel" and "turn-in" and "balance", and just grunt like Tim Allen about the ZR1..

Now the 2013 GT500 starts making the rounds, throwing down some beastly times (as EVERYONE expected, it's no surprise ferchrisake), and all these Chevy forum guys are putting on their tu-tu's, their ballet slippers, their tiaras, and grabbing their bejeweled wands, and skipping around the dance floor talking about the "balance and feel and versatility and nuance" of their top-line hot-rod.

It's either funny, or pathetic, however you might look at it.

If you didn't like all of the lame excuses the 4.6 Mustang GT guys made when the SS hit the road, then go back and re-read your identical pablum here, and re-evaluate where you're at. Somewhere along the line, you put down your beer, and picked up a frosty bottle of Zima...

Well said, sir.

[garcmol]

Originally Posted by richtor

Fords official stance is 11.5-11.7 at 125 in optimal conditions(meaning near 0 dens alt.) Yes it has gone faster in testing. It has also shown to go 11.8 all day long by someone who can drive in less than optimal conditions.

Yes the zl1 is a great car which will hit 11's oem with a great driver.
Yes the 10-12 gt500 is a great car which can hit 11's oem with a great driver.
Now its up to us to pick our poison! Good Times!

Now I like this post. Well said

[Brad02SS]

How many of these cars will stay stock?
How many drivers can get the full potential out of them?
Stock vs stock and test numbers are one thing, what happens in the real world is a different thing.
It will come down to the driver and mods, whether from a red light, drag strip or road course.

[2SSJIM]

I like the talk that the "SHELBY" GT500 is a production car. If it is then the Hennessey 650-1000 are production cars and they hold the HP title for a production car. A few years from now when the Shelby company starts building Shelby Camaros, Challengers and Chargers along with the Mustang...... will they all be production cars too?

[nanokpsi]

Originally Posted by hognutz

well you magazine race logic is odd. numbers that are out there

vir

Gt500 2:58
ZL1 2:52

vert is 3 seconds faster so 2:55???? so coupe would be what ??? how many seconds faster is it than the vert?

this is all gay internet racing though. without some kind of head to head everyone is guessing.

the thing that kill me is why dont' they just say man that is the nail in the coffen to the internet racer.

You are comparing apples and pears. There is currently a 6 second gap betwen the 2011 GT500 and the 2012 ZL1 at VIR (2:52 to 2:58). The 2013 convertible is 3 seconds faster than the 2012 GT500 coupe at SEBRING, which is a smaller course. I am sure SVT will release the VIR times soon. Here is a quatoe form someone on the other boards who is in "the know"

Originally Posted by DBK

Doesn't matter that 2011 ran 2:58 because 2013 has already destroyed that.
Like they said, GT500 is about the same in a straight line as GT(and my opinion is that any idiot can use the launch control and shift twice in a GT500, so most GT500 owners will be able to run quicker than they would in a GT) and its faster on a road course. Ford GT has run 2:57 at VIR. Figure out what that means for 2013.

The gap from 2011 to 2013 at sebring is...massive.

[ffrcobra_65]

Unlike their counterpart, Ford's SVT folks served zero smack/trash talk but came forth and delivered a serious ass-whopping.

[69bossnine]

Originally Posted by 2SSJIM

I like the talk that the "SHELBY" GT500 is a production car. If it is then the Hennessey 650-1000 are production cars and they hold the HP title for a production car. A few years from now when the Shelby company starts building Shelby Camaros, Challengers and Chargers along with the Mustang...... will they all be production cars too?

You don't seem to understand that the GT500 is built on the Flat Rock Mustang assembly line, and is 100% engineered by Ford.

If you were referring to the Shelby GT350, which is indeed developed and prepped in 'Vegas, maybe you'd have a point.

But you don't have a point, whatsoever... It's a production car, they build 5,000-10,000 units per-year ferchrisake... The Shelby name is just a "model", same as "ZL1".