[VR Baron]

Originally Posted by DaveC113

Here's a cool side-by-side vid my friend Hsun made. He codrove with me last weekend at the local BMW club ax series. In this vid, I set fastest time and was .03s in PAX behind my friend James in a FS Mustang M1.

Unfortunately, we then ran the course in reverse with some small changes and I lost a massive 1s to James in raw time... I just ran out of steam and couldn't drive properly anymore... I have some residual covid effects. So James probably won overall, I was around 5th... Hsun beat me overall by about .3s. The final result is fastest morning and afternoon times added, only 1st 3 runs count... and is still being processed. James has a shot at the FS podium at SCCA Nats this year, so I'm super happy I could come .03s away, which is about .9s faster raw time... FS PAX is soft!

Oh also, I was the course designer. The venue is small, there are light poles, holes and rough patches in the surface. It's my 5th course so far and it needed to run forward and backwards. I welcome any constructive criticism.

Nice layout Dave. I sure wish I had area that large to run at!

[clyde]

Originally Posted by joelster

Tomo is a damn Alien lol! He's been tearing it up everywhere he goes. My guess is he will bomb the FS Pax for next year. FS has a few national wins this year.

According to Rick Ruth, he mostly tosses alien driver results when he sets PAX each year. I suspect if FS takes a big hit next year, it will be due to people like me.

Here's my race from yesterday at MBR. A VERY fast course design, hit near 70 going into the left banking near the finish, and was near 75 going through the finish.

Looks fun!

[joelster]

Sam Strano won 1 or 2 early this year as well though I'm pretty sure. Tomo results I can see being tossed because he can simply beat everyone by a full second in PAX in whatever car he's driving that particular day.

[joelster]

Originally Posted by apexit53

Fast run from this weekend. Got the camera up for a little bit better view. Tight course for the wide cars this weekend. of 8 runs only 3 were clean :p

Great driving at Nats! Right on TOMO both days! One of these years I'll make the trek out there. I'm friends with Chad and Colton who you race with a few times a year.

[Msquared]

Originally Posted by joelster

Great driving at Nats! Right on TOMO both days! One of these years I'll make the trek out there. I'm friends with Chad and Colton who you race with a few times a year.

I'll second that! To come in a pretty close second to Tom O'Gorman (a legit pro driver) and beat Chad Englert, Matthew Braun, and Sam Strano is an exceptional result. The F Street field was packed with at least seven prior national champions and probably 25-30 championships between them. As of now (first half of competition complete), four of the top seven pax results are from FS. That's a win in any other class.

A couple interesting developments this year in this class:

• The Camaro has made a bit of comeback. Whereas last year it seemed like the Mach 1 and Dark Horse would overtake the Camaro in numbers (not in speed - they seem pretty equal), there were more Camaros in the field this year.
• The Bridgestone RE71RS is clearly now the tire of choice, whereas last year the Yokohama A052 was at least a contender, if not the favorite.

[DaveC113]

Originally Posted by Msquared

I'll second that! To come in a pretty close second to Tom O'Gorman (a legit pro driver) and beat Chad Englert, Matthew Braun, and Sam Strano is an exceptional result. The F Street field was packed with at least seven prior national champions and probably 25-30 championships between them. As of now (first half of competition complete), four of the top seven pax results are from FS. That's a win in any other class.

A couple interesting developments this year in this class:

• The Camaro has made a bit of comeback. Whereas last year it seemed like the Mach 1 and Dark Horse would overtake the Camaro in numbers (not in speed - they seem pretty equal), there were more Camaros in the field this year.
• The Bridgestone RE71RS is clearly now the tire of choice, whereas last year the Yokohama A052 was at least a contender, if not the favorite.

I hear FS PAX will be harder than CAMC next year. Sorry...

[apexit53]

Hey thanks everyone!!! Appreciate the support!

I’ll have my video up tomorrow. Just got home so I need to rest a bit ��.

It really seemed like the b stone came into its own this year. Granted we ran the first two days and earlier in the morning vs Thursday Friday and last heat last year.

Idk if anyone saw the new falken rt660+ posted?

I’ll share my feelings and thoughts when I post the video tomorrow but again. Thank you everyone.
Also. Hey! A Camaro finally took FStreet win!!!

Also out pax maybe f��screwed but if we are harder than cam next year then you all need to get faster ����

[Msquared]

Originally Posted by apexit53

Also out pax maybe f��screwed but if we are harder than cam next year then you all need to get faster ����

LOL, if F Street has a harder pax than CAM-C next year, there will be no entrants in F Street!

[apexit53]

well with the camera inside the car this was kinda useless to see.

[DaveC113]

Originally Posted by Msquared

LOL, if F Street has a harder pax than CAM-C next year, there will be no entrants in F Street!

If we throw out Super Dave's time as an outlier, he even raw-timed STU, then TomO would have won CAMC (Ok, he may be an outlier driver!), apexit53 would be 3rd and ChadE 4th.

This is making us CAMC drivers look bad, or the OEM Camaro and Mustang look good. Maybe some of both...

AS times are also looking better than CAMC, but I have always thought it odd that pony cars are supposed to be able to beat 3100 lb, 505 hp Vettes even with significant mods.

@apexit53, congrats on the 2nd!

[clyde]

Congrats (again) to Mike for the amazing showing!

A few thoughts that seem relevant...

The Bridgestones worked well enough at the Finale Saturday morning for first drivers, but they were cooked by the break turn on the second driver's third run. We let lazy win that morning session and left the second set of tires in paddock. Oops. In the afternoon, it was a good bit warmer and almost nobody in the entire afternoon session went faster unless they were dirty or super slow in the morning. We swapped between drivers in the afternoon, but when you can't go faster anyway, kinda pointless.

Sunday morning was cooler than Saturday. We planned for what criteria we'd use to swap and after my runs, the tires were where I would have wanted them to be if I was about to go out. My codriver would have dropped a good bit of time if he hadn't coned.

At Nats, FS ran in the morning and temps were pretty cool on Tuesday. It was a little warmer Wednesday, but still pretty cool. With two drivers and using blankets, I would have liked more heat for my third run Wednesday.

CAM-C ran 5th heat and it was pretty warm both days. Not only was it warm, but non stop sun. A lot of tires, including the RE71RS, work differently on the Lincoln surface than other sites when it's hot and sunny. I am certain that FS cars running 5th heat would have been at least a few tenths off their morning times and CAM-C would have been faster had they run with FS in the morning.

FS and CAM ran together at the Pro. It's still stupid close, but the times suggest that like for like, CAM-C was a little faster.

Anyway, what an amazing level of competition in FS this year. I drove worse than I have all year and that sucks, but oh well.

Parting thought...check your battery cables and make sure they're tight. What you definitely don't want is a loose one to cause a low voltage situation on course and take away your brakes with a "SERVICE RESTRAINT SYSTEM" message on the dash when taking a run. At least that's the impression I got from my codriver when he came back from his third run on the West course. Easy enough to fix between runs, but feel so, so bad for him.

[joelster]

As most everyone knows there are always better drivers overall in FS than in CAM. I'm not saying that us CAM drivers are bad, but the top tier of FS guys is just a notch above. Obviously there are a few exceptions, like Ward, and Schotz and a few others. As far as what the FS guys are able to do with the "stock" cars, I think that has a lot to do with the incredible engineering that Chevy, and Ford put into the 1LE and Mach 1. The stock cars are insanely good right off of the showroom floor. The guys in CAM that I see, sometimes mod their cars just for the sake of modding their cars. They do things that take them out of FS and into CAM, but don't necessarily make the cars any faster. I see guys taking off the factory spoiler, and putting aluminum wings on there car that are 5sq/ft, sitting a foot off of the trunk, and set at 2 degrees incline. So basically they remove a working spoiler that weighs 7lbs, and replace it with a 30lb wing that has zero drag (you actually want drag for autocross in a high hp car), and gives them 40lbs of downforce at 55mph (basically nothing), with the weight hanging way off of the ass end of the car. But hey, it looks cool right? I could go on and on. Guys that take the factory suspension off and slap on some coil-overs thinking they know more than the engineering teams at GM and Ford. I'd like to see @apexit53 take my car for a rip back to back against his 1LE. Even as modded as my car is, it would be very track dependent to find out if my car is faster than a prepped FS car. I bet on any tight track the 1LE would beat my Z/28. Any time you could put down power and stretch it's legs, then maybe my Z would be a better choice.

[Msquared]

If you started with a stock SS 1LE and only did the following mods:

• 18x12 wheels with 295//35/18 RE71RS tires front and rear
• Vorshlag camber plates
• Rod-ended toe links to allow more rear camber
• DSC shock controller (not allowed in FS right now, but that my be about to change)

I think you'd be about 1 second faster on a 60-second course. Most mods after that will obey the law of diminishing returns, and you're right that it's easier to mess up a car with mods than make it better.

[DaveC113]

Originally Posted by Msquared

If you started with a stock SS 1LE and only did the following mods:

• 18x12 wheels with 295//35/19 RE71RS tires front and rear
• Vorshlag camber plates
• Rod-ended toe links to allow more rear camber
• DSC shock controller (not allowed in FS right now, but that my be about to change)

I think you'd be about 1 second faster on a 60-second course. Most mods after that will obey the law of diminishing returns, and you're right that it's easier to mess up a car with mods than make it better.

That's exactly how my car was setup last year. Plus ZLE rear subframe bushings and the GMPP diff tune.

DSC base programming isn't much, if at all, better than OEM. It could lose you time too. It may make for a small improvement if you're willing to invest a lot of time tuning and testing, but it doesn't address the main issue... the OEM springs are very soft.

On wheels, I'd go 19x12 square with 305/30/19 REs right now, but that's subject to change depending on tire offerings. The 305/30/19s are only .3" larger in diameter than the 295/35/18s, I was considering running a staggered setup with the 18s front and 19s back, but I don't want to spend more money. I'll do the testing if anyone has a spare set of ZLE-sized rear wheels laying around.

The MCS RR2 coilovers I put in over the winter are a significant upgrade over OEM magride. Front springs are 4.5x as stiff, rears are 2.5x, and the dampers are amazing. As I dial them in my times get faster. They're worth at least 1s/60s imo. I'd like to think my driving is partly the reason my results are FAR better than last year, but I think a lot of it is the coilovers.

But yeah... wheels, tires and suspension optimization is all you really need to have a competitive CAM car.

If anyone wants to try the DSC I still have it, I need to get that thing listed for sale...