[GunMetalGrey]

Do any camaro owners here have track experience with either the PSC2 ZP or PSC2 R?
If so what has that experience been and do you feel these tires are an improvement over the SC3R?

[TrackClub]

Usually run flats suck at the track. But the new Cup2s ZP might be different. Anyway ive tried a regular Cup2 and didnt gain any pace over G3s, spent twice as much $ (almost) and chunked a front tire on day 5. Thats my feedback for ya anyway

No data points on their R version.

EDIT: i dont think the R comes in Camaro sizes anyway. But i might be wrong.

[Destroyer_1LE]

Originally Posted by GunMetalGrey

Do any camaro owners here have track experience with either the PSC2 ZP or PSC2 R?
If so what has that experience been and do you feel these tires are an improvement over the SC3R?

ZP's are the corvette run flat tire, Cup 2 R's are only in GT3 RS and GT2 RS sizes currently. With my experience on Cup 2's they are a lot better then the SC3R's The SC3R's are good for a few laps then get greasy and are little unpredictable. Cup 2 are consistent throughout the temperature/ PSI range. If you keep them between 28PSI-32PSI hot depending on your alignment and track your at. A lot of people that do experience chunking are due to high PSI and bad alignment which in turns destroys the tire while on track.

[RUQWIKR]

Originally Posted by TrackClub

Usually run flats suck at the track. But the new Cup2s ZP might be different. Anyway ive tried a regular Cup2 and didnt gain any pace over G3s, spent twice as much $ (almost) and chunked a front tire on day 5. Thats my feedback for ya anyway

No data points on their R version.

EDIT: i dont think the R comes in Camaro sizes anyway. But i might be wrong.

You're not wrong often, but, here's a good time you are...the G3R's are now available in 285/30 & 305/30/20 if you want to try. They may drop off some after a long session, but, not nearly as much as others I have tried in both 20" and 19" versions.

https://www.goodyear.com/en-US/tires...3r/sizes-specs

[Move_Over]

Originally Posted by RUQWIKR

You're not wrong often, but, here's a good time you are...the G3R's are now available in 285/30 & 305/30/20 if you want to try. They may drop off some after a long session, but, not nearly as much as others I have tried in both 20" and 19" versions.

https://www.goodyear.com/en-US/tires...3r/sizes-specs

I believe TrackClub was referring to the Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2 R, not SC3R.

Regardless, the michelin's look like they only come in 265/35/20 and a 325/30/21. Random sizes but I think those are Porsche 991 GT2RS and 3RS.

[TrackClub]

Originally Posted by Move_Over

I believe TrackClub was referring to the Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2 R, not SC3R.

Regardless, the michelin's look like they only come in 265/35/20 and a 325/30/21. Random sizes but I think those are Porsche 991 GT2RS and 3RS.

That's correct

NB although GY lists 1LE sizes it seems that nobody has them yet. I will defo try a set when i can get them. Albeit it will likely be an expensive experiment as they are about the same cost as Cup2s - i think.

[TrackClub]

Originally Posted by Destroyer_1LE

ZP's are the corvette run flat tire, Cup 2 R's are only in GT3 RS and GT2 RS sizes currently. With my experience on Cup 2's they are a lot better then the SC3R's The SC3R's are good for a few laps then get greasy and are little unpredictable. Cup 2 are consistent throughout the temperature/ PSI range. If you keep them between 28PSI-32PSI hot depending on your alignment and track your at. A lot of people that do experience chunking are due to high PSI and bad alignment which in turns destroys the tire while on track.

Interesting feedback - thanks! My alignment was fine for sure. I ran them at 32 hot (per Michelin recommendation) and they felt a bit sloppy on turn in: something i truly detest.

Maybe i shoulda gone lower, but wasnt gonna try that at the Glen. A front outside shoulder chunked on a tight track on day 5, so i suspect less pressure would have sped that process up? Running lower pressure to prevent outside shoulder chunking sounds counter intuitive to me as the tire would roll over more.

In any case, if they cost closer to G3 id give them another try. But given i can score a free set of G3s for every 2 sets of Cup2s...there is no chance of another experiment i am afraid.

In any case, appreciate the feedback. It is always good to hear another pov. Cheers!

[GunMetalGrey]

Originally Posted by Destroyer_1LE

ZP's are the corvette run flat tire, Cup 2 R's are only in GT3 RS and GT2 RS sizes currently. With my experience on Cup 2's they are a lot better then the SC3R's The SC3R's are good for a few laps then get greasy and are little unpredictable. Cup 2 are consistent throughout the temperature/ PSI range. If you keep them between 28PSI-32PSI hot depending on your alignment and track your at. A lot of people that do experience chunking are due to high PSI and bad alignment which in turns destroys the tire while on track.

I put the Pilot Sport Cup 2 ZP's and Sport Cup 2R's in the same conversation because they both gave a HUGE advantage in the cornering and skidpad on the Corvette's equipped with these tires (can't remember which package makes the Grandsport have he same tires as the ZR1) as well as the Porsche GT2 and GT3 compared to before they had these tires and compared to other cars without these tires.

I believe I heard that the Corvette specific Michelin rubber was 1 of the steps in the evolution towards the Cup 2R; if you look at the tread pattern, it is almost identical and much different than the Pilot Cup 2. The performance results are very similar as well as mentioned above.

Motortrend called the Corvette the king of the skidpad since they started using these tires and the GT3's time went substantially down after getting these tires. Granted I'm not sure what tires the GT3 had on before, however it certainly was not getting 1.2 on the skidpad before these tires were put on and neither was the Corvette. Any time there is that much of an improvement mid-model, you have to take notice.

That's why I'm wondering how much of an improvement either of those tires will provide over the SC3R.
The Cup 2R costs a fortune but the Corvette tires do not, however sizes available would have to be in a 19" front wheel and 20" rear wheel since they only come in 285/30/19 and 335/25/20.

[TrackClub]

GMG....without an ability to push the car to its limits by a DRIVER, sticky tires will be a waste of money. More or less. They will also stymie your learning progress as their limits are usually quite narrower. So YOUR ability to feel them is absolutely key. Ive seen way too many folks slapping slicks on, hoping they would make them faster, but they didnt. Because the DRIVERS lacked skill to push them. G3 stock tires are wonderful not only grip wise and hence capable of very fast lap times (more on this in a second), but also to learn the craft on, as they are PROGRESSIVE in communicating their limit. Once you learn to reliably and consistently FEEL their limits AND correct over driving them, THEN look for a stickier tire, if you look to gain that extra pace. But not before. That's my advice anyway.

Slapping Vette Z07 package tires on a ZL1 makes zero sense. 285/335 stagger makes sense on a Vette but not a Camaro. The Pcar Cup2 R would be even worse.

Besides, as you will see in the links below, the the Z07 Vette package 1.2G is obviously uber, but other cars come VERY close to it Also, a skid pad number is just one measurement. Figure eight is another, which should also be considered in combination.

To let the cat out of the proverbial bag, ZL1 1LE achieves almost identical skid pad number as the mighty Z07 Vette package. So here is your answer about G3Rs capability. In your case, I'd suggest, that slapping ZL1 1LE wheels/tire combo (which is a proper stagger for a Camaro) would be an immediate and huge performance improvement. But as i had suggested earlier: wait until you can flog your car with ease on G3s. You will be a much better driver for it. IMO.

Here's the stats for you. Enjoy!

https://fastestlaps.com/lists/top-grip-kings

https://fastestlaps.com/tracks/motortrend-figure-8

[TrackClub]

Just to add some explanation regarding my comments on learning the craft:

You already have an **extremely** potent track weapon, which due to its power is not an ideal platform to learn on. If you put sticky tires on top of this, you'll be making your learning process even more difficult (and dangerous). Why?

Because you could find yourself losing the car while cornering at much higher speeds. And the higher the speed the more difficult it is and the more SKILL it takes, to make a correction and not wreck. Even 10kph delta can make a huge difference here.

Moreover, a less sticky tire will communicate loss of grip to you earlier, when speeds are (relatively) lower, plus more progressively, giving you more time to react. It is still a split of a second btw!
A stickier tire will do it more abruptly and quicker, giving you much less time to respond.

That's why reputable HPDE schools don't permit beginners to use r comps, not to mention slicks. Most may require street tires at intermediate levels too. But, with today's tire technology and marketing practices, many "200" tread rated tires are really r-comps masquerading as street tires. G3 is one of them.
G3R is close to R7 DOT slick in performance (and longevity), based on some reported feedback. That's only one level away from a true racing tire!

Learn the craft and skill first. Take small steps. Pace will come. But if pace overtakes skill - unfortunate and dangerous outcomes happen. Ive seen my share of them.

Anyway, i hope you understand where i am coming from and that you'll find these comments helpful. Cheers!

[RUQWIKR]

TrackClub: Per your quote: In your case, I'd suggest, that slapping ZL1 1LE wheels/tire combo (which is a proper stagger for a Camaro) would be an immediate and huge performance improvement. But as i had suggested earlier: wait until you can flog your car with ease on G3s. You will be a much better driver for it. IMO.


I am so glad I did just that for around the first year I owned the car and changed hobbies from drag strips to road courses. My sons are running on the G3's right now, and I do to on days they are. Both G3 and G3R's are great tires especially for their prices.

[juice3]

I've run both the regular Cup2 and the TPC Spec Cup2 ZP. The ZP is by far the grippier tire and resulted in faster lap times. For a run flat they are spectacular. I ran on them on an AMG GTR and it didn't get street driven. I was upset after spending Cup2 ZP money and then not wanting to put street miles on the car to save it for the track. Food for thought.

[GunMetalGrey]

Originally Posted by TrackClub

GMG....without an ability to push the car to its limits by a DRIVER, sticky tires will be a waste of money. More or less. They will also stymie your learning progress as their limits are usually quite narrower. So YOUR ability to feel them is absolutely key. Ive seen way too many folks slapping slicks on, hoping they would make them faster, but they didnt. Because the DRIVERS lacked skill to push them. G3 stock tires are wonderful not only grip wise and hence capable of very fast lap times (more on this in a second), but also to learn the craft on, as they are PROGRESSIVE in communicating their limit. Once you learn to reliably and consistently FEEL their limits AND correct over driving them, THEN look for a stickier tire, if you look to gain that extra pace. But not before. That's my advice anyway.

Slapping Vette Z07 package tires on a ZL1 makes zero sense. 285/335 stagger makes sense on a Vette but not a Camaro. The Pcar Cup2 R would be even worse.

Besides, as you will see in the links below, the the Z07 Vette package 1.2G is obviously uber, but other cars come VERY close to it Also, a skid pad number is just one measurement. Figure eight is another, which should also be considered in combination.

To let the cat out of the proverbial bag, ZL1 1LE achieves almost identical skid pad number as the mighty Z07 Vette package. So here is your answer about G3Rs capability. In your case, I'd suggest, that slapping ZL1 1LE wheels/tire combo (which is a proper stagger for a Camaro) would be an immediate and huge performance improvement. But as i had suggested earlier: wait until you can flog your car with ease on G3s. You will be a much better driver for it. IMO.

Here's the stats for you. Enjoy!

https://fastestlaps.com/lists/top-grip-kings

https://fastestlaps.com/tracks/motortrend-figure-8

Thanks for the stats, I've never seen the ZLE measured at 1.18 g's (that was by Car and Driver), Motortrend put it at 1.11 compared tot he ZL1's 1.07, I guess it all depends on the test conditions and variables the day of testing..
I never saw Motortrend do an actual figure 8 for the ZLE, just an estimate of 23.0, which I think is low considering the ZL1 did it in 23.1 and the skip pad numbers are substantially different between those cars.

I also appreciate the advice, and as I've said in the past, I have no plans to switch from the G3's this year, maybe next year at the earliest, however I'm always interested in which tires are the best and why and what options I have in the future down the road.

[GunMetalGrey]

Originally Posted by juice3

I've run both the regular Cup2 and the TPC Spec Cup2 ZP. The ZP is by far the grippier tire and resulted in faster lap times. For a run flat they are spectacular. I ran on them on an AMG GTR and it didn't get street driven. I was upset after spending Cup2 ZP money and then not wanting to put street miles on the car to save it for the track. Food for thought.

Thanks for the feedback on your experience.
How much faster were your lap times?