Quote:
Originally Posted by BlaqWhole
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Let's go Gen by Gen. Cliff notes...
5th Gen:
-11 GT had to catch up to the 10 SS.
-13 GT500 was catching up to the 12 ZL1.
-15 GT350 was catching up to the 14 Z28. Which we all agree was a stupid and foolish errand on Ford's part.
6th Gen:
-18 GT had to catch up to the 16 SS.
-18 GT PP2 had to catch up to the 17 SLE. And even at that it wasn't available until after the 2nd half of 2018.
-2020 GT500 has to catch up to the 17 ZL1. Will it match the ZLE? Until it does the ZLE will remain the fastest.
Did I miss anything??
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Actually, yes. You
did miss something. It's called the '11/'12 GT500. I noticed that you keep conveniently forgetting that car in your lists. In fact, your hardcore fanboy-ism is what "forced" me to even sign up just so I could respond to it.
You forget that the Mustang is the first and original pony car. It will NEVER have to "answer to" any other car in the segment. Now, with that out of the way, what was Chevy's answer to:
'03 Cobra?
'05 Mustang GT?
'07 Mustang Bullitt?
'07 GT500?
'08 GT500KR?
'10 GT500?
If the Mustang is always "answering to" the Camaro, where was the Camaro from '03 - '09? What possible reason would Ford have had to make so many updates to the Mustang during a time when the Camaro didn't even exist, except in wishful thoughts?
Now let's go back to the '11/'12 GT500 for a minute. You claim that Ford had to "answer to" the '12 ZL1 with the '13 GT500. You couldn't be more wrong nor disingenuous. The '12 ZL1 was answering to the '11/'12 GT500. And even then, it only matched the GT500 in most performance metrics, and even the Boss 302 could best the ZL1 on a track. To add insult to injury, Ford dropped the '13 GT500 almost specifically just to dip their balls into Chevy's mouth when Chevy announced the '12 ZL1.
Now enter the Z28. The Z28 was a badass car that took the world by storm. It embarrassed ALL of the pony cars around a track, including the ZL1 and Boss 302 Laguna Seca. But, it came at the end of the 5th gen's run and the Mustang S197 program was already shutting down. So there was no chance of an S197 rival, even though the Z28 was actually answering to the Boss 302 Laguna Seca which was already out of production when the Z28 arrived.
Skip ahead a couple years to the Mustang S550. Ford shocks the world with the GT350 and GT350R. Chevy is pretty much caught flatfooted and doesn't even
try to make a direct competitor. No, the ZL1 and ZL1 1LE are
not direct competitors to the GT350s. That said, data show that neither of the ZL1s are appreciably better than the GT350R in the handling department. The deltas between HP/TRQ and track times bear that out. Look at the VIR times of each. Even with the ZL1 1LE's power advantage and supposedly superior suspension setup, there's "only" a 6 second difference between them. Yes, I know 6 seconds on a track is a LONG time! However, on a track like VIR that rewards big power, you would think the ZL1 1LE would be much further ahead. Now look at a more technical track like Laguna Seca. All that power and tech on the ZL1 1LE netted a whopping 1.81 second advantage over the GT350R. The standard ZL1 was a whole 0.9 second faster. That should let you know the GT350R is a better handler. And then there's this:
Notice which one finished first.
Now fast forward a few more years. Enter the GT500. The lead engineer pretty much specifically stated the GT500 had to answer to the GT350R. His actual words were "It had to be
at least as good as the GT350R." We can infer that he was talking about the handling. So imagine the GT350R with another 200HP that it's been (re)engineered to harness. You'd have to be the biggest fanboy in the world to even remotely believe the GT500 isn't going to smash the ZL1 1LE.
Now, with ALL THAT said, I'm not here to bash or fight. I just couldn't take your disingenuous fanboy-ism anymore. I get that you love your car. There's a lot to love about it. But sheesh! Take it down a notch or two or three. I actually like BOTH the Mustang and Camaro, even the latest update to the Camaro which seems to be almost universally derided. I think it looks sharp (especially in that bright green color), but that's apparently just me. I actually dislike the '18 Mustang update very much. I actually don't like the S550, in general, except for the GT350s. Those are hot.