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-   -   Mobile 1 esp x3 (https://www.camaro6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=607122)

wakespeak 10-15-2022 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave88LX (Post 11240493)
The Facebook Group was on fire this weekend about a post I made about the X3 oil, how it was wrong, my engine will get destroyed, oil analysis will be done, and then warranty will be denied because I used the wrong oil.

An oil that is on the list of oils GM says to use.

What gives?

So many know it all's. For these engines:

HTHS >= 3.5 (for LT1s, LT4s)
Low volatility or "ash" to limit intake valve deposits.

Dexos2 or DexosR basically have those as key requirements.

Focus on those and you'll be the next know it all.

Dave88LX 10-17-2022 01:10 PM

4 Attachment(s)
Dude they are brutal.

keep_hope_alive 10-18-2022 05:33 PM

This is what my dealership uses, and what they gave me for my first free oil change. I asked for the materials, said I would handle the change and they had no problems with that. GM dexosR.

https://hosting.photobucket.com/imag...018_160817.jpg

https://www.mobil.com/en-us/passenge...supercar-0w-40

fj5gtx 10-20-2022 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keep_hope_alive (Post 11243270)
This is what my dealership uses, and what they gave me for my first free oil change. I asked for the materials, said I would handle the change and they had no problems with that. GM dexosR.

That is a great idea, I'm going to give that a try.

cdrptrks 10-24-2022 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wakespeak (Post 11242208)
So many know it all's. For these engines:

HTHS >= 3.5 (for LT1s, LT4s)
Low volatility or "ash" to limit intake valve deposits.

Dexos2 or DexosR basically have those as key requirements.

Focus on those and you'll be the next know it all.

Do you know if this information is publicly available for Mobil1 ESP X3 0W-40 and/or Mobil1 Supercar 0W-40 oils? I couldn't find it.

cdrptrks 10-25-2022 12:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave88LX (Post 11240493)
The Facebook Group was on fire this weekend about a post I made about the X3 oil, how it was wrong, my engine will get destroyed, oil analysis will be done, and then warranty will be denied because I used the wrong oil.

An oil that is on the list of oils GM says to use.

What gives?

I had Mobil1 ESP X3 0W-40 oil in my SS 1LE when it required engine repairs under warranty for a misfire caused by a leaking valve which required a new head (among other parts) and it was covered. Nothing was said to me about performing an oil analysis but they could have...they didn't even ask for receipts for the oil changes I have been doing myself for the past few years.

That was my first time using the ESP X3 instead of the old ESP but people were getting both from AutoZone depending on when they ordered. The product page online showed a picture of the old ESP bottle when I ordered but I got the new ESP X3. The website picture has been updated now.

I think the frequent HPDE events and the high mileage of my car were more likely causes of my engine issue than the oil. I had several hours of track time on that oil before the issue and I have several more track hours on a fresh fill of the same 0W-40 ESP X3 oil since then without any issues so far (knock on wood).

cdrptrks 10-25-2022 12:22 AM

Technically Dexos R is required for 2023+ Camaros instead of Dexos 2 according to the updated manual and performance supplement but ESP X3 meets the requirements for SS 1LE track use for 2022 and older SS 1LEs according to the manual and performance supplement from those model years.

I would like to know if there's really a substantial difference between Mobil1 Supercar and ESP X3 0W-40 besides price.

2SS Capt 10-25-2022 12:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cdrptrks (Post 11245483)
I had Mobil1 ESP X3 0W-40 oil in my SS 1LE when it required engine repairs under warranty for a misfire caused by a leaking valve which required a new head (among other parts) and it was covered. Nothing was said to me about performing an oil analysis but they could have...they didn't even ask for receipts for the oil changes I have been doing myself for the past few years.

That was my first time using the ESP X3 instead of the old ESP but people were getting both from AutoZone depending on when they ordered. The product page online showed a picture of the old ESP bottle when I ordered but I got the new ESP X3. The website picture has been updated now.

I think the frequent HPDE events and the high mileage of my car were more likely causes of my engine issue than the oil. I had several hours of track time on that oil before the issue and I have several more track hours on a fresh fill of the same 0W-40 ESP X3 oil since then without any issues so far (knock on wood).

Dealers can typically tell if an engine has been maintained or not once they open it up... I have a 2007 Hyundai Santa Fe (bought in July 2006) that needed a new valve cover gasket right at the 100,000 mile point (end of the powertrain warranty), the mechanic who opened it up said he had never seen an engine so clean at 100,000 miles, he said it looked like new (the first 34,000 miles I ran dino-oil (Pennzoil 5W-20) and did oil changes every 2,000 miles, after that I switched to full synthetic (Pennzoil Platinum) and went to 3,000 mile intervals)...

I do all my own oil changes, pretty much have none of the receipts (however I do have a very detailed log), they never asked to see a thing, they knew this engine was very well maintained...

When they open an engine and it is full of sludge, they are going to start asking for maintenance records and/or receipts...

"Oil is (relatively) cheap, components are NOT... Change your oil often..."

I use full synthetic in all of my cars (Pennzoil Platinum 5W-20 (except for the Camaro, if gets Mobil1 0W-40 ESP Formula)), the other cars all get 3,000 mile oil changes, the Camaro gets 3,000 miles or 10% on the OLM (which always seems to come first), they typically work out to about a 2,000 mile oil change...

cdrptrks 10-25-2022 02:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2SS Capt (Post 11245489)
I use full synthetic in all of my cars (Pennzoil Platinum 5W-20 (except for the Camaro, if gets Mobil1 0W-40 ESP Formula)), the other cars all get 3,000 mile oil changes, the Camaro gets 3,000 miles or 10% on the OLM (which always seems to come first), they typically work out to about a 2,000 mile oil change...

I sent off a sample for a used oil analysis once myself last year on the old ESP 0W-40. I changed the oil after around 7k miles (the longest interval I have ever done) after a big road trip when the OLM was almost at 0 and there were several track days included but the response was that my engine was looking great based on wear levels and TBN and to try a 9k mile interval next time but I ended up changing it early the next time to start fresh for another road trip.

cdb95z28 10-25-2022 09:39 AM

2 Attachment(s)
Mobil definitely muddied the water but we can still keep it simple.
For us Camaro guys:
-5W30 or 0W40>>check
-Dexos 2>>check

ESP and ESP x3 is Mobil 1 marketing and not a GM requirement but both are on the Dexos 2 approved list (see below).

So IOW.....
Send it.


It looks like there is no substantial difference. There are a few differences, but if we are to believe the below Mobil 1 info (why shouldn't we?) and that the '23 & up Camaros spec Dexos R as you say, then choosing one over the other will not blow your engine.

Attachment 1112262

Attachment 1112263




Google search........

https://www.mobil.com/en-gr/passenge...1-esp-x3-0w-40


https://www.mobil.com/en/lubricants/...upercar-0w-40/


Pick your poison:
https://www.gmdexos.com/brands/dexos2/index.html

https://www.gmdexos.com/brands/dexosr/index.html

keep_hope_alive 10-25-2022 01:23 PM

Great info here. Certainly, the change in naming and cosmetics has created a lot of confusion, along with changing the recommended formulation.

Thankfully, I have been a Mobil 1 user for decades and am happy to follow the recommendations.

cdrptrks 10-25-2022 03:26 PM

Ok there's a data sheet for Mobil 1 Supercar 0W-40 in the link from cdb95z28. It lists TBN of 8.5 and ash mass % of 0.8. I don't see those listed on the ESP X3 0W-40 data sheet though. I guess Blackstone could determine them from an unused oil sample if they haven't already.

The values of the properties and specifications sections that are listed for both oils are very similar but not identical.

haggler 10-25-2022 05:48 PM

3 Attachment(s)
M1 0w40 "supercar" is just a rebrand of M1 0w40 ESP formula.
They wanted to create a separate line of Corvette oil for marketing and pricing purposes.
Before they were using the Dexos2 spec which was originally for diesel/gas with particulate filters, which is just high HTHS, mid SAPS oil.

M1 0w-40 ESP x3 is available in the autozone bundle for around 6 bucks a quart (returning the filter). This oil was developed as top tier oil for PORSHE requirement C40 with mid SAPS, particulate filter friendly version of A40. The old M1 european 0w40 had the PORSHE A40 requirement but had high SAPS.
This oil actually has a higher HTHS than Supercar/ESP Formula and seemingly beefier.

https://www.mobil.com/en/lubricants/...-esp-x3-0w-40/

To add another layer of confusion, the owners manual for 2023 has several conflicting statements, see attached images. Options for oil are: dexos R 5w-30 (have not seen this), Dexos R 0w-40, and Dexos1 5w-30 and finally 15w50 full synthetic.

All this to say: any dexos2/dexos1/dexosR 5w30 or higher should be fine for street use. Go with dexos2/dexosR 0w40 for track or better protection. M1 15w50 should only be used on the track due to higher SAPS and zinc/phosphorus (bad for cats, in theory), I would not daily this oil.

Dragon08 10-26-2022 05:10 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Some more fuel for the fire from the M1 Engine Oils Product Guide Sheet from May '22

So to the point of the enthusiastic gentleman on FB, I do not see any specs indicating a higher Ash or Zinc content with X3 vs SC. Im hard pressed to find any spec where the X3 is at a disadvantage to SC. Perhaps the HTHS spec where the X3 may reduce fuel efficiency. Will the LT1 spin up faster on SC vs X3 due to this.....maybe its possible. IDK What else do you guys see in the comparison?
https://www.camaro6.com/forums/data:...AASUVORK5CYII=


Given the spec change in the '23 cars, I will likely go with the SC bottle next time I buy. LOL, by then it will change again. My OLM runs out of calendar long before it runs out of miles. I only put 2500 miles on mine this year, and that was fairly productive for me. I have till spring of '25 before I need to purchase again, thanks to the AZ deal on X3


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