Flex Fuel in HPTuners=DONE
 

I have managed to get flex fuel working in HPTuners. I know a lot of guys have been waiting for this, or told it was impossible to do ect. so I finally got around to trying to get it going. There really isn't some magical thing needed, no special programing, no secrete password ect.. It really is very basic, and for the most part follows every other flex fuel enabling protocol. I'm not sure if tables/inputs/ect were missing before, or if no one really tried that hard, but here it is. I have a small video clip in my build thread showing it working for the inevitable doubters. I have thought long and hard about this, and decided I don't want the burden of people possibly blowing up their engines, due to the complexity of tuning flex fuel "correctly", so Im going to show the basic settings required for an experienced tuner to make the necessary changes. If you are going to be tuning for flex fuel, you will already know what else is needed from here in order to get a functioning sensor communicating. The stock tune needs A LOT of adjusting. That is a massive understatement at best. DO NOT attempt to use your stock file.

Yay, been waiting for a smart person to try this.

Interesting.. awaiting more feedback..
Does this by chance have anything to do with yours being an '18 model or will work for all '16-'18s. Was there a HPtuner update we missed?

When you say we who are you referring to?

How are you wiring the sensor into the ECM?

And yes Cooper1965 is correct, many many tables to adjust to get a strong and safe combo. You can expect and easy 30-50HP more when on corn fuel and properly tuned.

When I switched mine over I went from lo 13's to mid 12's!

It should not matter on the year, if anything the 18' is the most difficult because GM can't leave anything alone. I got curious on the HPT update's your brought up, so this morning I have been rolling through the previous versions of HPT, so far, the past 4 updates have everything needed to get flex up and moving.



I used service terminal 7116-4152-02, it is in Yazaki tray 9, to connect to the PCM. (That "could" be different depending on year, I did not check)

Todays MVP of the internet goes to.....(Insert painfully long drum roll/zzwho cam chop here) Cooper!! I already have flex available because I have (looks around for forum police) an ATS but I understand this is huge for you guys. Hope to see more progress soon.

zzwho hasnt looked at this in over 6 months....judging by this post, HPT finally actually connected the back end of the sensor function with the latest update? previously, you could turn it on all you want, and it would just report 46% ALL the time. if this is actually fully fuctioning, and reporting properly that is BAD ASS! good find coop!

I believe it is reporting properly. I had "mostly" straight 93 octane fuel in the tank to start testing (for obvious reasons), OFC that is roughly 10% ethanol. FCSU (fuel comp frequency) HTZ was at 63 showing 12ish% ethanol in the log.
Added a few gallons of E85 and and FCSU HTZ jumped to 71ish and logged ethanol jumped to 21ish%. There were some other changes too according to my tune (timing, ect.ect.). Unless Im completely overlooking something major, its working.

Dont be sleeping on Coop. Hes been making a bunch of progress on his own doing a bunch of research and tweaks. Hopefully soon it can be implemented across both platforms and get all of the LTGs hooked on corn.

How many is a 'few' gallons?? It didn't change much if you added a few gallons. I got this mixing down to an art now. Pretty sure you got the same size tank we do so when its on empty, 6gal of e85 and 8gallon of 93 gets me 40-42% ethanol everytime. Thats what i have to run in the winter to keep the fuel system in line and not commanding super high duty cycle. Which contrary to some on here, makes them run lean (while showing ok on the wideband)

19 Gal tank, started with a full topped off tank of 93 attempting to water down the last little bit of E in the tank, so that was roughly 12% E. Drove around and logged, made tune changes, logged more, more tune changes ect. Burned maybe 2.5 Gal of that fuel and decided I was happy with the function of the sensor. I then topped off again with a 'few' Gal of E, leaving me at roughly 21% E.

You've made my day:thanks::thanks::thanks::thanks:

Cool, nice and steady progress.

FYI, little inside tip if you didnt already know. You will need to raise your virtual torque tables for e85 as the stock ones are way to low. With the power you'll be making it helps to raise them 5-10%. It fixed a few drivability issues i was having in 50-70% throttle settings.

Also there are some sneaky torque tables and timing tables that are harder to find that will need adjusting. Lucky you as you get to convert axle TQ to engine TQ in your setup.

Keep an eye on your HPFP and inj duty cycle%

Have fun!

doing a little more digging on this, the 2018 uses an "E80-A" ECM, where the 16 and 17 use an "E80" which is likely the difference. the flex has likely always worked once wired/enabled on the 18 models. GM did this same thing with the LHU ECU's a few years back. (and the chevy cruze....flex doesnt work on the 11, but does on 12+even though its the 'same')

we actually have an 18 ATS here which shares the same part number ECM as the 18 Camaro. im going to try to get that in tomorrow or friday to test the theory that its an 18+ or "e80-a" fix currently. if it is, ill look into swapping the 80-A core into our 17 (if its even feasible). and if that goes well, the 18 core may just be the fix for the 16-17 models!

thanks to the OP for trying this on an 18 model! if this is the fix, this will be HUGE for this community!

This means you guys need to get some HPFP's on the market as well as the high volume LPFP's. Throw in some higher flow inj's as well. hehe

Nice work Coop! That's a heck of a contribution to the ltg camaro forum!

aka huge for your wallet. :grouphug:

Side effects may incluuuuudeeeee.

Seriously tho. The ability to run flex is going to push a LOT of people into more serious builds. Times will get faster. People will get more competitive within, and outside of this market. It will promote innovation and competition, which is ultimately awesome for everybody involved!

I know exactly what your next development product to the table needs to be. You know if your serious when you say you want advance the platform into bigger more progressed builds.

A8 Converter ya do that we will buy if you make.

I'd love to see this come to fruition in any way. e85 is so scarce in my state that I would have no choice but to use a flexfuel option.

Coop, keep up the hard work dawg!

2017 uses the E80a also.....

Just installed our flex kit on an '18, and it works perfectly.

we have had the kit installed the exact same way on a 16 and 17 since last year, and neither work. i took apart the 17 today to double check all of my wiring, and its all correct, it just flat out doesnt do what its told :(

So what are you gonna do to remedy this situation? ;) I need it in my life

Have you tried any other 17’s other than shop car??

i have not personally installed on a 'different car' but we have had a couple in here with brand 'R' kit on it (came in with it) same thing. i did fully remove, and re-install the kit on our 17 as a double check.

Dumb question but do you have to tune for all the different levels of ethanol or can you do a few different percentages and have the tuning software ramp it?

Fuel trims look good, HPFP good Question, why does advance say -3.5 in the table but +6 in the gauge screen?

Wait till you start putting timing into that e85 likes :)

It compensates both fueling and timing with set tables in the ecm for different ethanol percentages. As a tuner you can change any of these tables.

Yeah, I gotta get more timing ramped in still. I keep finding tables that have retard build in where it shouldnt, fighting fuel trims took a lot of time, and is still a working progress. Here is one of the log files if you want to take a look, see if you see anything, or got any advice. All help and knowledge VERY much appreciated!


https://transfernow.net/ddl/e85

Not bad sir! Couple things besides the timing(the rate increase looks good by the way) Bring PE mode sooner Like 30-35% pedal position. 2nd Go to Maff only based fueling if you haven't already Let me know if you are not sure how to do that. There are 2 settings to change to do that. Stock its a combination of VE and maff readings. You should be able to add another 3-4deg on each end of your timing curve as long as you keep boost reasonable.

Thank you sir! I was wondering about bringing PE in a bit sooner. So nix VE ? I was trying speed density, its OK. I will give maf a try though.

VE does work as Mr Gibson tells us, but for the majority of peeps, MAFF works just fine and in my humble opinion is much easier over a variety of conditions.

I was able to get my FT's in low single digits across the board quickly and have a smooth stable idle even when its -15F Most say you can't run corn fuel that cold. The LTG did fine, granted I was only at 40% corn.

It's also easy to make fine adjustments under WOT as well in very specific ranges and when combined with HPTuners smoothing function, works well.

I can only imagine the 20 or so PMs a day.

Haha, see, Jason's not as stupid as he seems lol.

ROFL Jason! :happy0180:

Dialing in VVE isn't necessary to have a pretty smooth running car, with the amount/speed of the fuel trims capabilities in this ecu, but will only help, in any situation.

With that said, I do run 100% speed density, because I run a much larger than stock dia. MAF, something I wanted to do to test setups that will be required for bigger power setups. If you're stock dia MAF or close to it, you can still easily dial in fueling that way as well.

Ok, I see what your saying, appreciated!

I'm getting ready to purchase my credits for the lpfp stuff. Looking at the available tables, everything is a bit foreign, and there is a lot more there than I would have expected to see. Would you mind sharing any tips on what areas to look at here?

There is a lot there, but much of it isn't relevant or necessary right now.

You want to concentrate on the Regulation Pressure and Max Desired Pressure to start. I would personally set the entire Regulation Pressure equal to whatever your max is in that table. Mine was 550kpa for example. Then, set all your Max Desired Pressure somewhere just below that level. I've been running mine at 525kpa, again, as an example.

That alone should allow you to run and hold 76psi on the low side throughout the entire power/rpm band.

The only other table you may need to modify at some point is the OL/ Fuel Pump DC table. This maps out the base duty cycle for the pump, which the ECU thinks will be required to hit the desired pressures. You only need to change this table if you log your LPFP and you're not seeing your max desired pressure at some point, then cross reference that with logged pump DC and see that you're at the duty cycle requested for that flow rate. That just means you need to request a little higher DC in that area.

Perfect!! Thank you VERY much sir. Awesome information to have, and will save me a ton of time researching :)