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Old 07-02-2010, 04:03 AM   #76
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Originally Posted by ViperTomcat View Post
A few notes:

Yes, it could get the new engine. Yes it could be faster, yes it could also kill the new SRT8 Challenger. Yes it could have 440 HP but less torque than the current LS3. Yes it could be awesome.

Yes a Z28, LSA powered Camaro could beat the new 6.4L Hemi Challenger. Yes it could kill it.

But it isnt, its speculation. The 6.4L IS going into the Challenger SRT8 with 480 HP. Basic bolt on mods (such as a catback, tune, longtubes and CAI) will put it over 500 crank HP, if not closer to 525. If it does get a new automatic dont expect the overall weight to raise more than 20 pounds, and it will already be lighter due to the fact it is based on the 5.7L Hemi, and not the 6.1L.

The simple fact is Dodge and Ford have put new engines in their vehicles and have listened to complaints and suggestions. The 2011 Mustang in every trim has either recieved new engines or raises in power. The 2011 Challenger SRT8 has a new engine and is getting a better interior and other changes.

What has the Camaro recieved? a HUD and a new color of paint for the SS. Now GM couldnt do anything really, but they MUST *MUST* do something other than throw a convertible onto the market for next year. The Z28 isnt confirmed, so it doesnt count, I'm sorry.



GM is now compeletly behind in the 2011 HP/Pony/Muscle car wars and has lost the 2011 model year features/numbers war in bragging rights except for 2010 sales. The 2011 GT500 with 550 HP and the 480 HP SRT8 Challenger both overpower and can outrun a LS3 SS. Of course drivers will make the difference.

Do something GM, 2010 was so awesome for you, and I want 2012 to be again awesome. Take 2011 to understand that you cant sit back and gloat, or you WILL lose the war, no matter what battles you won.
2012 should see the introduction of a convertible and a redesigned interior at the least. I'm sure GM will not give the Camaro a raise in power due to the fact it would be rated so close to the Corvette. However, I believe you're putting to much emphasis on sales rather than profit by saying GM will "lose the war."
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Old 07-02-2010, 09:48 AM   #77
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Originally Posted by ViperTomcat View Post
No..I'm saying the SRT's will.

The R/T's arent getting touched. And the Z-28 doesnt even exist, so its compared to the SS because that is the top of the line.
I still feel our "run of the mill" v8 and your "run of the mill v8" is where the comparo lies...otherwise what should the R/T compete against? It is a v8 pony car, it should get some credit and not always overlooked. Do you put it against the v6 camaro and v6 mustang since its performance numbers lie closer to them?

And to be fair, the 6.4L chally doesnt exist yet either...
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Old 07-02-2010, 11:53 AM   #78
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There is absolutely no replacement for DISPLACEMENT!!
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Old 07-02-2010, 06:49 PM   #79
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Old 07-02-2010, 08:38 PM   #80
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There is absolutely no replacement for DISPLACEMENT!!
Think of it as shifting gears...displacement is RPMs, and your shifting is new technology applied to the engine.

I don't think the Z28 will have this engine, for those who've mentioned it...validation testing, etc would mean they'd have to wait at least a year after the engine is released for use in vehicles...you want to wait LONGER for your Z28?

I'm very excited about these engines...GM Powertrain has always put out fantastic engines, but these should be little game-changers.
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Old 07-04-2010, 11:40 PM   #81
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Yup, screw tech-no-logy, screw Chevy. They have no idea how to make the Camaro go faster if they use that new 5.5 DI engine. All they do is stick a bunch of monkeys together to these cars together, they never get stuff right. Especially this 5th gen Camaro. Worst. Car. Ever.
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Old 07-05-2010, 12:00 AM   #82
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i be if it was 4.0 engine with 1000hp and 30 mpg some of you dudes will still find something to whine about and for the people that keep saying they didnt buy their camaro for gas mileage remember you are probably the minority they wouldn't mind a 500hp camaro that does 9mpg
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Old 07-05-2010, 12:13 AM   #83
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Nobody buys a Camaro SS for gas mileage, but in the infinite wisdom of our benevolent government, it would be better if you did, so it is going to be forced on you whether you like it or not.

I would love to see all this power adding technology attached to the LS3 or larger engine (think 500+hp SS), but the realities 35 mpg CAFE will soon make big displacement V8s impossible except for low volume, high priced cars. Once these draconian fuel economy mandates are in farce, the only viable options for a future SS will be downsized V8s or turbo V6s. These new engines are the best you can expect in this regulatory environment.
Bear in mind that the EPA and many other of these beaurocracies which are slowly stealing our liberties are unelected and therefore do not represent the will of the citizens. If we're going to restore our liberties, we must dismantle these institutions and restore the "representation" in our representative republic.
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Old 07-05-2010, 12:21 AM   #84
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so you people are telling me that it's ok for a DI 3.6 v6 to make more hp and tq then a none DI 4.3l v6 version but a DI V8 that's been down sized to less than 6.2 l making more hp and definitely making more tq isn't ok? you got to be kidding me. . .and who said the new gen V would rev higher? this isn't a DOHC motor we are talking about here. granted there might be increases in the redline but not by much.

people like to compare top model to top model with out regard to price. that kills me. you're saying it's ok to compare a 50K and 40k car to a 32-34k car? considering the SRT doesn't slaughter the current SS you are waisting your money on the SRT. . .performance per dollar. and the GT500 isn't even in the same league as the SS. come on it's 50k. if the camaro was priced out that high it better be able to hold it's own against the GT500. but it's not. it's a 31k starting out for the performance it has. . .which puts it in line with the GT. which the GT with brembo's and such is right in between the 1ss and 2ss for price.

As for the people talking about how GM needs to get off it's butt. . .yea fords had an idea what GM was going to release for a while now. they've had time to plan and institute changes and raise the price of the mustang years before to pay for the changes. yea. . .GM isn't asleep it takes time and profits to change something. give them more then a year. sheesh this isn't the 60's any more, where corp spending through the roof and changes were every 30 days. . .
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We do not want to use the Z28 moniker on a car that does not deserve this hallowed name.
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Old 07-05-2010, 12:59 AM   #85
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Originally Posted by boxmonkeyracing View Post
so you people are telling me that it's ok for a DI 3.6 v6 to make more hp and tq then a none DI 4.3l v6 version but a DI V8 that's been down sized to less than 6.2 l making more hp and definitely making more tq isn't ok? you got to be kidding me. . .and who said the new gen V would rev higher? this isn't a DOHC motor we are talking about here. granted there might be increases in the redline but not by much.

people like to compare top model to top model with out regard to price. that kills me. you're saying it's ok to compare a 50K and 40k car to a 32-34k car? considering the SRT doesn't slaughter the current SS you are waisting your money on the SRT. . .performance per dollar. and the GT500 isn't even in the same league as the SS. come on it's 50k. if the camaro was priced out that high it better be able to hold it's own against the GT500. but it's not. it's a 31k starting out for the performance it has. . .which puts it in line with the GT. which the GT with brembo's and such is right in between the 1ss and 2ss for price.

As for the people talking about how GM needs to get off it's butt. . .yea fords had an idea what GM was going to release for a while now. they've had time to plan and institute changes and raise the price of the mustang years before to pay for the changes. yea. . .GM isn't asleep it takes time and profits to change something. give them more then a year. sheesh this isn't the 60's any more, where corp spending through the roof and changes were every 30 days. . .
not even that you have a lot of people that bash the di v6 just because its a v6 so its like arguing with a Celtics fan. if gm comes out with natural v6 that puts out more power that a ss and had 40 mpg they would have something to complain about. but i didn't know lower displacement with more hp and tq per displacement and still being a v8 would get people in here about this.
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