Backpressure? - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

jcaligood · 11-22-2016, 11:42 PM

I've been planning on ordering some long tube headers for a while, been comparing different brands and prices. I really like Speed Engineering headers.

I've been talking to my father about my plans, He's built 3 '68-'70 Chevelle's and many other GM vehicles, mainly older.

He says long tube headers are not worth it, because they reduce the backpressure in your exhaust system, which is responsible for your low end RPM HP.

He says i shouldn't buy headers until i've worked on the bottom end more, because I will lose power with headers.

How true is this? I know he knows what he is talking about. But... are headers not worth the money because they reduce backpressure in the exhaust? How important is this?

I respect my father a lot, please don't flame. Any decent feedback on this would be really appreciated.

Thanks C5!

LCPLPunk · 11-23-2016, 01:39 AM

With all respect due to your father....he's dead wrong. With a decent tune longtube headers will increase power by about 20-30 rear-wheel horsepower and are well worth the $350 (assuming you go with Speed Engineering) you'll spend on them.

fif_gen_powa · 11-23-2016, 01:53 AM

That's one of those "old school" myths that's been debunked, you will pick up hp/tq all over the place especially midrange and up top. Just search for long tube headers dyno sheets there are thousands showing the gains in power

Soybeanrice · 11-23-2016, 01:55 AM

Back pressure is negligible in comparison to just having a bigger pipe.

Theres no comparison between LT and stock manifolds or shorties.

For the cat-back to the axles, the rest is weight savings and exhaust sound preference. Unless youre pushing some big power and need a bigger pipe.

Smokin19 · 11-23-2016, 06:26 AM

"The proof is in the pudding", old quote but, still true. LT headers with a good cat back system have increased the power for just about everyone on this site. The system I have, turned my SS into the animal I always wanted.

MrChrisLS3 · 11-23-2016, 10:59 AM

Your dad isn't completely wrong. He's just got the terminology incorrect. what he's talking about that increases torque and thus power are the concepts of scavenging and vacuum pulse tuning.

14Black1LESS · 11-23-2016, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LCPLPunk

With all respect due to your father....he's dead wrong. With a decent tune longtube headers will increase power by about 20-30 rear-wheel horsepower and are well worth the $350 (assuming you go with Speed Engineering) you'll spend on them.

I agree. This has been proven numerous times.

HDRDTD · 11-23-2016, 12:44 PM

Keep in mind his Dad is referring to LOW END hp (if that makes any difference).

patternpilot · 11-23-2016, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrChrisLS3

Your dad isn't completely wrong. He's just got the terminology incorrect. what he's talking about that increases torque and thus power are the concepts of scavenging and vacuum pulse tuning.

Its nice when someone gets it. I have used tri-Y forms of headers for a long time, for some of these reasons. Scavenging or in other words, creating a low pressure just at the tube end, at the right time, is what headers are all about. Just having a header but not one designed for the your goal is nothing but eye candy. Tube length, tube diameter, collector design, diameter and length are all some of the things you should be looking for. Most of the name brand aftermarket headers have this engineered in their design for you.

Soybeanrice · 11-23-2016, 01:50 PM

Design only matters when you're stuck with one available pipe size. Every dyno chart shows LT headers losing nothing, but also gaining nothing on the bottom end. And I'm talking like under 2k

Can we not try to justify our bad purchases to make ourselves feel better? I've made some mistakes myself and I'm willing to admit it

PalmerGA · 11-23-2016, 02:06 PM

I think you've received some good (and respectful) responses regarding you dad's theory on headers. There is nothing I can add other than to say these modern V8 engines in our Camaros LOVE long-tubes in combination with a good custom tune. I haven't dyno'd my SS before or after adding mine, but my BUTT DYNO says the gains are significant.

Dmpsix · 11-23-2016, 02:30 PM

Dyno and hp blah blah blah... who cares what numbers on a computer say.

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21013

The official 1/4 mile say that just with long tube headers, cold air intake and a ported throttle body have actually made our Camaro's almost two seconds faster at the track (where is actually counts).

KGoddard · 11-23-2016, 03:28 PM

My dad told me the same thing about putting headers on my car haha. Like others have said, the proof is all over this site, they do increase numbers.

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

JerTM · 11-23-2016, 03:44 PM

I think the backpressure myth came about because when a carbureted engine had headers put on it they didn't tune the carb to account for the change. Fuel injected cars simply adjust to compensate for any change. The trusty ol butt dyno felt a little sag when the stepped on it and the only change they made was to the exhaust, so it had to be that, right?

11-22-2016, 11:42 PM	#1
jcaligood Drives: '18 SS 1LE Join Date: Jul 2016 Location: Jax, FL Posts: 405	Backpressure? I've been planning on ordering some long tube headers for a while, been comparing different brands and prices. I really like Speed Engineering headers. I've been talking to my father about my plans, He's built 3 '68-'70 Chevelle's and many other GM vehicles, mainly older. He says long tube headers are not worth it, because they reduce the backpressure in your exhaust system, which is responsible for your low end RPM HP. He says i shouldn't buy headers until i've worked on the bottom end more, because I will lose power with headers. How true is this? I know he knows what he is talking about. But... are headers not worth the money because they reduce backpressure in the exhaust? How important is this? I respect my father a lot, please don't flame. Any decent feedback on this would be really appreciated. Thanks C5!

11-23-2016, 01:39 AM	#2
LCPLPunk USA-1 Drives: 2010 Camaro SS L99 Join Date: Jul 2016 Location: Near DC Posts: 1,893 View My Garage	With all respect due to your father....he's dead wrong. With a decent tune longtube headers will increase power by about 20-30 rear-wheel horsepower and are well worth the $350 (assuming you go with Speed Engineering) you'll spend on them. __________________ "A Camaro in the garage is safe, but that's not what Camaros are built for..." R2C CAI / Apex Scoop / VMAX Ported TB / Speed Engineering LTHs / X-pipe / GPI port/rod-mod intake manifold / Circle D 3200 278mm Converter / 3.91 gears / DynoSteve tuned / 1LE Shocks/Struts/Toe Links / ZL1 Rear Sway Bar / Z/28 Trailing arms / Prothane Radius Arm & Subframe Bushings / BMR UCA Bracket, Steering rack bushing / B&M Tranny Cooler / RX Catch Can / Jannetty Tranny Dipstick / 2012+ Heater Hose / 2013+ Rearview Mirror / Fuel rail flip / Drake shifter / Oil Cooler Delete

11-23-2016, 01:53 AM	#3
fif_gen_powa Drives: 2013 Camaro SS Turbo Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: South Florida Posts: 1,525	That's one of those "old school" myths that's been debunked, you will pick up hp/tq all over the place especially midrange and up top. Just search for long tube headers dyno sheets there are thousands showing the gains in power __________________ 388ci 91/104 Turbo TH400 8.3@164 https://instagram.com/turbo_ls3/

11-23-2016, 06:26 AM	#5
Smokin19 Drives: 19' ZL1 A10, w/pdr Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: S.W. ohio Posts: 1,557	"The proof is in the pudding", old quote but, still true. LT headers with a good cat back system have increased the power for just about everyone on this site. The system I have, turned my SS into the animal I always wanted. __________________ BTR Stg II cam w/ 38% fuel lobe, ARH 2" headers into 3" w/cats, AWE Touring, Kong X port, Weapon X triple ht exchangers, NW 103, Rotofab big gulp, DSX lowside, TCM tune, BMR Lockout, Mustang dyno 720 rwhp, 634 rwtq on 93 pump.

11-23-2016, 02:06 PM	#11
PalmerGA Drives: 2013 SIM 1SS/RS L99 Join Date: May 2012 Location: Southwest GA Posts: 8,755 View My Garage	I think you've received some good (and respectful) responses regarding you dad's theory on headers. There is nothing I can add other than to say these modern V8 engines in our Camaros LOVE long-tubes in combination with a good custom tune. I haven't dyno'd my SS before or after adding mine, but my BUTT DYNO says the gains are significant. __________________ 2013 1SS/RS Coupe L99, Stainless Power Works LT Headers, SCT X4 Custom Tune from RDP, CAI Inc. Air Intake w/ Apex Scoop, VMAX CNC Ported Throttle Body, Solo Axle-Back Exhaust w/ J-pipes, Apex Catch Can, Husky Splash Guards, Heritage Grille, 3D Carbon Rear Spoiler, Oracle Chrome Turn Signal Bulbs, GM Reverse Light Trim Billets, Gorilla Black Locking Lugs, Emblem Pros Retro SS Badges/Custom Retro SS Kickplates/Under-hood Bowtie, 35% window Tint, Nitto Motivo Tires (6-8-18)

11-23-2016, 01:55 AM	#4
Soybeanrice Drives: 2014 2SS/RS Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 793	Back pressure is negligible in comparison to just having a bigger pipe. Theres no comparison between LT and stock manifolds or shorties. For the cat-back to the axles, the rest is weight savings and exhaust sound preference. Unless youre pushing some big power and need a bigger pipe.

11-23-2016, 12:44 PM	#8
HDRDTD Drives: 2013 Triple Black ZL1 Vert M6 ECF Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Trenton, Michigan Posts: 7,047	Keep in mind his Dad is referring to LOW END hp (if that makes any difference).

11-23-2016, 01:50 PM	#10
Soybeanrice Drives: 2014 2SS/RS Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 793	Design only matters when you're stuck with one available pipe size. Every dyno chart shows LT headers losing nothing, but also gaining nothing on the bottom end. And I'm talking like under 2k Can we not try to justify our bad purchases to make ourselves feel better? I've made some mistakes myself and I'm willing to admit it

11-23-2016, 02:30 PM	#12
Dmpsix Drives: Black L99 2SS/RS Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 1,862	Dyno and hp blah blah blah... who cares what numbers on a computer say. http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21013 The official 1/4 mile say that just with long tube headers, cold air intake and a ported throttle body have actually made our Camaro's almost two seconds faster at the track (where is actually counts).

11-23-2016, 03:28 PM	#13
KGoddard Drives: 2013 Camaro 2SS/RS Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: NOVA Posts: 351 View My Garage	My dad told me the same thing about putting headers on my car haha. Like others have said, the proof is all over this site, they do increase numbers. Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk __________________ 12.3 @113MPH - Full Bolt-Ons w/ Nitto 555r on 18" wheel

11-23-2016, 03:44 PM	#14
JerTM Drives: 2011 2SS/RS M6 Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Utah Posts: 1,940	I think the backpressure myth came about because when a carbureted engine had headers put on it they didn't tune the carb to account for the change. Fuel injected cars simply adjust to compensate for any change. The trusty ol butt dyno felt a little sag when the stepped on it and the only change they made was to the exhaust, so it had to be that, right?