Why on earth would going N/A be considered a waste of money and time

[DuskSS]

Originally Posted by Doubleblank

I'll try to give you some competition for the "nastiest" NA motor in a 5th gen. Motor currently in car but pushrods seem a little loose. Remeasuring/re-ordering and should refire next week.

Only running 11.5 to 1 initially with a fairly mild cam. Looking for a monster torque curve as I'm a road track guy and not a drag racer.

Back on topic, my old LS3 made north of 500 and was very driveable running a G5X3 cam, Mast heads, 11.5 compr.

omfg... /droool.....
that sir.. is car porn..

[Ivan @ Southwest Speed]

Originally Posted by Doubleblank

I'll try to give you some competition for the "nastiest" NA motor in a 5th gen. Motor currently in car but pushrods seem a little loose. Remeasuring/re-ordering and should refire next week.

Only running 11.5 to 1 initially with a fairly mild cam. Looking for a monster torque curve as I'm a road track guy and not a drag racer.

Back on topic, my old LS3 made north of 500 and was very driveable running a G5X3 cam, Mast heads, 11.5 compr.

Curious as to why you ran the G5 in the car over the G6....I know Anthony (@ LG) and I talked in length about why they did the same thing on their One Lap car as well.

Car/Motor looks beast brah. Keep up the great work!
Ivan :flag2:

[mikeSS]

Originally Posted by Ken_

How many people here need 500+ whp on a daily basis anyway? Going even further, how many people have even had the experience of a 500+ whp car? It doesn't seem to matter which car, type, model and series... everybody chases big numbers... and the funny thing is that most people can't even give you 5 reasons why they need some sort of gain way over stock.

This is not aimed at anyone who has come up in the game and can speak from experience and knows their reasons (race-oriented). It's just that 80% of the consumer market for aftermarket power-adders do it for some other reason than racing, but they will throw in "racing" within their reasons (even if they have no experience at the track or no inclination to go learn) (hey we all have egos or want to be accepted; human psycho crap).

As for me, I've been more in imports where FI is more of a way of life, and my 2SS being my first foray into the world of V8 power, I want to learn this engine and car, so for me, it's all over-built suspension (HP means nothing without being able to hook) and chassis tuning, followed by intake and exhaust, then a cam and all of course with tuning. I don't want to go FI off the bat because I'll never know what it is like from stage 1 and up.

Personally, I like the sound of a lopey cam, and I have always envied that sound. Just like Harleys have their own unique sound, so does a V8 muscle car with a cammed engine. Anyway, my two fils (we don't have cents here).

because there only needs to be one reason. Its what the person wants.

I did suspension upgrades and full cam build, with zero intentions of going to the track. even had better and lighter rims and tires. It simply made the car more fun than factory and sound a hell lot better. Did i go for a big WHP number, not really. put a somewhat mild cam in and made around 455WHP. and to be honest i was happy with stock power.

just because you do not hit the track means you cannot build a powerful engine, even if its for daily driving ? kind of BS


Track or not i am a car enthusiast!

[Doubleblank]

Originally Posted by Ivan @ Southwest Speed

Curious as to why you ran the G5 in the car over the G6....I know Anthony (@ LG) and I talked in length about why they did the same thing on their One Lap car as well.

Car/Motor looks beast brah. Keep up the great work!
Ivan :flag2:

I wasn't involved in the original parts selection. It was a shop car when Momentum was operating up in Dallas. But being that we all were (and still are) road racing, I'd bet the decision was for a slightly better torque curve versus peak hp in the G6. IIRC, I think Anthony said I might pick up 10 to 15 hp if I replaced the G5 with the G6......at a slight cost to low end torque.

[davidcroft]

Originally Posted by jasonpope2003

my plans are Night Fury Cam and heads and supporting mods this year being that the night fury is an OUTSTANDING FI cam it will be ready for a SC next year.

OUTSTANDING FI CAM?

[DuskSS]

Originally Posted by davidcroft

OUTSTANDING FI CAM?

have doubts?... pull up youtube and check out Nicks and other Lethal car times..
there is no disputing it.

the Lethal Cars flat destroy at the track with that cam and a blower setup.

[davidcroft]

I know 113 lobe separation angle cams work with forced induction Okay....but definitely not outstanding. Waaay too much overlap for a blower setup to gain maximum potential.

[Ken_]

Originally Posted by Kelly@PCMofNC

Well, need is very relative...to be fair you could just as easily say why do any of us need Camaros in the first place, when a Camry will also get us from A to B?

I didn't need a Camaro, but the fact that I can buy one and I grew up racing and do race were my justifications, and I won't be seen in a Camry. I'll be in the Lancer (the DD I never mention) because I don't need the output that the Camaro puts out to just get to and from work.

Originally Posted by jasonpope2003

actually Ive had 4 cars in the 500-600 hp range over the years.
they are a blast to drive and far more fun than stock.

if you were not into speed why buy a Camaro? you can drive a FRS for half the cost and enjoy the curves with no power.

to me Cars are ALL about the most power and who draws the most attention at car shows and on the track.
that is the enjoyment I get.
I was born a motor head in 71 and raised at the track with my dad and was driving fast cars and motorcycles since the day I was old enough to reach the pedels.

Going fast is in my blood and dna.. I will never out grow that.

I have raced 1000cc Superbikes, drag raced 700hp cars and roadraced anything else I could get my hands on.
life to me is about the next part in my car or bike.
and the next trip to the track or car show.

And I respect that and going fast is in my blood, too, and I have a family that supports my interest in all go-fast stuff, and getting the Camaro was a group decision. We like speed.

Originally Posted by mikeSS

because there only needs to be one reason. Its what the person wants.

I did suspension upgrades and full cam build, with zero intentions of going to the track. even had better and lighter rims and tires. It simply made the car more fun than factory and sound a hell lot better. Did i go for a big WHP number, not really. put a somewhat mild cam in and made around 455WHP. and to be honest i was happy with stock power.

just because you do not hit the track means you cannot build a powerful engine, even if its for daily driving ? kind of BS


Track or not i am a car enthusiast!

Truthfully, that's all it really boils down to. We're all enthusiasts. I didn't say that you have no business building/modding your engine if you don't race or have no intention to.

My point was after having been around this lifestyle for so many years in various vehicles, there's a group of people who just grab a magical number and think it's what is going to make them happy, and when you ask them pointed questions, they have no idea how they arrived at that magical number, and even further, they don't even know the numbers they currently have. But yes, in the end, it's what they want. I just go about my stuff in my own methodology that makes sense to me. Maybe it doesn't make sense to anyone else, but in the end, it's what I want.

Anyway, this all seems to be a very sensitive issue to most. Good luck and have fun.

[thahemp]

Originally Posted by Ken_

Anyway, this all seems to be a very sensitive issue to most. Good luck and have fun.

It's not a sensitive issue. You do this in a lot of threads I've seen. You post something that will definitely draw a backlash, then get defensive when the backlash comes.

Originally Posted by Ken

How many people here need 500+ whp on a daily basis anyway? Going even further, how many people have even had the experience of a 500+ whp car? It doesn't seem to matter which car, type, model and series... everybody chases big numbers... and the funny thing is that most people can't even give you 5 reasons why they need some sort of gain way over stock.

This is not aimed at anyone who has come up in the game and can speak from experience and knows their reasons (race-oriented). It's just that 80% of the consumer market for aftermarket power-adders do it for some other reason than racing, but they will throw in "racing" within their reasons (even if they have no experience at the track or no inclination to go learn) (hey we all have egos or want to be accepted; human psycho crap).

As for me, I've been more in imports where FI is more of a way of life, and my 2SS being my first foray into the world of V8 power, I want to learn this engine and car, so for me, it's all over-built suspension (HP means nothing without being able to hook) and chassis tuning, followed by intake and exhaust, then a cam and all of course with tuning. I don't want to go FI off the bat because I'll never know what it is like from stage 1 and up.

Personally, I like the sound of a lopey cam, and I have always envied that sound. Just like Harleys have their own unique sound, so does a V8 muscle car with a cammed engine. Anyway, my two fils (we don't have cents here).

You make broad generalizations about the people here and their apparent inability to do things for 5 reasons. It's your tone that draws the responses that you get. No one likes a person that can dish it out but can't take it...

[BLACK10]

Originally Posted by davidcroft

I know 113 lobe separation angle cams work with forced induction Okay....but definitely not outstanding. Waaay too much overlap for a blower setup to gain maximum potential.

really? it works good enough to run 10.0 and make 700+rwhp on 10 psi

how would you determine this without knowing our lobe profile, ect?

[Ken_]

Originally Posted by thahemp

It's not a sensitive issue. You do this in a lot of threads I've seen. You post something that will definitely draw a backlash, then get defensive when the backlash comes.



You make broad generalizations about the people here and their apparent inability to do things for 5 reasons. It's your tone that draws the responses that you get. No one likes a person that can dish it out but can't take it...

I guess if I'm going to be an A-hole, I may as well go full bore then, but that's not who I am. Thanks for the constructive criticism.

I say what I say (chasing HP numbers) because I have seen this all before regardless of the car or group, and yes, most can't tell you how they got to some sort of number- maybe a SWAG (a scientific wild ass guess), because their friend says it is or a magazine said it is. Then you ask how are you going to get there, and then the reply is hellifino. I used to have to sit down with people like this and ask these questions because these were business decisions. It existed well before me, and will exist for as long as there are things that go fast. I think it's completely stupid to shoot for 500+ whp when 450 whp would suffice, hell, maybe 250 whp, but again as stated it's what the person wants. I don't get warped over it because it ain't my shit.

Back on the original thread topic, my stance is that it is not a waste of time. What I think makes no difference to anybody else. In the end, it's my car and my money and whether I stay NA or go FI (which will probably happen knowing my tendencies) and it's your car and money and so forth and so on. How one wants to get up there where the big numbers are is a their business.

Again, thanks for your constructive critique of my online persona.

[DuskSS]

Originally Posted by Ken_

I guess if I'm going to be an A-hole, I may as well go full bore then, but that's not who I am. Thanks for the constructive criticism.

I say what I say (chasing HP numbers) because I have seen this all before regardless of the car or group, and yes, most can't tell you how they got to some sort of number- maybe a SWAG (a scientific wild ass guess), because their friend says it is or a magazine said it is. Then you ask how are you going to get there, and then the reply is hellifino. I used to have to sit down with people like this and ask these questions because these were business decisions. It existed well before me, and will exist for as long as there are things that go fast. I think it's completely stupid to shoot for 500+ whp when 450 whp would suffice, hell, maybe 250 whp, but again as stated it's what the person wants. I don't get warped over it because it ain't my shit.

Back on the original thread topic, my stance is that it is not a waste of time. What I think makes no difference to anybody else. In the end, it's my car and my money and whether I stay NA or go FI (which will probably happen knowing my tendencies) and it's your car and money and so forth and so on. How one wants to get up there where the big numbers are is a their business.

Again, thanks for your constructive critique of my online persona.

Who are you to say what will "suffice"?

thank goodness you aren't in charge of performance division at GM or the dept of transportation we would all be regulated to driving Smarts with 100hp if it were up to you it sounds.

There is no such thing as "enough" there is always something else to shoot for they are called "goals"

and last time I checked Track times combined with dyno slips were a pretty good indicator of true HP.

BTW his critique of your online persona is on the money you do come off harsh and condescending.

Now I know I do as well sometimes but people I know have brought it to my attention and I have been trying to be better at writing to not sound like that type.
Sometimes we should listen to others about how they see us.

[thahemp]

Originally Posted by Ken_

I guess if I'm going to be an A-hole, I may as well go full bore then, but that's not who I am. Thanks for the constructive criticism.

I say what I say (chasing HP numbers) because I have seen this all before regardless of the car or group, and yes, most can't tell you how they got to some sort of number- maybe a SWAG (a scientific wild ass guess), because their friend says it is or a magazine said it is. Then you ask how are you going to get there, and then the reply is hellifino. I used to have to sit down with people like this and ask these questions because these were business decisions. It existed well before me, and will exist for as long as there are things that go fast. I think it's completely stupid to shoot for 500+ whp when 450 whp would suffice, hell, maybe 250 whp, but again as stated it's what the person wants. I don't get warped over it because it ain't my shit.

Back on the original thread topic, my stance is that it is not a waste of time. What I think makes no difference to anybody else. In the end, it's my car and my money and whether I stay NA or go FI (which will probably happen knowing my tendencies) and it's your car and money and so forth and so on. How one wants to get up there where the big numbers are is a their business.

Again, thanks for your constructive critique of my online persona.

You're welcome. I was genuinely trying to help.

They probably choose the 500+ number because that is the only way they have to describe how fast their car is to their peer group. Yours is probably a different story, but most of the people in my life would look at me confused if I started throwing 1/4 mile times at them. 500 sounds impressive to non-gearheads and it IS impressive to actual gearheads that know what it takes to get this motor there.

[Ken_]

Originally Posted by jasonpope2003

Who are you to say what will "suffice"?

thank goodness you aren't in charge of performance division at GM or the dept of transportation we would all be regulated to driving Smarts with 100hp if it were up to you it sounds.

There is no such thing as "enough" there is always something else to shoot for they are called "goals"

and last time I checked Track times combined with dyno slips were a pretty good indicator of true HP.

BTW his critique of your online persona is on the money you do come off harsh and condescending.

Now I know I do as well sometimes but people I know have brought it to my attention and I have been trying to be better at writing to not sound like that type.
Sometimes we should listen to others about how they see us.

LOL! I'd suck at those places because I'm just like you, but may not present it as well as you do, and I truly appreciate when someone reins me in from being a harsh condescending jerk.