200 Miles of Bliss!

[davidscamaro]

Originally Posted by 152LTRockin

TY we will, I'm thinking about making a ram air system for it. I looked at the present air filter system, it could use ALOT of improvement.

10mpg that's kookoo and too much for me at the pump but I'm sure its a experience to drive.

davidscamaro you gotta come out of the closet<this DOOD prolly owns a Yugo

I honestly don't know what the hell a yugo is , but I do own a 2015 Yamaha grizzly 700 sitting on 28" mud zillas that see's more time being a swamp submarine than you could ever imagine

You ever been up to you neck in mustkeg trying to get through impassable trails.... did not think so. Come out for a day quading with my crew and you be crying for your mommy in the first hour

[152LTRockin]

Where I see improvement's is in the temp and isolation from the condenser and radiator. The intake is in a good spot bit not pulling good isolated cold air. The tubing is not insulated with the rad directly in front of it. Even a 10 degree difference in temp will add something. Also there is a pulse wave going back and forth in the intake, this reversion can be taken advantage of by tuning the length of the tube and adding louvers that limit back flow in the entire air-intake system. Even the Ram Air on my Ta's responded to much better throttle response by modifying the inlet lid. I'm sure you have seen lids they sell? Also if you ever take your throttle body off you will be shocked what is behind it. There is a small cone shaped opening that funnels the air into the intake. I'm sure its there to distribute the PCV gases-oil vapor evenly across all the cylinders but its a huge restriction. I notice when you buy a ported intake they remove this entire piece. I may not remove it but I will explore opening it up a bit and smoothing it. Sometimes its the little things that add up to more drivability and that means funner to drive<I no funner aint know werd.

[CamaroFred]

Originally Posted by 152LTRockin

Where I see improvement's is in the temp and isolation from the condenser and radiator. The intake is in a good spot bit not pulling good isolated cold air. The tubing is not insulated with the rad directly in front of it. Even a 10 degree difference in temp will add something. Also there is a pulse wave going back and forth in the intake, this reversion can be taken advantage of by tuning the length of the tube and adding louvers that limit back flow in the entire air-intake system. Even the Ram Air on my Ta's responded to much better throttle response by modifying the inlet lid. I'm sure you have seen lids they sell? Also if you ever take your throttle body off you will be shocked what is behind it. There is a small cone shaped opening that funnels the air into the intake. I'm sure its there to distribute the PCV gases-oil vapor evenly across all the cylinders but its a huge restriction. I notice when you buy a ported intake they remove this entire piece. I may not remove it but I will explore opening it up a bit and smoothing it. Sometimes its the little things that add up to more drivability and that means funner to drive<I no funner aint know werd.

It draws from the area between the radiator and headlight. The tube is plastic, it doesn't need any more insulation. Even if it does get warm the air passes through it to quickly to absorb heat.
If you monitor your IAT from the sensor you will see a rise when idling at a stop. It will quickly fall back to only a degree or two above ambient when moving.
Some remark that the throttle doesn't open 100% when floored from a stop. This has been done for many years as a means to equalize the distribution and maintain velocity. And not only for the PCV. Some throttle plates open to direct air towards the front of the motor. With the computer control directing the throttle plate anything is possible, unlike the old days when vacuum was the primary source.

Be careful removing what you think is a restriction. I've been there and having a bog as a result is not what you want. Sure they remove it on a ported throttle body, and maybe that's good at the top of the 1/4 mile, but it may not be something you want for everyday drivability. The engineers spend millions of dollars and thousands of computer hours modeling air flow, under all possible conditions from -40° to +140°, too dry, too wet, etc.
I have to believe they know more than what looks good.


I won't tell you not to experiment, but don't be surprised if your results aren't what you expected.

[152LTRockin]

Fred don't worry I don't live near you and Top Gun won't be lookin fur ya..... lmao

[davidscamaro]

All bullshit aside the "v8 vs v6" stuff , Fred just gave you some incredibly good advice. Velocity is king when tweaking naturally aspirated motors. Hogging out the intake manifold and air box makes sense on forced induction motors. On a naturally aspirated motors it is not recommended unless you only want your car to live at 6000+ rpm. I get were you coming from with past experiences with opening up the lid on a ls1 f body but with the new achievements of computer designs use on cars them days are over and the gains for so called "free mods" are just not there any more. Cold air intake only nets 3hp+ and even the most precise manifold port will only net 9hp+ to 12hp+ at the top of the rev range

[ForgedReality]

Originally Posted by gringo

That's okay. I'll rather take an engine that sounds like a million dollar Ferrari than a sickly farting sound when the AFM activates on a sluggish V8.

Uh... Who the hell buys an automatic? The correct transmission doesn't have AFM.

[gringo]

Originally Posted by ForgedReality

Uh... Who the hell buys an automatic? The correct transmission doesn't have AFM.

I kind of agree, but since the automatic is faster, at least on the newer 6th gens, that's all people care about.

[gringo]

Originally Posted by 152LTRockin

Where I see improvement's is in the temp and isolation from the condenser and radiator. The intake is in a good spot bit not pulling good isolated cold air. The tubing is not insulated with the rad directly in front of it. Even a 10 degree difference in temp will add something. Also there is a pulse wave going back and forth in the intake, this reversion can be taken advantage of by tuning the length of the tube and adding louvers that limit back flow in the entire air-intake system. Even the Ram Air on my Ta's responded to much better throttle response by modifying the inlet lid. I'm sure you have seen lids they sell? Also if you ever take your throttle body off you will be shocked what is behind it. There is a small cone shaped opening that funnels the air into the intake. I'm sure its there to distribute the PCV gases-oil vapor evenly across all the cylinders but its a huge restriction. I notice when you buy a ported intake they remove this entire piece. I may not remove it but I will explore opening it up a bit and smoothing it. Sometimes its the little things that add up to more drivability and that means funner to drive<I no funner aint know werd.

You still have to deal with less than 100% throttle plate opening at WOT until 40 mph though. I think Overkill can get close, but it can't be eliminated entirely from the tune on what I've read.

Jason@JacFab did remove that small coned shaped opening you're talking about on his ported TB's and found it to be a restriction when testing before and after on a flow bench. He describes this in pretty good detail in his old posts in the V6 forum.

It's interesting you mention the pulse wave that travels back and forth through the intake tract when the intake valve opens and closes. What you are referring to is what engineers call standing waves of the 1st, 2nd and 3rd Harmonic.

The old GM tuned port injection (TPI) took advantage of this feature, particularly the 3rd Harmonic standing wave, to force feed air into the cylinders at a certain rpm range. Hence the name, tuned port injection. The problem was, the intake system was originally designed for the 305 SBC.

When GM decided to keep the 350 around, they just used the same intake system on that engine as well. It boosted torque output just like on the 305, but the airflow requirements were not enough to feed the larger displacement engine so it ran out of breath pretty early in the rpm band (<4400 rpms).

[ForgedReality]

Originally Posted by gringo

I kind of agree, but since the automatic is faster, at least on the newer 6th gens, that's all people care about.

Manual is always way more fun and more capable. There are things you can do with a manual that you can't do in an automatic. I don't care how fast an automatic can shift. I'll never own one if I can help it. If a car only comes in auto, that's 100% a dealbreaker for me. But then, most people aren't enthusiasts. :(

[gringo]

Originally Posted by ForgedReality

Manual is always way more fun and more capable. There are things you can do with a manual that you can't do in an automatic. I don't care how fast an automatic can shift. I'll never own one if I can help it. If a car only comes in auto, that's 100% a dealbreaker for me. But then, most people aren't enthusiasts. :(

Automatic only would have been a deal breaker for me too. Thankfully, they had a few V6 manuals to choose from when I bought mine.

[fhrex]

Originally Posted by davidscamaro

V6 are for feminists and tree huggers that sit out front of Starbucks and complain about how everyone should be like them .....Just take another puff off your vape and chive on you under powered v6 fan girl. Pathetic excuse for a motor


V8 rule the world , it's our world buddy and your just kinda living in it

SS FOR LIFE

what the hell is with this troll?

[2010reddevil]

Originally Posted by ForgedReality

Manual is always way more fun and more capable. There are things you can do with a manual that you can't do in an automatic. I don't care how fast an automatic can shift. I'll never own one if I can help it. If a car only comes in auto, that's 100% a dealbreaker for me. But then, most people aren't enthusiasts. :(

I would like to know this feature that a manual can do that a well tuned auto can't. I'm definitely interested hearing this one. Rev matching? 6A has it..... Direct drive? 6A has that too. Ability to shift faster than your arm can physical throw a gear lever? Yep..... 6A has that covered as well. So what can a stick do that today's modern auto can't? If you're talking about the driving experience, it is different yes, but I bought my auto with the sole intention of low ETs and consistency. Ask the poor schmuck LS3 owner who got his butt kicked raw by me this past weekend...... LOL.

[Moto-Mojo]

Originally Posted by davidscamaro

All bullshit aside the "v8 vs v6" stuff , Fred just gave you some incredibly good advice. Velocity is king when tweaking naturally aspirated motors. Hogging out the intake manifold and air box makes sense on forced induction motors. On a naturally aspirated motors it is not recommended unless you only want your car to live at 6000+ rpm. I get were you coming from with past experiences with opening up the lid on a ls1 f body but with the new achievements of computer designs use on cars them days are over and the gains for so called "free mods" are just not there any more. Cold air intake only nets 3hp+ and even the most precise manifold port will only net 9hp+ to 12hp+ at the top of the rev range

I'll keep quoting this old thread til the cows come home or someone disproves it. The GM CAI dyno'd a 16HP increase. Look it up.

[152LTRockin]

I've been involved in many design developments, 1st thing you learn is there is no such thing it can't be improved. Its how far do you want to take it. Its like MATURITY, you can act like a 12 year old till you're 75 or YOU CAN GROW THE EFF UP!

Good Lord you guys