[oldman]

First a story. I had a 440 Dart from HS on up, I built it, I raced it, the body rusted out, I put it in a Signet, The best it ever did was 12.2 on plain old biasply Pos-o-tracktion tires at 116 MPH. Some of this was due to the 4.10 gears and I never sprung for the 3.54. I raced anything and everything. Usually down at the beach. I knew my competition and for a DD, it was near untouchable. Sure Bone has a 396 solid cam 4.88 gears in his Nova and it was quicker, if he did not blow the tires away and that is when the car actually ran. Sure Keoni's turbo bug was quicker, and I used to see him drive to work, but lets be serious, not many guys can pull the wheels off the ground two gears. For the most part the 440 was dominant as a true DailyDriver.

Now the LT1, there are three types of performance from a DD,

One the strip of road I've driven 20 years on turning onto at the end of highway. It is clear and straight, usually I do a run from a standing start to a marker sign, I know my supercharged Challenger can do at 82 MPH, I know my Type R can do it in 88, traction limited in two gears, the Camaro at 91 MPH, and my supercharged Civic also very traction limited 89 MPH. I've done this may hundreds of times. It helps me judge the mods. I'm sure many of you have the same strip of open road. I estimate the distance to be nearly 1/8 mile. I bring this up only to show in this case any or no modes are fun, well minimal, plus the practice makes perfect for the inevitable.

Two, the infamous stop light challenge. Lets be honest here, the last time this happened in my Challenger is from a old clapped out 5.0 / 4.6 in like a 1998 body with the way too loud and too big exhaust system. Not even worth my time. The Camaro, nope. Now my Type R I get hassled a lot, but usually it is by Mini Coopers or a once in a while Focus. Needless to say at 275 HP and 2400 LBS, these guys are candy. Most of these are over by 70 MPH, at least for me, the highway speed here is from 70 to 85 MPH.

But the day will come for the Camaro, here is my honest list of fear:

Challenger: Nope, and please don't bring up a Hellcat, I've only ever seen one while driving. Chances of lining up against one is zero. Plus there is always faster.

Mustang: nope, I'm sure there a few DD that are faster than me, but for the most part, I'm confident enough.

Viper, Vette plus supercharger, clearly they are big dogs, I'm just an oldman listening to my easy listening station AM, never troll the streets... look forward don't engage.... we all know my tail is between my legs right?

All the rice rockets, even the STI and Evo, bring it. I've been racing a long time and for every 12 second of faster Evo, there are 500 DD that are lucky to get a low 13. Yep I have buds with low 12 second Evo, and I've help them change a truck load of parts. Nice cars and all but bing it. Better blow me by 3 lengths or more from the get go.

Now without further ado my fear is a LT1 A8 or 9, clearly the gear spread on the car just really gives them an edge. The M6 has a LOOOONG pull of first to 54 MPH, and at 70 MPH at shut down for me I'm just hitting 5600 rpm, Meaning I'm spending a whole lot of time off my power band. Check the "chart"

http://www.camaro6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=409961

Solution:
1) Need some real tires, I'm looking at some ultra high perf summer tires of about 220 wear, I'll change them every few years. Usually they dry rot before a wear them out. Pole Position S04 or Conti Extreme Contact DWs. I have P Zero Nero summer on the Challenger and they are excellent. Just looking for something new...
2) 4.10 gears. To my mind this is the ideal stop light challenge gear for the M6, I can come off the line and work my way through a light bog and rely on the gear to pull me through. Right now it is blow the tires away, or slip the clutch thru a light bog. This situation will actually get worst with the sticky summer tires IMO.
3) Anything that fattens midrange torque sans supercharger:

a) CAI, the CAI dyno charts shows a nice nay FANTASTIC power gain across the board
http://www.camaro6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=444318

b) Keep the try-Y but go for cat delete, retain rear cats, these stock headers seem to work better than the Vette's cast 4 to 1, and are very similar to the Z/28. Just rid of some of the back pressure. 1.5 MPH in the 8th is about 10 HP or so.
http://www.camaro6.com/forums/showthread.php?t=438748
b1) why not long tubes? I agree these have been showing a nice increase but it has been on the low side for my 2K. For 1/4 mile LT for sure. But this is a 0 to 70.
c) Tune, the tune is showing a nice across the board increase, Diablo is saying 25 HP with tune and filter:
https://www.diablosport.com/images/r...orvette_C7.jpg
Once again please note the across the board increase. The M6 needs the mid-range.


d) MSD intake, these long tuned runners should really help in the midrange, maybe too big for stock or almost stock engines. The dyno on a stock engine looks really strong.
http://www.camaro6.com/forums/showth...=432278&page=2

Sure I know you guys are saying will the A8 / A9 can do that too. Yep there is always faster. I'm just looking for a fighting chance.

Things that probably won't help, but I'll probably do: cnc heads, small cam just for fun.

Comments?

Last is from a roll. I'll be honest here, I don't think the A8 / A9 has a chance. mod for mod. Of course I need more mods to keep up with a Vette, but from an A8, I think the M6 is slightly superior. Anything from the above list would help but I think in no particular order:
1) long tubes,
2) MDS intake
3) CAI
4) tune
5) heads and cam

rolls are from 30 MPH to 70 MPH, usually the person with the jump is going to "win". but ya never knw.

Hope this thread just barely touches forum rules. Beakup into small groups and discuss. Bare in mind I'm only interested in drivable across the board increases. Sure I may just go supercharger and be done with it. I already have one and just a few weeks ago two supercharged toys... Plus I think really for a DD, the LT1 with the above mods is more than enough 99 percent of the time, there will always be faster / quicker. Also note, of course all these dyno are not additive. But even if you add them up and divide by 1/2 a CAI, MSD Intake, Cat delete, tune is gonna be worth 30 across the board HP and that should help pull the M6 out of its "slow" 0-54 MPH first gear... or I put 4.10 in a be done... LOL

[bpang1234]

It's as though your inner-monologue took over your fingers and banged out a long post about who you should fear on the street. I'm not sure you were actually looking for comments.

Seems like all your solutions make sense, from what I can tell you seem to be telling us you have been there, done that and have the shirt.

[oldman]

Originally Posted by bpang1234

It's as though your inner-monologue took over your fingers and banged out a long post about who you should fear on the street. I'm not sure you were actually looking for comments.

Seems like all your solutions make sense, from what I can tell you seem to be telling us you have been there, done that and have the shirt.

yep, but last time I had an auto... DR Nitto, high stall, cam, et all. Still interested in what other M6 guys are going to do...

[oldman]

OK, I started my build
I order the MSD intake from JDP
https://www.jdpmotorsports.com/
A forum vendor, great price, free shipping.

I ordered the CAI and the tuner from dynosteve, a forum vendor, a great price, free shipping and let me say this. Several people have recommend dynosteve to me. Good service, good price, etc. RDP, they come highly recommended.
http://rdpstore.com/default.aspx

Steve tossed in a free tune for ALL my mods even the ones I did not buy from him.. How's that?!

I ordered the CAT delete, front cats only still got the rear, bolt on, made in America from 6LE Design
http://6litereaterdesigns.com/store/...?cPath=165_320
http://6litereaterdesigns.com/store/...roducts_id=755
note they got a cool SEMA stripe... tempted... forum vendor

I order stock size tires, from TireRack, I decided to go with Pole Position S04 they were on sale and I've been impressed by them. I've been running Nitto 555 and Pirelli P Zero Nero Summer on the Challenger, very impressed to say the least, I just wanted to try something new. I run Direzza on the Type R and these are the best tires made IMO, they just don't come in Camaro sizes (upto 19"). These are by far the best tire I ever ran on street, autoX, back woods, street fight. Wear is not too bad at 200. TireRack of course forum vendor.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....160320041156:s

I'll dyno it all when I get them in. A 2016 SS M6 just dyno a few weeks back at 404 WHP dynojet SAE, the exact same HP as the Scat Pack a few minutes before. So my I'll just used that as a baseline as I don't have time now with spring break over.

Till then I'll just shy away from A8 / A9 guys.... I did see two Vipers on the road today, one with that massive and mean oh my god massive ACR wing...

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by bpang1234

It's as though your inner-monologue took over your fingers and banged out a long post about who you should fear on the street. I'm not sure you were actually looking for comments.

Seems like all your solutions make sense, from what I can tell you seem to be telling us you have been there, done that and have the shirt.

Lol

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by oldman

I run Direzza on the Type R and these are the best tires made IMO, they just don't come in Camaro sizes (upto 19"). These are by far the best tire I ever ran on street, autoX, back woods, street fight.

Ok, I think I understand street and autoX but I never heard of tires described as being good for back woods and street fight. What does that mean?

[oldman]

it means they are responsive in the real world twisties. It also means that in a street fight they can lay the HP to the ground. I've had many tires from biasplyu Pos-O-Traction to run flats with silicate. The Derizza are phenomenal tires
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/...y.jsp?ttid=197

The ONLY strange thing is they make no noise on break away, none, burn out, 4 wheel drifts completely quite....

Dunlop Direzza ZII Star Spec (Extreme Performance Summer 245/40R18 93W)
What We Liked: Ultimate traction and handling when driven at the limit
What We'd Improve: Noise level and ride comfort on the road
Conclusion: This tire is serious business on the track, but pays the price during everyday commuting

[oldman]

The weapons have arrived.
Also it seems that the 8.6 takes the same gear so richmond's gear should fit 4.10 or 4.11
Found a lead on a local heads and cam package custom built for under $2000!

[oldman]

all parts installed waiting for first canned tuned. Went trolling today for the mythical 1K WHP Mustangs in reference to another thread that I have to be afraid of in the "serious" street scene.... LOL

Well I'm happy to report that the car is now traction limited from a 30 MPH roll so mid range torque is definitely up. With two people I ripped off 10 or more sub 4.0 zero to sixty runs, now I can honestly believe there is wheel spin far into second gear, 54 mph is about 4300 RPM in second. As stated I'm really hesitant to do anything the will loose midrange torque.

Nest mod is the cat bypass which are on order. I have a custom tuner lined up and a local vendor will supply me CNC heads and cam for sub 2000. So far this car has simpler than a LS1.

[oldman]

Nest mod is the cat bypass which are on order. I have a custom tuner lined up and a local vendor will supply me CNC heads and cam for sub 2000. So far this car has simpler than a LS1.

http://pages.suddenlink.net/turbo5/stock
http://pages.suddenlink.net/turbo5/caicai

got my new tune here is a zero to 80 run (top of second gear)

[oldman]

I was tossing supercharger around before, this article changed my mind:
http://www.motortrend.com/news/2015-...term-update-5/

Ultimately, as good as the Corvette Z06 is, I think I’ve found the rare exception where I’d rather have the “slow” version of a car rather than the high-power version. For me, driving a car where all the horsepower on tap is easily accessible far outweighs having performance potential that I’ll never use.

[ULTRAZLS1]

Are you considering e85?

Huge gains...

[oldman]

I'm actually looking into it. I'm more into tinkering so Heads and cam now or wait to summer of next year. That is my big debate.

[ULTRAZLS1]

For 35rwhp nothing comes close for the money.

A full bolt on e85 SS should be pretty deadly. I'm hoping it is and maybe I won't do heads/cam for a while.