[SlingShot]

Originally Posted by SVT Murrocket

The '13 GT 500 is a LOT faster than the ZL1...It will dominate it as many open-minded folks thought.

In a straight line, YES the GT500 is faster ... By a lot, kinda depends on your definition of a lot. Other than a straight line, we really don't know as of yet. We also don't really know about the straight line until it gets into the hands of private owners.

I really don't base anything off of propaganda by either manufacture, or by the different mags or any of the media chest thumping fest.

Personally I know what I drive and it's stock and is faster than 90% of the stock cars on the road that I see on a daily basis.

[oortcloud]

Originally Posted by NoWRX

Ford needed to bump up the GT500 because there wasn't enough differentiation between the Boss and the '12 GT500 in terms of performance.

I have no proof for what I'm about to write. I'm just thinking out loud.

Another reason is that they wanted to close the gap with the zl1 on the road course. I have no idea if ford knew about the zl1's capabilities early enough to make this decision. But if they did, then they knew they needed to do something. I mean, if you win on the 1/4 but get dominated on the curves then it's not so impressive. They could either upgrade the suspension or pour on the HP to catch up in the straights. It looks like they kinda did both. They built in the hp and made the track pack a 6.5k option.

[Lonny Doyle]

The competition between muscle cars is the best thing that could ever happen for the consumers.

This competition will give us better products and will also help keep the cost down.

Now GM needs to play their next piece.

I would have liked to see how the GT500 compared to the ZL1 at base price or add 10 thousand to a ZL1 and compare them. Just to compare apples to apples.

I hope we get to see some head to head track times between the two soon.

[69bossnine]

I have a good honest gut feeling that the 2013 GT500 is going to give the ZL1 all it wants on the road course as well.. Faster? I'm not going to play Carnac the Magnificent on that forecast... BUT, I think one car will be nipping the heels of the other, and what it's REALLY going to come down to is which car feels most-balanced, and which car translates the experience through the chassis and steering wheel in the most satisfying way...

Sometimes over-computerize-ization and control of chassis movements can make better lap times, but dull the fun. THAT'S the risk of the ZL1, and that's the same reason that stripped-down Porsches always get such rave track reviews.

Other times the car can be a bit too primitive and hard-core-handful around the track, and maybe that'll be the GT500's nemesis.

But mark me on this, don't expect the ZL1 to walk the GT500 in the open-track testing. Ford's covered all their bases thusfar, I doubt they settled for "ehhh, that's close enough" on the track testing.

[ffrcobra_65]

Originally Posted by Rock36

LOL well you will only get credit for the prediction if they are run on the same day . I predict the next lightning lap will have both cars present...

true dat!

Driven by the same competent driver, the GT500 will be faster everywhere but to the nearest gas station. Driven by average drivers, the ZL1 will be more confidence-inspiring and easier to go fast on. That is what I am after.

[BigHemiSrt]

Originally Posted by SlingShot

We also don't really know about the straight line until it gets into the hands of private owners.

So youre saying theres a chance the ZL1 is still faster in a straight line?

[motorhead]

Originally Posted by ffrcobra_65

true dat!

Driven by the same competent driver, the GT500 will be faster everywhere but to the nearest gas station. Driven by average drivers, the ZL1 will be more confidence-inspiring and easier to go fast on. That is what I am after.

You've been saying that a lot ,but many of the earlier reviews would make one think differently.

One reviewer even said that the GT500 is so well controlled that they felt they were missing some of the fun factor. I think a lot of people are going to be surprised at just how well the GT500 does at inspiring confidence and going fast.

[SlingShot]

Originally Posted by BigHemiSrt

So youre saying theres a chance the ZL1 is still faster in a straight line?

I already said it wasn't, I was just questioning what the definition of "a lot" was by some posters.

[proxemics]

drive what you like /end

[nanokpsi]

Originally Posted by SlingShot

In a straight line, YES the GT500 is faster ... By a lot, kinda depends on your definition of a lot. Other than a straight line, we really don't know as of yet. We also don't really know about the straight line until it gets into the hands of private owners.

.

At 126mph, the difference is roughly 6 car lenghts for half a second, and that is assuming the Z has the same speed, which it certainly does not. That yields a pretty large gap after a quarter mile, where the more powerful car is handicapped more from the launch. Not to metnion the gap is very much increasing as the speeds get higher.

...but I digress, mayber that isn't a big difference to you....

[ffrcobra_65]

Originally Posted by motorhead

You've been saying that a lot ,but many of the earlier reviews would make one think differently.

One reviewer even said that the GT500 is so well controlled that they felt they were missing some of the fun factor. I think a lot of people are going to be surprised at just how well the GT500 does at inspiring confidence and going fast.

I keep saying that with regard specifically to Roadcourse use. While it is amazing what Ford has done with the SRA, but when it comes to the roadcourse, for me having driven IRS and SRAs, I feel more confident in the IRS. I predict the new GT500 with SVT-PP will be faster in a roadcourse than the ZL1 but if I were to drive both cars back to back, (given my level of average skill)I predict that I will be more comfident clipping corners, blasting in and out in the ZL1.


The FFR in my sig has SRA and believe me, while it rode like a go-kart around turns, it was a handful and made me work a lot in keeping things planted and pointed where I wanted to go..it was always a fine dance with power and quick reflex. On the other hand, I had a '95 M3 that was nothing in HP compared to the FFR but I was more confident driving fast in it, in roadcourse and especially in canyon roads. My '11 GT500 with SVT-PP is a blast to drive in roads with turns but like the FFR, it was easily upset by road imperfections....still excellent though. I am getting old, my reflex/reaction and concentration aren't as good as they used to be.

[BigHemiSrt]

I would say anything faster than 5mph or more is a lot.

[motorhead]

Originally Posted by ffrcobra_65

I keep saying that with regard specifically to Roadcourse use. While it is amazing what Ford has done with the SRA, but when it comes to the roadcourse, for me having driven IRS and SRAs, I feel more confident in the IRS. I predict the new GT500 with SVT-PP will be faster in a roadcourse than the ZL1 but if I were to drive both cars back to back, (given my level of average skill)I predict that I will be more comfident clipping corners, blasting in and out in the ZL1.


The FFR in my sig has SRA and believe me, while it rode like a go-kart around turns, it was a handful and made me work a lot in keeping things planted and pointed where I wanted to go..it was always a fine dance with power and quick reflex. On the other hand, I had a '95 M3 that was nothing in HP compared to the FFR but I was more confident driving fast in it, in roadcourse and especially in canyon roads. My '11 GT500 with SVT-PP is a blast to drive in roads with turns but like the FFR, it was easily upset by road imperfections....still excellent though. I am getting old, my reflex/reaction and concentration aren't as good as they used to be.

I gotcha. So you're thinking that the new GT500 will jump around more due to the SRA when it hits uneven surfaces. I'm sure your right ,but I don't know if it will be that much different unless pushed really hard. For me I'm a straight liner so I'm not worried about that end of it.

[69bossnine]

If waiting to see some ham-fisted dork, who's never rolled into staging beams before, who just bought his 2013 GT500 as part of a middle-age-crisis, to bring his car out to a test and tune and absolutely stink up the track with some mid/high-12-second painful-to-watch passes....

If waiting to see that happen, and it WILL happen (it happens when any hot new car comes out, the inexperienced dorks migrate to the track like penguins travelling inland to breed), makes you feel better about this whole GT500 vs. ZL1 matter, then that's fine.

Just know that equal-doses of hapless ZL1 owners will be putting on similar displays of ineptitude across the dragstrips of America.

In short, waiting for private-hands drag strip runs won't change anything. You'll see the entire gambit, from guys easily matching or even exceeding the efforts of the magazines, to guys who ought not be allowed a drivers license.