Advice - min understeer for wide staggered tires - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

DrP · 02-28-2017, 09:50 PM

My totally stock 2013 2SS is getting new rubber soon - 275/40 on 20x9 and 315/35 on 20x10.5.

It is my daily driver, and power upgrades are in its future.

What will bring the understeer close to neutral?

Should the 1LE track pack get it close? Would it need other help? Coilovers? Is there a different path?

Appreciate your thoughts!
Patrick

KillboyPowerhead · 03-01-2017, 05:39 AM

A bigger rear sway bar ought to do the trick. The factory 1LE rear bar would be a good match for the stock front.

DrP · 03-01-2017, 06:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KillboyPowerhead

A bigger rear sway bar ought to do the trick. The factory 1LE rear bar would be a good match for the stock front.

Thanks for the pointer!

After a bigger rear sway, is there any trick to picking coilovers when I am ready? Or should all of the good ones give the same road manners?

Thanks,
Patrick

PostNup · 03-01-2017, 08:15 AM

Search and or pm JusticePete.

Hands down the man when it comes to our suspensions!!

Mods at bottom of my sig going in today. Will hopefully have updated skid pad info soon.

KillboyPowerhead · 03-01-2017, 08:37 AM

Haven't looked into coil-overs much myself, but it all depends on your needs. I guess ideally you'll want ones with separate spring rate/damping rate/height adjustments, and the ones with the remote oil reservoirs allow for a greater suspension travel before bottoming out when lowered, but naturally when you get all of the bells and whistles you'll be paying more too.

If you're very into racing then coil-overs are the way to go but if you're racing only on occasion (or not at all) then I imagine the 1LE struts (or Z28's if you're willing to pay) are probably satisfactory (unless you want to be lowered).

I believe JusticePete said that he found that the Camaro performs best with equal spring rates front and rear so that's another thing to consider when choosing, but that also depends on your tire sizes, sway bar sizes, etc.

JusticePete · 03-01-2017, 11:06 AM

With those rear wheels and tires, we want to use a JPSS 32mm rear bar with your OE front bar. Thise big meats in the rear are also going to put a load on your trailing arms and toe links. I really like the Z/28 parts for that. Up front we use JPSS billet bushing inserts to control dynamic caster and toe changes. These parts will do more than bring balance. hey will improve every aspect of your driving dynamic where paired with a dead nuts balls on accurate aluignment.

DrP · 03-01-2017, 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JusticePete

With those rear wheels and tires, we want to use a JPSS 32mm rear bar with your OE front bar. Thise big meats in the rear are also going to put a load on your trailing arms and toe links. I really like the Z/28 parts for that. Up front we use JPSS billet bushing inserts to control dynamic caster and toe changes. These parts will do more than bring balance. hey will improve every aspect of your driving dynamic where paired with a dead nuts balls on accurate aluignment.

Great info! Please PM me a quote for the sway and inserts shipped to 77581.

DrP · 03-01-2017, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JusticePete

With those rear wheels and tires, we want to use a JPSS 32mm rear bar with your OE front bar. Thise big meats in the rear are also going to put a load on your trailing arms and toe links. I really like the Z/28 parts for that. Up front we use JPSS billet bushing inserts to control dynamic caster and toe changes. These parts will do more than bring balance. hey will improve every aspect of your driving dynamic where paired with a dead nuts balls on accurate aluignment.

Are there any coilover recommendations unique to this setup?

Thanks,
Patrick

derieu · 03-01-2017, 02:32 PM

pm'ed

KillboyPowerhead · 03-01-2017, 03:42 PM

Just to clarify: you have a non-1LE SS, correct? The 1LE front bar is a fair bit bigger than the non-1LE.

DrP · 03-02-2017, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KillboyPowerhead

Just to clarify: you have a non-1LE SS, correct? The 1LE front bar is a fair bit bigger than the non-1LE.

Yes, non-1LE 2SS.

acammer · 03-02-2017, 01:45 PM

How much power are you looking to add? A good 275 will hook quite a bit of power pretty well, if you're looking to eliminate some under-steer bias maybe a square setup of 275's all around would be a good fit for you.

I don't have extensive track experience with my square setup, but I've spent enough time loading it up in corners to know that it's stable on the brakes, neutral mid-corner with a smooth progressive break-away at limit, and the expected oversteer bias if you're too greedy on exit.

I've yet to be able to make this car plow - maybe at sub 30mph speeds it would in an auto-x setting, but on track it was pretty balanced with stock SS stuff and square 275 performance all-seasons. The limits were unexpectedly low with the sub-par tires, but very neutral and very progressive on the limit.

And the bonus - front to back tire rotation.

DrP · 03-02-2017, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by acammer

How much power are you looking to add? A good 275 will hook quite a bit of power pretty well, if you're looking to eliminate some under-steer bias maybe a square setup of 275's all around would be a good fit for you.

I don't have extensive track experience with my square setup, but I've spent enough time loading it up in corners to know that it's stable on the brakes, neutral mid-corner with a smooth progressive break-away at limit, and the expected oversteer bias if you're too greedy on exit.

I've yet to be able to make this car plow - maybe at sub 30mph speeds it would in an auto-x setting, but on track it was pretty balanced with stock SS stuff and square 275 performance all-seasons. The limits were unexpectedly low with the sub-par tires, but very neutral and very progressive on the limit.

And the bonus - front to back tire rotation.

Over time I plan to increase the power to just short of "I gotta change my underwear." I won't know what that is for me till I get there.

acammer · 03-03-2017, 07:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrP

Over time I plan to increase the power to just short of "I gotta change my underwear." I won't know what that is for me till I get there.

Then you need all the tire you can get. Disregard the above from me, add the fatter rear swaybar. Gonna be a little bit of trial and error to get the feel where you want it.

02-28-2017, 09:50 PM	#1
DrP Drives: 2013 2SS in AGM Join Date: Feb 2016 Location: H-town Posts: 30	Advice - min understeer for wide staggered tires My totally stock 2013 2SS is getting new rubber soon - 275/40 on 20x9 and 315/35 on 20x10.5. It is my daily driver, and power upgrades are in its future. What will bring the understeer close to neutral? Should the 1LE track pack get it close? Would it need other help? Coilovers? Is there a different path? Appreciate your thoughts! Patrick __________________

03-01-2017, 08:15 AM	#4
PostNup CAR-DASHIAN Drives: 2015 Ashen Gray Metallic 2SS/RS L99 Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: Gilbert, AZ Posts: 540	Search and or pm JusticePete. Hands down the man when it comes to our suspensions!! Mods at bottom of my sig going in today. Will hopefully have updated skid pad info soon. __________________ PERFORMANCE: ColdAirInductions CAI, ADM Race Scoop, Cordes Performance Racing Ported TB/IM/Custom VVT Cam, WFO Milled Heads, Stainless Power 1 7/8" LT/3" HFCs, JBA 3" Comp. Cat-Back, Taylor 10.4mm Plug Wires, Tim King Performance Stage 3 6L80, Circle D Billet 3600 Stall, Nic D ECM/TCM Tune, - 458rwhp/413rwtq (prior to PIM), Forgestar F14 (F)18" / (R)17" Rims. SUSPENSION: Z/28 Rear UCA Bushings, Carlyle Racing LCA/TA, BMR Adj. Toe Rods/Xtreme Anti-Roll Bar, Justice Pete Castor Locks/Radius Rod Inserts, Pegasus Billet Rear Cradle Bushings, Mickey Thompson Street SS II 305/45/17 tires.

03-02-2017, 01:45 PM	#12
acammer GPI Sales Consultant Drives: 2011 Camaro 2SS SGM Join Date: Jul 2016 Location: Weedsport, NY Posts: 2,794 View My Garage	How much power are you looking to add? A good 275 will hook quite a bit of power pretty well, if you're looking to eliminate some under-steer bias maybe a square setup of 275's all around would be a good fit for you. I don't have extensive track experience with my square setup, but I've spent enough time loading it up in corners to know that it's stable on the brakes, neutral mid-corner with a smooth progressive break-away at limit, and the expected oversteer bias if you're too greedy on exit. I've yet to be able to make this car plow - maybe at sub 30mph speeds it would in an auto-x setting, but on track it was pretty balanced with stock SS stuff and square 275 performance all-seasons. The limits were unexpectedly low with the sub-par tires, but very neutral and very progressive on the limit. And the bonus - front to back tire rotation. __________________ GPI Max Package 2.0: Brodix BR7 heads/GPI porting, MAX3 cam, ST2116LSR, BSR Max Lift rockers, LS7 LSXR with 103mm TB, Vararam OTR, Mcleod RXT, G-Force/Strange 9" IRS setup with 4.63 gear. 551whp, 11.1@124mph. *Got a question about a GPI product? Feel free to shoot me a message!*

03-01-2017, 05:39 AM	#2
KillboyPowerhead Drives: 2015 Z/22 Join Date: Aug 2015 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 931	A bigger rear sway bar ought to do the trick. The factory 1LE rear bar would be a good match for the stock front.

03-01-2017, 08:37 AM	#5
KillboyPowerhead Drives: 2015 Z/22 Join Date: Aug 2015 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 931	Haven't looked into coil-overs much myself, but it all depends on your needs. I guess ideally you'll want ones with separate spring rate/damping rate/height adjustments, and the ones with the remote oil reservoirs allow for a greater suspension travel before bottoming out when lowered, but naturally when you get all of the bells and whistles you'll be paying more too. If you're very into racing then coil-overs are the way to go but if you're racing only on occasion (or not at all) then I imagine the 1LE struts (or Z28's if you're willing to pay) are probably satisfactory (unless you want to be lowered). I believe JusticePete said that he found that the Camaro performs best with equal spring rates front and rear so that's another thing to consider when choosing, but that also depends on your tire sizes, sway bar sizes, etc.

03-01-2017, 11:06 AM	#6
JusticePete Drives: Camaro Justice Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Virginia Posts: 20,174	With those rear wheels and tires, we want to use a JPSS 32mm rear bar with your OE front bar. Thise big meats in the rear are also going to put a load on your trailing arms and toe links. I really like the Z/28 parts for that. Up front we use JPSS billet bushing inserts to control dynamic caster and toe changes. These parts will do more than bring balance. hey will improve every aspect of your driving dynamic where paired with a dead nuts balls on accurate aluignment.

03-01-2017, 02:32 PM	#9
derieu Engineer Drives: 2014 Camaro 2SS RS 1LE Join Date: Jun 2015 Location: SE Michigan Posts: 230	pm'ed

03-01-2017, 03:42 PM	#10
KillboyPowerhead Drives: 2015 Z/22 Join Date: Aug 2015 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 931	Just to clarify: you have a non-1LE SS, correct? The 1LE front bar is a fair bit bigger than the non-1LE.