[Posaune]

[DenverTaco07]

Originally Posted by Wireeater

That's just not how it works... They build cars based off of previous sales. No business is trying to sell LESS volume than the previous years, they are trying to sell MORE, hence why they refresh designs, chassis, tech, etc. They aren't trying to keep loyal customers they already have, but have other people buy outside of their prefered brands. No business, especially one with shareholders is aiming to produce LESS units than a previous year. The whole, less but for more profit doesn't make any sense unless you can prove it with facts. GM's overall sales are coming from their SUV, trucks and economy vehicles. Everything else is in the negatives. The overall success speaks nothing for the sales of the Camaro. It just means they are generating enough profit through other sales of the business to raise the stock prices.

GM, if i recall correctly - actually is trying to sell less Camaros as they stated they are purposefully trying to reduce rental fleet sales.

Also, the whole sales thing is more complicated than saying all companies just want to sell more - not really true. If they have data that shows they can sell less Camaros with larger margins they are working less for the same amount of profit - not only that, but it may allow them to free up resources to work on other vehicles to make more money, and that is the only real goal..more money, not more sales necessarily, though there is obviously a correlation.

"In the U.S., both Ford (NYSE:F) and General Motors (NYSE:GM) compete hard for commercial and government fleet sales -- and Fiat Chrysler (NYSE:FCAU) has said that it would like to win more of that business.

But sales to rental-car fleets are a different story. GM said recently that its sales to rental-car fleets are down 11 percent in 2015. That's not lost business; it's a planned reduction."
http://www.fool.com/investing/genera...eet-sales.aspx


and

"Just last week, we told you that General Motors has substantially increased its Average Transaction Prices while decreasing sales to rental fleets, which are significantly less profitable than retail sales to individual customers and can even decrease new car values. The automaker had not previously shared the details on reducing rental car sales, until this week."

http://gmauthority.com/blog/2016/03/...units-in-2016/


Again, MAXIMIZE PROFITS, not necessarily equates to Maximize sales.

[rubamen]

The camaro is a combination of 3 cars in one Cadillac ats and corvette .the mustard got no other car to share sales with .i'm happy with that.don't want to see my car every 5 minutes

[haticK]

Originally Posted by rubamen

The camaro is a combination of 3 cars in one Cadillac ats and corvette .the mustard got no other car to share sales with .i'm happy with that.don't want to see my car every 5 minutes

Battle of the Condiments!

[Posaune]

Originally Posted by DenverTaco07

GM, if i recall correctly - actually is trying to sell less Camaros as they stated they are purposefully trying to reduce rental fleet sales - I could be wrong but I remember that as being a change from last gen.

Also, the whole sales thing is more complicated than saying all companies just want to sell more - not really true. If they have data that shows they can sell less Camaros with larger margins they are working less for the same amount of profit - not only that, but it may allow them to free up resources to work on other vehicles to make more money, and that is the only real goal..more money, not more sales necessarily, though there is obviously a correlation.

"In the U.S., both Ford (NYSE:F) and General Motors (NYSE:GM) compete hard for commercial and government fleet sales -- and Fiat Chrysler (NYSE:FCAU) has said that it would like to win more of that business.

But sales to rental-car fleets are a different story. GM said recently that its sales to rental-car fleets are down 11 percent in 2015. That's not lost business; it's a planned reduction."
http://www.fool.com/investing/genera...eet-sales.aspx


and

"Just last week, we told you that General Motors has substantially increased its Average Transaction Prices while decreasing sales to rental fleets, which are significantly less profitable than retail sales to individual customers and can even decrease new car values. The automaker had not previously shared the details on reducing rental car sales, until this week."

http://gmauthority.com/blog/2016/03/...units-in-2016/


Again, MAXIMIZE PROFITS, not necessarily equates to Maximize sales.

Camaro fleet mix last year was in the mid-upper teens percentage. It was not a huge fleet vehicle and there are still some fleet sales to rental agencies for the 6th gen. The planned fleet reduction by GM doesn't account for sales being off 42%, 40% and 26% over the last three months.

FWIW...Word on the street is Camaro fleet is about 8-10%.

[2ssconvert]

I like that my car is rare...I see a ton of mustangs, but have only come across a handful of the new Camaro...and mine has been only convertible.
I suspect the GM is pushing oversees markets...I was told there was a problem in Canada where people were buying these cars up for export to Asia.

[Realist]

Heading into the months where sales #s of these types of cars drop even more so it's gonna get uglier. I turned in my leased 1LE in July. 6 vettes right in front of the Chevy dealer and not 1 camaro. No camaro on the showroom floor. Limited selection in color and trim levels. In base form the SS just doesn't move me enough to pull the trigger so didn't waste anymore time. Looking forward to seeing the 1LE in showrooms.

[DenverTaco07]

Originally Posted by Posaune

Camaro fleet mix last year was in the mid-upper teens percentage. It was not a huge fleet vehicle and there are still some fleet sales to rental agencies for the 6th gen. The planned fleet reduction by GM doesn't account for sales being off 42%, 40% and 26% over the last three months.

FWIW...Word on the street is Camaro fleet is about 8-10%.

Not saying the planned reduction accounts for the entire disparity. I'm saying that
A. They are trying to sell less vehicles by reducing rental fleet (which proves that it's not always about high sales numbers).
B. Their per transaction margins ARE UP, so they are maximizing profit with less sales. (work less for more = winner winner chicken dinner).

that's all.

[newmoon]

Another indicator that Chevy has missed the mark with this 2016 Camaro regardless of its performance. They are now getting spanked by the Challenger which essentially has the same design since its 2008 intro, nevermind the Mustang.

The idea that Chevy didn't want to sell more cars is ridiculous. The cars are sitting on the dealer lots awaiting huge discounts which Chevy will be forced into very soon. I say give it a few months and look for 5-6k discounts.

[Raven87]

Look, this is not bitching when the facts are clear that the newest version of the Camaro is DROPPING in sales numbers each month while the other two competitors' numbers are rising.

This disingenuous assumption that GM is selling the number they want is ludicrous. If that is the case, they would not have a 4 month inventory on the lots and they would not be making more and more each day only to see them get stacked deeper with the hope that, well, they will sell eventually and we will make the big bucks when it does.

Just like the 5th Gen Z/28.

I don't buy it for one minute that this declining sales number is or will remain acceptable. While making good profit on the car that is sold is good business, selling LESS and LESS of them each month is not sound sales strategy. You would not want to incur production costs in an item for sale IF IT DOES NOT SELL and the sales drop consecutively.

When buyers see the lots getting more and more of the cars just sitting there the thought process is that 'Any day now will be the fire sale with big rebates'. So they wait even more - or go buy a Mustang or Challenger.

And we all know that using rebates to move product tells you one thing - it was overpriced to begin with. GRRR!

This has nothing to do with selling more than Ford or Dodge - it has to do with selling what you make. If what you make does not sell, there is a problem.

GM has a problem with the new Camaro sales plain and simple and anyone who thinks otherwise has their head in the sand. You can argue that they would have more incentives if they were worried but GM has proven before that they wait too late to do enough things that should have been done long before the ax fell.

[BigCee66]

Originally Posted by Wireeater

That's just not how it works... They build cars based off of previous sales. No business is trying to sell LESS volume than the previous years, they are trying to sell MORE, hence why they refresh designs, chassis, tech, etc. They aren't trying to keep loyal customers they already have, but have other people buy outside of their prefered brands. No business, especially one with shareholders is aiming to produce LESS units than a previous year. The whole, less but for more profit doesn't make any sense unless you can prove it with facts. GM's overall sales are coming from their SUV, trucks and economy vehicles. Everything else is in the negatives. The overall success speaks nothing for the sales of the Camaro. It just means they are generating enough profit through other sales of the business to raise the stock prices.

EXACTLY. This is how ALL businesses work. Sell make money then sell MORE ,plus the power of shareholders is beyond what you could possible imagine lol. Anyone thinking its all about the 'Loyal" dollars is smoking on something good n potent.

[Wireeater]

Originally Posted by DenverTaco07

GM, if i recall correctly - actually is trying to sell less Camaros as they stated they are purposefully trying to reduce rental fleet sales.

Also, the whole sales thing is more complicated than saying all companies just want to sell more - not really true. If they have data that shows they can sell less Camaros with larger margins they are working less for the same amount of profit - not only that, but it may allow them to free up resources to work on other vehicles to make more money, and that is the only real goal..more money, not more sales necessarily, though there is obviously a correlation.

"In the U.S., both Ford (NYSE:F) and General Motors (NYSE:GM) compete hard for commercial and government fleet sales -- and Fiat Chrysler (NYSE:FCAU) has said that it would like to win more of that business.

But sales to rental-car fleets are a different story. GM said recently that its sales to rental-car fleets are down 11 percent in 2015. That's not lost business; it's a planned reduction."
http://www.fool.com/investing/genera...eet-sales.aspx


and

"Just last week, we told you that General Motors has substantially increased its Average Transaction Prices while decreasing sales to rental fleets, which are significantly less profitable than retail sales to individual customers and can even decrease new car values. The automaker had not previously shared the details on reducing rental car sales, until this week."

http://gmauthority.com/blog/2016/03/...units-in-2016/


Again, MAXIMIZE PROFITS, not necessarily equates to Maximize sales.

You keep talking about the Company as a whole. This discussion isn't about what GM is doing across the whole business. Cutting fleet sales isn't just for the Camaro, it's for many models. Their profits, or sales growth for July reflects nothing in regards to the actual Camaro in the reports so far other than they are down compared to previous yearly figures. This thread is in regards to the Camaro sales. And so far, nobody has shown any proof that the Camaro is selling the way GM wants it to, or if it's profitable, or if they really want to sell less units at a higher cost/profit. Everyone is just making assumptions.

[ChefBorOzzy]

Originally Posted by Raven87

Look, this is not bitching when the facts are clear that the newest version of the Camaro is DROPPING in sales numbers each month while the other two competitors' numbers are rising.

Technically, Mustang sales have been going down the last 3 months.. No idea how they compare year over year, but the peak was in April I believe and it's been going down since then... Still selling lots though.

[ssrs2lt]

Sales drive profit..