[Evergreen6]

Originally Posted by silversleeper

In other electric news Acura is making a new electric hearse looking
crossover so it can take itself out for burial after the model is so unpopular?

Another GM Ultium Platform rebadge.

This ranks up there in weirdness like the time GM borrowed Honda's 3.5L V6, or when a GM truck was sold as a Saab, or when Toyota borrowed the Cavalier.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by silversleeper

…

In other electric news Acura is making a new electric hearse looking
crossover so it can take itself out for burial after the model is so unpopular?

I saw the Acura ZDX (and Honda Prologue) in the flesh several weeks ago. 'Looks pretty good imho.

Interiors are dramatically different from Blazer EV (Prologue) and Lyriq (ZDX) with the GM vehicles having nicer, more modern interiors.

Originally Posted by Evergreen6

Another GM Ultium Platform rebadge.

This ranks up there in weirdness like the time GM borrowed Honda's 3.5L V6, or when a GM truck was sold as a Saab, or when Toyota borrowed the Cavalier.

FWIW I was right in the thick of the Honda and Saab episodes. Here’s a behind the scenes take..
Honda
I was actually very involved in this one. I was Director - GM Powertrain Planning at the time. This was during one of the phases of “merger-mania” where auto companies were merging and/or acquiring each other. Honda sort of indicated that they were concerned that they might be forced to merge with Toyota. That’s like saying “Ford, you need to merge with GM”. So GM and Honda were talking at high levels in ways to collaborate without establishing equity positions in order to complicate any forced merger of Honda with Toyota.

At the time, GM was in the process of bringing out the Saturn Vue and we were also in the process of developing a new DOHC V6 (the same V6 that wound up in 5th and 6th Camaro). The HFV6 was intended to launch as the uplevel engine in the Saturn Vue. It was running late in development. So this was seen as a window of opportunity to create a tie-up with Honda. So we re-structured the launch cadence of the HFV6 and made the deal to acquire the 3.5L V6 / 5 speed from Honda for the Saturn Vue. That allowed us to place the HFV6 in more appications.

Shortly after that GM and Honda entered into a long term agreement to co-develop Hydrogen Fuel Cell technology. Honda engineers moved to Pontiac, Michigan and were housed on the GM Powertrain campus. They are still there. GM and Honda just recently started shipping hydrogen fuel stacks from their jointly operated Brownstown Twp plant. This was the plant that used to build batteries for Chevrolet Volt.

Saab
The GMT360 and GMT370 programs were super successful at launch. This was the Chevrolet Trailblazer / GMC Envoy twins. GMT360 was the short wheelbase, GMT370 the long. GM acquired Saab during all the aforementioned merger-mania and was looking for additional opportunities to expand the Saab product line. So the Saab 9-7 was added to the portfolio to ride the GMT360 popularity wave. GM had also acquired a large stake in Subaru. There was a Subaru version (Ascender?) of the GMT360. And Oldsmobile (Bravada) as well. When Oldsmobile was dropped the Bravada was morphed into the Buick Rainier. We also took the Subaru WRX and made a Saab version, the 9-2, that was commonly called the “Saabaru”

So, at the time that Saab produced the 9-7 SUV off of the GMT360 program, Saab was a wholly owned subsidiary and brand of GM.

[Evergreen6]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

FWIW I was right in the thick of the Honda and Saab episodes. Here’s a behind the scenes take..

Interesting details, thanks for sharing. I knew that GM owned Saab at that point, it was just so weird to have a GMT rebadged as a Saab. Arguably, it was one of the nicer GMT360's, but it was solidly "Weekend at Bernie's" for the Saab enthusiasts. The brand was dead at that point.

From memory, please correct me if I'm wrong:

I recall the Ascender was an Isuzu, not surprising, GM and Isuzu have long established ties. I recall they had a heavy hand in the Gen 1 Colorado/Canyon GMT355. Collab on the development of the V8 Duramax. Powertrain sharing on the early 1st gen S10, and Isuzu had their own S10 twin for a long time, the Hombre.

The Saabaru was about the kinkiest automotive mixup I think I've ever seen. A Subaru wearing a Saab getup at the command of its master at the time, GM. Oof.

I worked for GM/Chevy dealerships when the GMT360 came out. V8 power out of a V6, 4.2 inline (Atlas, which we discussed above). It felt modern, sounded good, was a great size. They were extremely popular. Every one to hit our lot was sold within days.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by Evergreen6

Interesting details, thanks for sharing. I knew that GM owned Saab at that point, it was just so weird to have a GMT rebadged as a Saab. Arguably, it was one of the nicer GMT360's, but it was solidly "Weekend at Bernie's" for the Saab enthusiasts. The brand was dead at that point.

From memory, please correct me if I'm wrong:

I recall the Ascender was an Isuzu, not surprising, GM and Isuzu have long established ties. I recall they had a heavy hand in the Gen 1 Colorado/Canyon GMT355. Collab on the development of the V8 Duramax. Powertrain sharing on the early 1st gen S10, and Isuzu had their own S10 twin for a long time, the Hombre.

The Saabaru was about the kinkiest automotive mixup I think I've ever seen. A Subaru wearing a Saab getup at the command of its master at the time, GM. Oof.

I worked for GM/Chevy dealerships when the GMT360 came out. V8 power out of a V6, 4.2 inline (Atlas, which we discussed above). It felt modern, sounded good, was a great size. They were extremely popular. Every one to hit our lot was sold within days.

You’re right! That’s why Subaru Ascender sounded strange to me. It was Isuzu Ascender and there was no Subaru GMT360.

I’m sure typing V6 was force of habit. The 6-cylinder in GMT360 was the 4.2L Inline, not V. It also got V8 fuel economy, which is why it didn’t stick around very long.

[Evergreen6]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

You’re right! That’s why Subaru Ascender sounded strange to me. It was Isuzu Ascender and there was no Subaru GMT360.

I’m sure typing V6 was force of habit. The 6-cylinder in GMT360 was the 4.2L Inline, not V. It also got V8 fuel economy, which is why it didn’t stick around very long.

Ha! yes, typing V6 is a habit. It was definitely an inline 6. I had its shorter 5-cylinder sibling in a Colorado a long time ago.

[SSE 4 2SS]

If you wish this thread closed, keep up the name calling and off topic and ideological comments.

The relevant rules are listed below.

1) Respect & Be Helpful — By far, the most important rule here. Generations of GM enthusiasts have come together through a shared passion for the car and the community, so the golden rule applies: Treat others as you wish to be treated. This means no foul language, insults, or rude remarks towards other members.

We’re here as a family of enthusiasts, and we should act accordingly. And since the site is constantly gaining new members, please go out of your way to help answer others’ questions in an effort to make this an even better community.

2) Agree to disagree — We encourage spirited discussions where members can contribute to the forum, and we understand that not everyone will be in agreement on a particular subject. However, repeated opposing posts with disrespectful intent to ‘win’ a debate will be moderated accordingly.

6) Off-Limit Discussions — There are a few topics for which we have zero tolerance policy based on past experience or simply the nature of the topic. They are: Politics (automotive-related regulations discussions are allowed), Religion, Pornography, Law Enforcement-Bashing, and Street Racing. Any posts of this nature will be removed without warning or notification at a moderator’s discretion.