[RagingHawk]

Camaro's in trouble ....


....
....

GT listed as ...:

450HP
410TQ

=

+15 HP
+10lb/ft

[Chadicus]

If these numbers are accurate then I expect the SS to continue to outperform it

[BlaqWhole]

Wasn't worth waiting for.

[Bhobbs]

Those could just be speculation. The 0-60 times don't make sense from what we know about existing Mustangs. I think those power numbers are about what the 5.0 gained in the F150. I would expect more from the 5.0 in the GT.

[newmoon]

Unless they have drastic weight reduction or have found a way to make the 5.0 actually make power/tq below 5000-rpms it won't be enough to overtake the SS or the Scatpack.

[Mustang Fanboy]

Originally Posted by newmoon

Unless they have drastic weight reduction or have found a way to make the 5.0 actually make power/tq below 5000-rpms it won't be enough to overtake the SS or the Scatpack.

Just the addition of the 10 speed is enough to nearly catch up to both. Don't underestimate the value of a good converter and transmission. Hell, it's the only reason the Scatpack is quicker than the current 5.0.

In all reality, with both the manual and auto's being upgraded...along with the extra HP and torque coming (I'd expect the HP to be in the 455 range), the 5.0 is going to be neck and neck with the current SS. It may not overtake it, but it really doesn't have to....as Ford only needs to do enough to maintain sales and profit.

Also keep in mind, the mustang is only 80lbs heavier than the camaro. Were not talking about 300 lbs here. The Performance pack is getting lighter weight forged wheels and lighter weight (and all around better) Michelin PS4 tires.

[ChefBorOzzy]

You guys realize the GT PP is rated at a measly 23 mpg on highway, right? That's worse than a DINOSAUR ENGINE LT1. I bet they had to focus more on the mileage than power output.

All that low end torque on the Camaro must help out in the mpg department.

[ChefBorOzzy]

Originally Posted by Mustang Fanboy

Just the addition of the 10 speed is enough to nearly catch up to both. Don't underestimate the value of a good converter and transmission. Hell, it's the only reason the Scatpack is quicker than the current 5.0.

In all reality, with both the manual and auto's being upgraded...along with the extra HP and torque coming (I'd expect the HP to be in the 455 range), the 5.0 is going to be neck and neck with the current SS. It may not overtake it, but it really doesn't have to....as Ford only needs to do enough to maintain sales and profit.

Also keep in mind, the mustang is only 80lbs lighter than the camaro. Were not talking about 300 lbs here. The Performance pack is getting lighter weight forged wheels and lighter weight (and all around better) Michelin PS4 tires.

I think you meant to say the Camaro is 80 pounds lighter.. Also, the 10 speed auto doesn't cut as much time from performance figures as many people seem to think. It didn't do much for F150 and it probably won't do much for Mustang. Maybe a tick or two in the 1/4.

[Mustang Fanboy]

Originally Posted by ChefBorOzzy

You guys realize the GT PP is rated at a measly 23 mpg on highway, right? That's worse than a DINOSAUR ENGINE LT1. I bet they had to focus more on the mileage than power output.

All that low end torque on the Camaro must help out in the mpg department.

The LT1 didn't gain much over it's LS counterpart in regards to power and torque. The switch over to direct injection has far more to do with emissions (and a lesser extent fuel economy) than power.

Keep in mind, the current PP has 1 overdrive gear while the SS has 2. I believe the new MT82 is going to have 2 overdrives as the DI is going to bump up the torque a bit. The low end torque allows the SS to cruise at extremely low RPM…and thus sip fuel at 70mph.

Originally Posted by ChefBorOzzy

I think you meant to say the Camaro is 80 pounds lighter.. Also, the 10 speed auto doesn't cut as much time from performance figures as many people seem to think. It didn't do much for F150 and it probably won't do much for Mustang. Maybe a tick or two in the 1/4.

Indeed, will fix in edit.

I think you are underestimating what it’s going to do for the mustang. The F150 has less power and has programming optimized for towing. Keep in mind, the entire reason the scat pack is quicker than the mustang is because of its 8 speed transmission and torque converter advantage. They trap nearly identical MPH in the ¼ mile.

[ChefBorOzzy]

The Challenger with 5 speed is quicker than the new Mustang.. That thing was still trapping 114. So, no, I don't think the transmission is going to make as much of a difference as some think. I'd guess that the 6 speed auto in Mustang is also better than the 5 speed in LX cars.

[BlaqWhole]

It isn't gonna be neck and neck with the SS. 15 HP and 10 TQ is not gonna make it half a second faster. If that was all it took, then a tune would be all a 15-17 GT needs to keep up with the SS and we all know it needs way more than a tune. The SS is lighter and has 40 more TQ. Ford is still gonna be behind.

[Ryephile]

The GT500 will be interesting to see if it remains a burnout machine or approaches the ZL1 and GT350R in handling.

It'll continue to decimate at Cars & Coffee's however. Pedestrians beware!

[Mustang Fanboy]

Originally Posted by ChefBorOzzy

The Challenger with 5 speed is quicker than the new Mustang.. That thing was still trapping 114. So, no, I don't think the transmission is going to make as much of a difference as some think. I'd guess that the 6 speed auto in Mustang is also better than the 5 speed in LX cars.

Except….it’s not. They both have a 8.7lbs/HP ratio. They both trap ~112mph in the ¼ mile. These are what I’ve seen, and what I’ve read others running on average. Some trap 113-114…and some trap 110. They both run high 12’s stock. The big downer the current 6 speed mustang has is Fords crazy clutch protection strategy which makes getting decent 60’ times difficult without a tune. My guess is, their switch on the MY18 to a twin disc clutch setup will allow them to turn that garbage off.

There is far more to a ¼ mile than power and torque alone. How you are able to put that power down is extremely important.

[Mustang Fanboy]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

It isn't gonna be neck and neck with the SS. 15 HP and 10 TQ is not gonna make it half a second faster. If that was all it took, then a tune would be all a 15-17 GT needs to keep up with the SS and we all know it needs way more than a tune. The SS is lighter and has 40 more TQ. Ford is still gonna be behind.

Except, it's going to be closer to 20-25hp and 10-15lb-ft of torque. Combine that with the transmission/drive-train upgrades and it will easily be neck and neck. Have you not seen all of the drive-train upgrades the mustang is getting?

And yes, tune only 15-17 GTs run neck and neck with the SS.