[Stig eh]

very nice offer. stig eh

[Software Guy]

Holy Crap! I am so glad you made it because 1 tiny trip for a haircut on black ice cost me a hit to t telephone pole less than 3 miles from my house. It was clear at my house when I left....

[7LitreC5]

That does not sound like fun at all!

[Need4Camaro]

Originally Posted by kkriskal

Hello Friends,

I had to travel to Portland OR for personal reasons. My daughter and I checked the route, weather, road conditions etc. and finalized a window when it was clear, (apart from just some rain and stuff around 42 F) during the duration of our trip (now I know it was supposed to be clear and just a prediction). This trip was from Colorado Springs, CO To Portland, OR (close to 1400 miles).

Left Colorado springs, clear all the way past Denver on I-25, then turn in to I-80 entering Wyoming, drive for a mile or so, first flashing signs, " Blowing Snow, Blizzard, Black Ice, Slow Down and use caution"). I am like what???? My car is just one month old so never got around to changing tires, still running performance tires. And guess what, every bit of what that sign said, HAPPENED. Slipping, crawling, then slipping again, then crawling again and a whole lot of Prayers, This went on for hours, we were tensed like crazy and then my daughter who was with me, said, Daddy, I just checked the weather again, we cross Wyoming somehow, we will be fine. Since I was driving so slow with hazard lights on, it took us forever to cross Wyoming. Entered Utah, what a relief, or so I thought, we got flashing sign board with this welcome when we entered Utah "Black Ice, dangerous conditions, use caution". I was like, is there anyway we can go back or can this all be just a bad dream. Same story, same bad conditions, finally got out of Utah. Entered Idaho, AGAIN, similar snow, sleet, slush, Ice, you name it, it was there.

Crossed Idaho and finally entered Oregon. What a relief, the roads were clear, sky was overcast but no snow or rain. I was like finally this is over, thank god. So we are driving peacefully and finally relaxing and enjoying the drive with music. Then we reach the beautiful "Cascade Range", miles and miles of amazing winding, curvy, up and down mountain pass, it also has something called the "Deadman's Pass". So now the beautiful eager wait to get there was soon welcomed with nightmare called "Blizzard". Check out the pics, it turned out to be miles and miles of worst driving conditions even for the toughest AWD vehicles. I was so nervous throughout this range of slopes and inclines filled with snow, ice and sleet that I couldn't feel my throat or even get words out, that's how dry it got. God know how the car was even moving in this place and how we got out alive and not end up in a ditch or skid of the mountain. Again, you all can imagine how it would have been with the stock summer only tires I have.

Once we got out of the area, it was some icy patches until we crossed Cascade locks and then finally just rain for the last 80 miles of my 1421 mile drive. Never thought I would be so glad to drive in rain.

I have just few things to say. Thank you God for keeping us alive and I would Never try to do something so stupid again.

Have no idea how those tires were able to grip even this much (I keep saying this because I am still not able to get over it). Anyway, never again for sure. Just wanted to share this crazy experience. My daughter took the pics, I was too nervous to even take my hands off the steering.

I am now at Portland and we are exploring an alternate route probably via Sacramento and Grand Junction so we stay as south as possible.

God was with you. I've had a few mild snow / ice experiences with my 6th Gen V6 and its more doable than my 4th Gen LS1 (and I drove my 4th Gen through a condition similar to yours only a MUCH shorter distance // aprox 60 miles.) I was in Seattle and was planning a drive back to Atlanta in December and I did not even get past I-405 on I-90 east before the amber alert signs were saying "Chains REQUIRED through Snoqualmie Pass" ... Nope, turned around and went I-5 south all the way to Cali, met I-40 and took it across, much safer.

I've been through Wyoming, Utah, Idaho and Oregon. Idaho isn't really too bad, but Eastern Utah and some parts of Wyoming you gatta becareful. The elevation in some of those places is as high as 7,000 feet above sea level which is likely why you ran into snow when you got on I-80 and why it held out until you dropped elevation in Oregon. Thats a real fun drive in the summer but there's no way in hell I would do it in the winter.

For driving back, if you absolutely must do it soon, even with Blizzaks I would not go back the way you came. It will take alot longer but I would go South into California:

Take I-5 south into Fresno, meet I-80 and go west for about 2 - 3 miles then Catch CA-99 in Frenso (It's fully interstate grade, no intersections or traffic lights 70 MPH limit divided interstate like highway with exits) and take it to Bakersfield where you will meet CA-58 which is also MOSTLY like an interstate. Go west on CA-58 and It's going to dump you off at I-15 in Barstow CA just south of I-40. Take I-15 north and I-40 will exit on the right almost right after you merge onto I-15 and follow I-40 all the way to Albequerque New Mexico where you will meet I-25, head I-25 North and you will be in Denver.. It will take longer but you will miss MOST of the snow and ice and you will also not likely need to change your tires.

https://goo.gl/maps/Hazrp88TXJq

Also, regarding AWD...

Originally Posted by JT58

Snow and ice on summer tires is treacherous. I had a brand new 2010 WRX I bought with summer tires in New England and we had a few inches of snow and I thought wow I get to try out how capable the car is with AWD. Well it was plain horrible- i nearly lost it going down a steep hill on a back road to my house. The AWD did nothing with the summer tires. Winter snow and ice tires make a HUGE difference. If you live or have to drive in snow and ice weather like this, get snow tires or at the very least have all season tires one your car.

People put FAR too much confidence in AWD without really realizing what it is or what it does... AWD does NOT improve your odds in maintaining control of a car in snow or ice AT ALL... period, no if ands or buts about it. The ONLY thing AWD does it HELPS you to get rolling from a dead stop if you're stuck in some snow or ice, but after you're moving, it has absolutely no advantage in these conditions than any other vehicle and THIS is why you see so many AWD cars turned over in Ice, it's because people drive too confidently with them thinking they can't lose control driving far too fast for conditions and hit Ice and thats all she wrote.

The BEST defense against snow and ice, is common sense.. don't drive fast, be patient, feel the car out... if the sliding starts to become too much, pop the shifter in neutral and coast while gently and calmly steering the vehicle in the direction you want it to go.

[JamesNoBrakes]

Originally Posted by Need4Camaro

Also, regarding AWD...



People put FAR too much confidence in AWD without really realizing what it is or what it does... AWD does NOT improve your odds in maintaining control of a car in snow or ice AT ALL... period, no if ands or buts about it. The ONLY thing AWD does it HELPS you to get rolling from a dead stop if you're stuck in some snow or ice, but after you're moving, it has absolutely no advantage in these conditions than any other vehicle and THIS is why you see so many AWD cars turned over in Ice, it's because people drive too confidently with them thinking they can't lose control driving far too fast for conditions and hit Ice and thats all she wrote.

The BEST defense against snow and ice, is common sense.. don't drive fast, be patient, feel the car out... if the sliding starts to become too much, pop the shifter in neutral and coast while gently and calmly steering the vehicle in the direction you want it to go.

Sounds nice on paper, but being able to start the vehicle moving is often a huge issue for those of us that spend a significant amount of our time on some kind of frozen H20 surface, not as simple as it sounds and spinning wheels trying to get moving can send the vehicle in some pretty crazy directions. Also, with the slightest amount of hill and little weight over the axle, AWD is a game-changer. No, it's not an end-all and real winter tires make a huge difference too, but rear wheel drive without a lot of weight over the axle is absolutely horrible. It kicks out any time you try to add just a tiny bit of throttle, sending the a$$ of the car left or right. In any kind of city driving, this happens over and over during one drive. This doesn't happen with AWD anywhere near as much.

It never fails though when it comes to winter tire threads, there's always one guy that claims he drives just fine on frozen lakes with drag radials in his 69 camaro, but from my experience doing this many times, in many different drive configurations, AWD is significantly safer because it prevents you from throwing the rear end left or right and starting a slide when you are trying to accelerate/start.

And again, yes, I realize how important the tires are. I had summer performance tires on my WRX and it was horrible in the snow and on the ice with those, no question. I run studded winter tires on my winter vehicles here. I run winter tire (not studded) on the camaro, but I'm not driving it much in the winter.

But yes, the FSM was with him in all of his noodly power on this trip.

[Gunkk]

Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes

there's always one guy that claims he drives just fine on frozen lakes with drag radials in his 69 camaro

[R.C. Collins]

Originally Posted by Need4Camaro

Take I-5 south into Fresno, meet I-80 and go west for about 2 - 3 miles then Catch CA-99 in Frenso (It's fully interstate grade, no intersections or traffic lights 70 MPH limit divided interstate like highway with exits) and take it to Bakersfield where you will meet CA-58 which is also MOSTLY like an interstate. Go west on CA-58 and It's going to dump you off at I-15 in Barstow CA just south of I-40. Take I-15 north and I-40 will exit on the right almost right after you merge onto I-15 and follow I-40 all the way to Albequerque New Mexico where you will meet I-25, head I-25 North and you will be in Denver.

I have 3 million miles experience running these highways. Here's the mileage for that trip:

If you really wan't to take the southern route go I-5 south to Hwy 46 in California, 995 miles south of Seattle. Take Hwy 46 east apx. 30 miles to Hwy 99. Go south on Hwy 99 apx 20 miles to Bakersfield and onto Hwy 58 eastbound to Barstow (130 miles), where Hwy 58 terminates and becomes I-15. Go NB on I-15 for 3 miles to I-40 EB. Go 677 miles east through Arizona into New Mexico. Once in Albuquerque, take I-25 north all the way to Colorado Springs, about 380 miles. Total trip: 2,355 miles. You may still face winter driving conditions in Flagstaff, AZ, Gallup, NM, and Raton Pass, NM. Or buy the Blizzaks.

[DC5]

Originally Posted by Gunkk

I

[Need4Camaro]

Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes

Sounds nice on paper, but being able to start the vehicle moving is often a huge issue for those of us that spend a significant amount of our time on some kind of frozen H20 surface, not as simple as it sounds and spinning wheels trying to get moving can send the vehicle in some pretty crazy directions. Also, with the slightest amount of hill and little weight over the axle, AWD is a game-changer. No, it's not an end-all and real winter tires make a huge difference too, but rear wheel drive without a lot of weight over the axle is absolutely horrible. It kicks out any time you try to add just a tiny bit of throttle, sending the a$$ of the car left or right. In any kind of city driving, this happens over and over during one drive. This doesn't happen with AWD anywhere near as much.

It never fails though when it comes to winter tire threads, there's always one guy that claims he drives just fine on frozen lakes with drag radials in his 69 camaro, but from my experience doing this many times, in many different drive configurations, AWD is significantly safer because it prevents you from throwing the rear end left or right and starting a slide when you are trying to accelerate/start.

And again, yes, I realize how important the tires are. I had summer performance tires on my WRX and it was horrible in the snow and on the ice with those, no question. I run studded winter tires on my winter vehicles here. I run winter tire (not studded) on the camaro, but I'm not driving it much in the winter.

But yes, the FSM was with him in all of his noodly power on this trip.

Well I never said AWD was pointless or useless but merely that...people severely overestimate its capabilities rather than plainly using common sense on frozen roads and slowing down. It definitely has the advantage on getting out of snow from a dead stop or climbing a hill covered in ice, but in general its capabilities are still severely limited on Ice that one should not become overconfident in having AWD and blasting down a highway at 70+ MPH

Originally Posted by R.C. Collins

I have 3 million miles experience running these highways. Here's the mileage for that trip:

If you really wan't to take the southern route go I-5 south to Hwy 46 in California, 995 miles south of Seattle. Take Hwy 46 east apx. 30 miles to Hwy 99. Go south on Hwy 99 apx 20 miles to Bakersfield and onto Hwy 58 eastbound to Barstow (130 miles), where Hwy 58 terminates and becomes I-15. Go NB on I-15 for 3 miles to I-40 EB. Go 677 miles east through Arizona into New Mexico. Once in Albuquerque, take I-25 north all the way to Colorado Springs, about 380 miles. Total trip: 2,355 miles. You may still face winter driving conditions in Flagstaff, AZ, Gallup, NM, and Raton Pass, NM. Or buy the Blizzaks.

That would work too, I take CA-99 because there's alot more places to stop than you can on I-5. You'll also face the winter conditions in Northern California right as you enter it from Oregon on I-5.

Flagstaff, Gallup and Raton Pass, yes you'll get snow and ice but it wont be anywhere near as bad as I-84, I-80 or I-70

Also, the extra 1k miles will still be alot cheaper than buying Blizzaks AND shipping your current tires back to Denver. Thats really only two additional fillups in these cars.

[R.C. Collins]

Originally Posted by Need4Camaro

I take CA-99 because there's alot more places to stop than you can on I-5. You'll also face the winter conditions in Northern California right as you enter it from Oregon on I-5.

Flagstaff, Gallup and Raton Pass, yes you'll get snow and ice but it wont be anywhere near as bad

I remember CA-99 through there when it had traffic lights! Now it's much better. Yes, I forgot to mention the Siskiyous and Black Butte summit. I sat for two days this past weekend on I-40 in New Mexico due to a snow/ice storm followed by 40-60mph winds. I was pulling a travel trailer and those conditions were a no-go. New Mexico can be just as bad as South Dakota when the wind picks up during a snow storm.

[Need4Camaro]

Originally Posted by R.C. Collins

I remember CA-99 through there when it had traffic lights! Now it's much better. Yes, I forgot to mention the Siskiyous and Black Butte summit. I sat for two days this past weekend on I-40 in New Mexico due to a snow/ice storm followed by 40-60mph winds. I was pulling a travel trailer and those conditions were a no-go. New Mexico can be just as bad as South Dakota when the wind picks up during a snow storm.

Yeah, I caught the tail end of it when they were removing them back around 2013. I can't remember exactly where it was but I think it was somewhere between Fresno and Bakersfield there were like 3 / 5 traffic lights out in the middle of nowhere and they had construction crews out working to upgrade into overpasses and interchanges. I just like CA-99 because its kind of an interesting highway. I later learned that before I-5 that CA-99 retained its route number all the way to Canada (which is why in BC the route number I-5 terminates at is Route 99) and I like how it interfaces its interchanges with the railroad tracks. Supposedly California is trying to convert CA-99 to a new Interstate I-9

U.S. 101 between San Francisco and Los Angeles is another fun highway.

[SFCO]

Wow, Thank God for that you made it home safe. I got caught in snow and Ice with mine but I only had to go 20 miles but was scared to death because of no traction. It now just sits in the garage on those kind of days.

[nancygrl]

I lived in Colorado Springs and Portland....I know how bad it is out there in winter. I can't even fathom doing that drive in an SS on stock tires thru all that weather. OMG....glad made in 1 piece. You definitely had some guardian angels with you on the trip.

[Blazin383]

OMG! Yeah, not a great decision to set out on that trip this time of year...in any vehicle, let alone an SS with factory tires! Scary, and I’m sure it was onelong long long white knuckle drive! I’ve made that run in good weather and it’s a grueling drive! Miracle you were able to keep it on the road the whole way! Definitely find a southern route home! The grade between Pendleton OR and LaGrand (Deadmans Pass) can be terrible! Cudos for getting to your destination in one piece!