GT350 revealed to be a Z/28 competitor? thoughts?

[Burt]

It's a continuous cycle. The Boss came out, and Crushed the Camaro SS. The Z/28 came out, and crushed the Boss. The GT350R is coming out, and it looks like it'll be faster than the Z/28. The 6th Gen Camaro is right around the corner, so I can see a new Z/28 (or similarly named equivalent) coming out to beat the GT350R. I'm just glad there's enough competition for these cars to keep getting produced.

[SSeric]

All this talk about who's following who's lead and how "car A" is the other guy's answer to "car B"...it all really brings to light one simple truth:

Healthy competition keeps manufacturers on their toes, promotes innovation, and benefits everyone involved...especially the enthusiasts.

[Mgizzle]

Originally Posted by crysalis_01

Because I'm the curious type, what information are you using as a basis for the points above that you are attempt ing to make?

to make a car faster with more power u have to add mass to increase component durability. Wheel bearings, drive shafts and driveline, suspension linkages, body stiffening because of those pilots etc etc. The brakes alone are 20+ kg heavier so consider that in pounds. The extra g's will drive more fluids too, coolant, trans coolers, diff coolers etc etc.

Look at the zl1. Look at the z/28. Look at the z06. Look at the last gt500 shelby. More powerful cars drive mass in most muscle cases since motors are bigger and torque has to be handled.

Finally, the z/28 is so fast because engineers tuned vettes, Vs, 1LEs, ZL1s for years. What did ford tune? First time with MR, first time a serious rear IRS, first time really grippy tires.

Z/28 is about 3850 lbs. That is almost GT PP mustang mass. Best case 350r will be close to that mass and not have the torque. 315 pilots can handle more torque. Also, rear seat delete is silly, u took weight out of worst spot possible.

[LimaCharlie]

The GT350R should beat the Z/28 in all performance aspects. The Z/28 will give a good fight but the GT350R will produce better numbers overall.
I hate to say it but the Z/28 will soon become obsolete. The 6th gen Camaro will bring new technology to the muscle car wars. The 6th gen Z/28 (assuming GM makes a 6th gen Z/28) will be the real answer for the GT350R.
The modern muscle car wars are awesome!!!

[SpeedIsLife]

Originally Posted by Mgizzle

to make a car faster with more power u have to add mass to increase component durability. Wheel bearings, drive shafts and driveline, suspension linkages, body stiffening because of those pilots etc etc. The brakes alone are 20+ kg heavier so consider that in pounds. The extra g's will drive more fluids too, coolant, trans coolers, diff coolers etc etc.

Look at the zl1. Look at the z/28. Look at the z06. Look at the last gt500 shelby. More powerful cars drive mass in most muscle cases since motors are bigger and torque has to be handled.

Finally, the z/28 is so fast because engineers tuned vettes, Vs, 1LEs, ZL1s for years. What did ford tune? First time with MR, first time a serious rear IRS, first time really grippy tires.

Z/28 is about 3850 lbs. That is almost GT PP mustang mass. Best case 350r will be close to that mass and not have the torque. 315 pilots can handle more torque. Also, rear seat delete is silly, u took weight out of worst spot possible.

I have a question for you:

did you actually put an effort into being this wrong?

[Front Runner]

Originally Posted by LimaCharlie

The GT350R should beat the Z/28 in all performance aspects. The Z/28 will give a good fight but the GT350R will produce better numbers overall.
I hate to say it but the Z/28 will soon become obsolete. The 6th gen Camaro will bring new technology to the muscle car wars. The 6th gen Z/28 (assuming GM makes a 6th gen Z/28) will be the real answer for the GT350R.
The modern muscle car wars are awesome!!!

Obsolete in what way? Performance? Technology? How so? Please elaborate........

[Chrispy]

That is one fast looking Ford Fusion...

[crysalis_01]

Originally Posted by Front Runner

Obsolete in what way? Performance? Technology? How so? Please elaborate........

As time passes all things become obsolete. That's what innovation leads to. This process takes nothing away from the present, but also acknowledges that one day even the best of the best today, will one day lose that title. Think if the current Z/28 was the pinnacle of Camaro performance and never becomes obsolete. How sad would that world be where your 2030 Camaro still only performs or is equipped as well as a 2015?

Originally Posted by Chrispy

That is one fast looking Ford Fusion...

As cute as this "looks like a Fusion" thing was at first, and at times accurate with the lesser models, with something like the GT350(R) it seems as though those who use it are grasping at straws for reasons to dislike it.

[crc91]

The z/28 and 350R will do battle for a couple years then the sixth gen camaro z/28 will come out and edge the 350R then ford and Shelby will do something else then chevy, everyone tries to best one another. The real winners are us the enthusiasts!

[VADER SS L99]

Why would any Z28 fan be scared. The GT350R is NOT the 5th gen Z28's direct competition. The GT350R is coming years after the Z28. They won't even be in production at the same time. I would seriously hope a 6th gen Mustang street legal track car could beat the old out of production 5th gen Z28. Otherwise it will be as big of a fail as the 6th gen PP GT vs 5th gen 1LE embarrassment. When competition continually one ups each other everyone wins cause cars get better. If the GT350R can't beat the old out dated Z28 then the 6th gen Z28 may not be as good as it could have been.

This whole topic completely takes me back to 2002 when Ford built the 03 Cobra because it got sick and tired of being embarrased by the F-body in comparison test and bragging rights. Ford fan boys rejoiced sounding their trumpets and beat their chest but neglected to acknowledge the fact that it was a decade late and the F- body was out of production. Even if it was not out of production the SS and Cobra wouldn't be in the same comparable class. The Mach 1 would have been the SS's direct competitor. I guess what I'm trying to say is if the cars are not built in the same generation or production year who cares? Cars SHOULD continually get better.

[Chrispy]

Originally Posted by crysalis_01

As time passes all things become obsolete. That's what innovation leads to. This process takes nothing away from the present, but also acknowledges that one day even the best of the best today, will one day lose that title. Think if the current Z/28 was the pinnacle of Camaro performance and never becomes obsolete. How sad would that world be where your 2030 Camaro still only performs or is equipped as well as a 2015?



As cute as this "looks like a Fusion" thing was at first, and at times accurate with the lesser models, with something like the GT350(R) it seems as though those who use it are grasping at straws for reasons to dislike it.

I don't dislike the performance potential of the car at all and I like how they pursued weight reduction like GM did with the Z/28. I'm looking forward to seeing some real numbers like Nurburgring times and other circuit times.

That said I do think the exterior redesign is incoherent and an epic fail on Ford's part.

The front end looks terrible and the rear spoiler looks like something out of a Jegs catalog. (I do like the roofline and the rear design (minus the spoiler). The interior looks cool as well.

I personally am not "scared" of the GT350R. It's going to be a very limited production run of a very expensive car that will likely only be on par or marginally quicker than the Z/28 on a road circuit.

When the 6th gen Z/28 or ZL1 is revealed the performance edge will swing again...

[BaylorCamaro]

Originally Posted by SpeedIsLife

I have a question for you:

did you actually put an effort into being this wrong?

Seriously though, Ford has stated that the GT350R is going to weigh over 100 lbs less than a Mustang GT. The GT350R is going to weigh less, rev higher, and have more horse power. The only thing the Z/28 will have on the GT350R is CCB's (which might be an option from Ford), tires (not sure how much the Trofeo's will really help) and torque. It's possible that the Z/28 may have better chassis tuning, but that is speculation and honestly I don't think it will.

I don't see how the GT350R won't be at least as fast as the Z/28.

[SpeedIsLife]

For the GT350R to weigh in at more than a 3850lb Z/28 with...

A FPC 5.2, where FPC's typically are a bit lighter than CPC engines

Lighter transmission

Carbon fiber bits out front

Carbon Fiber wheels

Weight reduction (no radio, etc)

...what would Ford have had to have done? Put sacks of cement in the trunk and back seat?

I fully anticipate a 3,500-3,525 lb GT350R with a normal GT350 being in the 3,650 range

[SpeedIsLife]

The GT350R will be impressive, but that's about it.

I'm personally more interested in seeing how the "regular" GT350 does.