[Frank237]

YES....They can have them....but too deadly/inhumane for civilians I guess??

Great Italian food, Love the Jersey Shore and deep sea/surf fishing, I have a lot of friends here, I was born here....But what a screwed up place otherwise if You are a shooter or collector.

[Mr Twisty]

I've been reading interesting articles written by an Army medic and trauma surgeon regarding various weapons and the effects on the human body. It's making me re-think my use of .45acp and only 7 rds.

[ZED SLED]

We all just have to learn how to shoot like John Wick, lol.

[Dizzy82]

Good luck finding a range that allows gun-fu.

[Mr_Draco]

Originally Posted by Mr Twisty

I've been reading interesting articles written by an Army medic and trauma surgeon regarding various weapons and the effects on the human body. It's making me re-think my use of .45acp and only 7 rds.

How so?

[Mr Twisty]

Originally Posted by Mr_Draco

How so?

I think we all can agree, when shot by pistol, perps don't just fall over dead like in the movies. Personally, I think most folks will engage flight mode, but there's always a good chance they're in it to fight.

http://www.policemag.com/channel/wea...0-caliber.aspx
An interesting out-take from the article:

From a trauma surgeon's perspective, both the 9mm and the .40 caliber can wound, injure, incapacitate, or kill. However, shot placement is the best predictor of accomplishing the intended goals. I have treated patients with more than 20 "holes" in them that never caused enough tissue damage or bleeding to cause them to die. And I have treated patients with a single "hole" that did die. Remember, the discussion is the ability of a particular ammunition caliber with improved bullet characteristics to stop a threat, not living or dying but simply to temporarily or permanently incapacitate the threat.

The FBI report of an officer-involved shooting on Nov. 29, 2006, from a Pennsylvania police department makes for an interesting read on this topic. The assailant was shot in the chest and abdomen with 180-grain

.40 S&W modern hollow-point ammunition as well as .223 rounds from an M4. On autopsy it was discovered he had been shot 17 times with 11 rounds exiting his body. Despite these many wounds, he struggled with officers attempting to handcuff him before he died.

[Mr Twisty]

Like Forrest said,

[Mr_Draco]

Originally Posted by Mr Twisty

I think we all can agree, when shot by pistol, perps don't just fall over dead like in the movies. Personally, I think most folks will engage flight mode, but there's always a good chance they're in it to fight.

http://www.policemag.com/channel/wea...0-caliber.aspx
An interesting out-take from the article:

My whole family is law enforcement and this pretty much goes along with what I've been taught my whole life and tell others myself. Most people will flee when a gun enters the equation so you're better off carrying something that is comfortable. It is the people that is doped up, intent on hurting you, or have nothing to lose that are the ones you have to defend yourself against. Against these people, caliber doesn't matter, what matters is shot placement. Most people say aim for center mass but that's wrong, it's too low. You need to aim for a 3" circle centered around a point 2" below the shoulder line. One shot here will drop a person unless they are on drugs. This is why you carry something you can control and have experience shooting. I carry a 9mm for this reason and cause I'll take 15 chances to hit that circle over 7 any day.

[Mr Twisty]

Originally Posted by Mr_Draco

My whole family is law enforcement and this pretty much goes along with what I've been taught my whole life and tell others myself. Most people will flee when a gun enters the equation so you're better off carrying something that is comfortable. It is the people that is doped up, intent on hurting you, or have nothing to lose that are the ones you have to defend yourself against. Against these people, caliber doesn't matter, what matters is shot placement. Most people say aim for center mass but that's wrong, it's too low. You need to aim for a 3" circle centered around a point 2" below the shoulder line. One shot here will drop a person unless they are on drugs. This is why you carry something you can control and have experience shooting. I carry a 9mm for this reason and cause I'll take 15 chances to hit that circle over 7 any day.

I can give a paper target a third eye at 21 feet all day long, but it isn't moving or shooting back. The shot you're talking about is basically the same, but a slightly larger target, and near misses are still (likely) hits, which is a good thing.

I have a bad habit of leaving FMJ reloads in my pistols, when I have factory HP loads for each. I will likely never need to take a shot in self defense, and I will likely never win the lotto.... but you never know.

[2SScamaro2010]

I just picked up a shield 40 for a new carry gun which I had for a whole 20hrs before I had to send it in with a defective extractor. At cabelas I went thru 3 different guns before I found a shield that either didn't have a scratch or the slide release actually worked right. Has smith and wessons quality control gone down the drain lately. I own a first gen full size m and p which has been an awesome gun same with all my revolvers but it's been 2-3 years since I've bought handgun. Just wondering if anyone else has came across this.

[Mr_Draco]

Originally Posted by 2SScamaro2010

I just picked up a shield 40 for a new carry gun which I had for a whole 20hrs before I had to send it in with a defective extractor. At cabelas I went thru 3 different guns before I found a shield that either didn't have a scratch or the slide release actually worked right. Has smith and wessons quality control gone down the drain lately. I own a first gen full size m and p which has been an awesome gun same with all my revolvers but it's been 2-3 years since I've bought handgun. Just wondering if anyone else has came across this.

North Carolina issued M&P 45 to all the state troopers a couple years ago. The state had such a huge issue keeping them in working order that they recalled all the pistols and sent them back to S&W for a refund and canceled their contract.

The M&P2.0 is supposedly a good pistol but after hearing about what happened from a couple of my trooper buddies, I swore never to own a S&W.

[2SScamaro2010]

Yea I told the wife that maybe we'll look into a different brand of gun for our next one. I got pics of what my extractor looked like but I'm gonna wait until I find out what smith and Wesson does to take care of it before I post anything. If they take care of it I'll just let it go cause I know chit happens from time to time.

[Tenring]

Originally Posted by 2SScamaro2010

Yea I told the wife that maybe we'll look into a different brand of gun for our next one. I got pics of what my extractor looked like but I'm gonna wait until I find out what smith and Wesson does to take care of it before I post anything. If they take care of it I'll just let it go cause I know chit happens from time to time.

Springfield has a promo going on right now, buy a 9, .40 or .45 and get four free mags, cheep holster and mag pouch.

Thinking about the new EMP Carry Contour myself. Comes with thee mags and get for free, for a total of seven. Not a bad deal espically considering the EMP mags are proprietary.

.

[Norm Peterson]

Been watching that promotion as well, hoping that my NJ handgun purchase permit comes through in time. Range Officer (5" barrel) in 9mm here.

Also looking into either the Ruger Mark IV or S&W SW22 Victory.


Norm