[FenwickHockey65]

Originally Posted by rock1962

VW traded low emmisions for more HP. I would never do that You kidding me, wouldn't think twice.

It doesn't matter what you do (unless you live in a state with emissions testing). But manufacturers are required to comply with federal regulations. The car is supposed to be legal from the factory.

[FenwickHockey65]

By the way, the OP makes a point I feared was going to happen, people will lose faith in diesels all over again because of this. Clean diesels are clean, just not when they're from VW.

[rock1962]

Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65

By the way, the OP makes a point I feared was going to happen, people will lose faith in diesels all over again because of this. Clean diesels are clean, just not when they're from VW.

This does not make me lose confidence in VW one bit. I own a 2003 GTI VR6 ( gas engine ) my first and only VW to date. Great car and I wouldn't hesitate to by another VW.

[hockeylover86]

Originally Posted by trademaster

That depends on what impact on sales that hit in fuel economy was projected to have and how greedy the execs making the decisions were. Money and success make people do silly things.

I would guess there was more to meeting the EPA target than a little fuel economy hit.

It had to be something more major, like not passing durability testing for some part of the system.

There is no way they assume this kind of risk for a few MPG.

[Stingray]

Interesting..... http://www.theverge.com/2015/9/23/93...diesel-scandal

"The six most insane things Volkswagen's board just said about its CEO's resignation"
By Chris Ziegler

[FenwickHockey65]

Originally Posted by rock1962

This does not make me lose confidence in VW one bit. I own a 2003 GTI VR6 ( gas engine ) my first and only VW to date. Great car and I wouldn't hesitate to by another VW.

I wouldn't miss them if they pulled out of NA tomorrow. Judging by their poor sales performance in the US market lately it seems most people won't.

Besides, VAG makes a ton more money off Audi/Bentley and their other luxury brands than they do off VW in the US anyways.

[Angrybird 12]

Originally Posted by hockeylover86

I would guess there was more to meeting the EPA target than a little fuel economy hit.

It had to be something more major, like not passing durability testing for some part of the system.

There is no way they assume this kind of risk for a few MPG.

I think it's the not meeting emissions regulations more than fuel economy...
From what I read the emissions of real world testing were much higher than in the EPA certification tests and that triggered the investigation.
Also by the higher fuel economy ratings they qualified for government subsidies for buyers at $1,300 per car...

[DrkPhx]

Originally Posted by derklug1

One article I read said that they used the lack of steering input and non-drive wheel speed sensors to determine when the car was on a dyno.

Correct. Many years ago I read that the OEM's use this type of cheating ECM strategy to pass emissions, but for someone to get caught...oops. I bet the others that are still cheating are scrambling right now.

[Snoman]

Heh, an exit from North America are the least of their worries as the fall out from this is unprecedented. The tip of the iceberg is only just beginning to show itself, with over 11 Million affected vehicles worldwide and overall cost estimates now blowing past $100 Billion like a rocket. Fiat and others are looking to pick up the pieces, either through a hostile take over or even a bankruptcy fire sale. Stock is down almost 40% in 5 days and over 60% since April. This is of course if VWG does not liquidate some or all of the subsidiary holdings (Audi, Bentley, Bugatti, Lamborghini, Porsche and Ducati to name a few).

[FenwickHockey65]

Maybe Marchionne can **** off trying to get GM to merge and just buy the ruins of VAG.

[fielderLS3]

Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65

By the way, the OP makes a point I feared was going to happen, people will lose faith in diesels all over again because of this. Clean diesels are clean, just not when they're from VW.

I'd be interested to know just how "dirty" these VW TDIs really are. Everyone is reporting their emissions relative to standards, but in absolute terms, how is it compared to diesels (or even non-diesels for that matter) from just 10 or 20 years ago?

Ultimately, I think the VW TDI's bigger problem might be technology advancements in gas engines. I have a Mazda6 with the Sky-Active gas engine, and my father has a newer Sportwagen TDI. They get nearly identical MPG on the highway (typically 42-44 in the Mazda, typically 45-47 in the TDI). Factor in the different energy content of their respective fuels, and the Sky-Active gas is actually more efficient than the TDI. So why pay the premium for a diesel if it no longer delivers an efficiency advantage?

If VW really wanted to game an EPA test, they should have done it the way GM did, and make the defeat mechanism an easy do-it-yourself for the owner (see skip-shift). That way, it's the owner doing it, not the company.

[2010-1SS-IBM]

Regardless of right or wrong, I thought that was a real ballsy move by VW. Now it's time to pay the piper though.

Weird how the US was the country that actually looked into it, instead of somewhere in the EU. They have way more diesels there than here, and of course more VW's.

[KaBoom1701]

VGina gonna pay for this. lol

[Todd in Vancouver]

Originally Posted by derklug1

One article I read said that they used the lack of steering input and non-drive wheel speed sensors to determine when the car was on a dyno.

It is such a deliberate thought process to have to design a program on beating the emissions test. It's not something a lower engineer would come up with so my guess is this will spread out to many more managers in the coming weeks.,

Originally Posted by Angrybird 12

Funny when I read about this I thought of the Kobayashi Maru test.....

Ha, thats the first thing I wrote when I read the original story.

Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65

I wouldn't miss them if they pulled out of NA tomorrow. Judging by their poor sales performance in the US market lately it seems most people won't.

Besides, VAG makes a ton more money off Audi/Bentley and their other luxury brands than they do off VW in the US anyways.

Agree 100%. I've worked for VW twice in my career and this is just the tip of the iceberg for the crap they pull. They could not give two craps about their customers and even less of the North American market. I know because they said it to our faces when they came here to visit from the Fatherland.