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Old 02-16-2013, 04:21 PM   #309
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Thread title is:

"Why would anyone want a 4 cyl Camaro"

As much as I'm 'enjoying' reading the sidebar conversation that's taking place, I'm afraid that I must insist we put this thread back on its rails or face closure.
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Old 02-16-2013, 05:13 PM   #310
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Should the government play a role or any role for that matter in protecting us from ourselves? That's what most laws are intended to do.
So, you agree with them when they say you're too stupid to protect yourself from yourself...

Anyone that believes that is too stupid to vote.

Quote:
The ones that make it illegal for someone to break into your home and take your stuff we tend to like. The ones that influence what you can buy, not so much.
This is a bizarre argument.

First of all, breaking into a house to take things is theft. This is against the law. Restricting freedoms under the pretense of doing good things is called "regulation" it is often done in order to enrich donors or constituents, and is also theft, but since those who make and enforce the laws are the same people writing the regulations that are perpetrating this theft, there's nobody to hold them accountable.

The system is broken.

As for the topic title and subject, I can see reasons people would want a 4 cylinder Camaro, and I think the topic as such is silly and meant to provoke people who like those engines. I don't mind the offering of a 4 cyclinder camaro because it was done before in the 80's for basically the same reason and it was a disaster. I believe history will repeat itself and there's a good potential that it will self correct down the road. If it's not a disaster, then that's a good thing as long as we don't continue down this path to making the V8 Camaro the "elite only" version and the "masses" have to accept "change" and "live with" their harsh, expensive, noisy I-4.
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Old 02-16-2013, 05:36 PM   #311
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But the question is, without government intervention would we have what we have today.

Remember the first airbags? GM introduced them long before they were required. No one bought them. Expensive, yes. But no sales.
I actually believe we would have it better that we do now if the Gov't had stayed out of regulating what automakers must produce.

Yes, airbags used to be very expensive and so few bought cars with them. Microwaves and DVD players were at one time expensive and few people had them. As market forces were allowed to guide things, the prices came down. Now almost everyone has DVD players and microwaves. New features in cars would have done the same thing.

Do you think if the Gov't stayed out of forcing higher MPGs the automakers would have never tried to get better MPGs? Of course not. If GM could make a ~400HP V8 muscle car that got 35MPG, while Ford's 400HP muscle car only got 20MPG, common sense says GM would be selling alot more of their muscle cars and thus Ford would be investing R&D resources to close the gap. And GM would be trying to keep their advantage. Sounds like a cycle where enthusiasts and environmentalists both win to me.

Just like the cell phone makers keep making better and cheaper phones. They are tring to one-up the competition and market their products to the consumer. They aren't having to meet Gov't imposed regulations at the same time. I firmly believe the automakers could have made bigger strides if they could have simply designed and built cars while focusing solely on the consumer, without being forced to put R&D resources where the Gov't forced them to.

Back to a 4-cylinder Camaro. I don't hear large groups of people clamoring for one in the 6th Gen lineup. But I sure hear alot of people hoping that the 6th Gen Camaros get more power though....
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Old 02-16-2013, 07:46 PM   #312
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Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham View Post
Thread title is:

"Why would anyone want a 4 cyl Camaro"

As much as I'm 'enjoying' reading the sidebar conversation that's taking place, I'm afraid that I must insist we put this thread back on its rails or face closure.
...Shouldn't be too hard figuring out why it's being de-railed...Instead of closing threads, use the "you know what"...lol
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Old 02-16-2013, 09:23 PM   #313
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...Shouldn't be too hard figuring out why it's being de-railed...Instead of closing threads, use the "you know what"...lol
It's been collecting dust...


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Old 02-16-2013, 09:44 PM   #314
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Even though I've posted "against" an I-4, believe it or not I've tried to keep an open mind about it...I think part of it is that it's easier to picture the engine, than it is the car it will be in...An I-4 in the style of the Gen5 (regardless of weight) I think would have been a disaster....Not a "platform" expert at all, but I hope the I-4 doesn't dis-enfranchise or disappoint Camaro "enthusiasts" for the sake of "new" customers....just sayin'...
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Old 02-16-2013, 10:08 PM   #315
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It does sound good, but....

What you are describing is basically what the BRZ turbo will be once it comes out, which would make the Camaro a similarly powered car, but with a lot more mass and without the driving dynamics of the BRZ. So for those among us whose reason for buying the Camaro would be something other than it is named "Camaro," what would be the selling point?
The same selling point, whatever it may be , that the Hyundai Genesis Coupe has. Why pay for the 3.8 in even base form, at a starting price of 29k?

edit: curb weight will be interesting if/when the 6th gens come out in I4 form, I suppose... then you'd be more right than ever, fielder.
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Old 02-16-2013, 10:14 PM   #316
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Even though I've posted "against" an I-4, believe it or not I've tried to keep an open mind about it...I think part of it is that it's easier to picture the engine, than it is the car it will be in...An I-4 in the style of the Gen5 (regardless of weight) I think would have been a disaster....Not a "platform" expert at all, but I hope the I-4 doesn't dis-enfranchise or disappoint Camaro "enthusiasts" for the sake of "new" customers....just sayin'...
Good point...glad you brought it up. I firmly believe that it'll be up to the enthusiasts to "disappoint", or "disenchant" themselves on this one. There will always be a potent performance model available in Camaro, so it's not as though the offering of a good four cylinder will take that away from the brand. Imho, why get bent out of shape over a car we aren't likely to buy anyways?

That all said...I'd like to entertain a daily-driver Turbo 4 6th-gen to replace my Cobalt and park alongside the ZL1...
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Old 02-16-2013, 10:17 PM   #317
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I firmly believe that it'll be up to the enthusiasts to "disappoint", or "disenchant" themselves on this one. There will always be a potent performance model available in Camaro. So, imho, why get bent out of shape over a car we aren't likely to buy anyways?

That all said...I'd like to entertain a daily-driver Turbo 4 6th-gen to replace my Cobalt and park alongside the ZL1...
My kid wants to get a car right after he gets out of college...been going back and forth on Cruze or Sonic...Might wait and add a Gen6 to the equation...lol...(He's got his heart set on a "turbo" of some kind)...
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Old 02-16-2013, 10:18 PM   #318
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I can only base my opinion with my experience on the Kappa platform, and in that application the 2.0T works great.
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Old 02-17-2013, 12:14 AM   #319
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...Shouldn't be too hard figuring out why it's being de-railed...Instead of closing threads, use the "you know what"...lol
I like the kinder, gentler, Dragoneye.
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Old 02-17-2013, 12:18 AM   #320
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Imho, why get bent out of shape over a car we aren't likely to buy anyways?
If the R&D budget or packaging considerations for the I-4 compromise the V8 version in any way, it's worth speaking out against it before they go too far down that rabbit hole.
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Old 02-17-2013, 01:55 AM   #321
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If the R&D budget or packaging considerations for the I-4 compromise the V8 version in any way, it's worth speaking out against it before they go too far down that rabbit hole.
Speak out but with no voice really... That there is still room for any excess in this world is kind of amazing. I guess as long as the minimalist (read militant environmentalist) keep having kids the rest of us have a chance.

It is hard to know whether technology drives the auto regulations or if it is the other way around. If my car didn't have seat belts not sure that would be high up on my mod list.

I think the practical nature of a lighter more efficient Camaro flies in the face of its current non practical nature (yes even in the v6 variant).

Be honest do you know anyone or have you yourself shed weight off your current Camaro to gain economy or speed?

To do my own derailing... this is at the root of the wholesale downward spiral.

Good news is that today will be full of sun and about 60 degrees, I have a full tank of gas and plenty of rubber!!

No Camaros were harmed in the production of this post.
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Old 02-17-2013, 08:18 AM   #322
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If the R&D budget or packaging considerations for the I-4 compromise the V8 version in any way, it's worth speaking out against it before they go too far down that rabbit hole.

Based on the Kappa platform, packaging is not an issue because a small block Chevy slides right in there ...
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