My thoughts of the 2014 Camaro and the Z/28......

[SilverSurfer21]

Originally Posted by Angrybird 12

That pole was started just after the fuzzy poor screenshots taken from the TV show. Most of the votes in that pole were made BEFORE the official reveal.
Start a new pole today and I bet it would get different results.

I seriously doubt it. Start one and see. I know they like the new Z/28 because it is the "Z/28" they have been begging for. It isn't a daily driver and only a very small percent of the people will buy it. It is just the thought that it is available if they so desired to buy it. And it will kick Mustang's butt too.

I would just like to buy an SS with the Z/28 option (engine). How cool would that be? My original 1973 Camaro was an LT with the Z28 option. It had no badges. So to the average on looker all they could see was the wheels and spoiler. No stripes. It was a sleeper until I got on it. I loved it.

[Bonemaro]

Thanks for write up Scott. I'm sorry you of all people had to explain anything to anyone about why things are done the way they are. The refresh looks amazing as i've said iin other posts and am glad to see the Camaro lives to see another year!

Dave

[z28camaro2471]

Thanks again for the insight Scott. Here are some of my thoughts.

Refresh. Very nice. To me the "controversial" taillights have both '69 and 2nd and 3rd gen styling cues (quarter panel wrap around), both of which I like. The front end is a home run.

Z/28. Baddest Camaro. Ever.

6th gen. I hope for you, your family and friends that you are either happily retired or heavily sedated when it comes out. GM just did an awesome job on both of the above (refresh and Z/28) and people are complaining like GM made the Camaro front wheel drive and electric. I don't understand why people enjoy being keyboard "warriors". Obviously I have zero insight into what the 6th gen will look like, but if these enhancements to the 5th gen have sparked such an uproar, I can only image the gnashing of teeth that will occur when the Camaro is revealed on an entirely new platform.

I say job well done to you, the engineers and designers.

[Z28COP]

Originally Posted by PYROLYSIS

I will admit that when I first saw the refresh I wasn't a fan. I have been staring at pics of the fifth gen almost every day since its release and to me the styling wasn't stale. I was pretty upset when those less than stellar pics were shown from the Kelly and Michael show. I am very resistant to change but in a period of a few days the new style has not only grown on me but grabbed my attention enough to push me towards a 2014 Purchase over a 2013. (Seeing the new Z/28 had a lot to do with those new feelings. ) Thanks Scott and the Camaro team for working so hard and offering so many different choices for Camaro fans.

[Angrybird 12]

Originally Posted by SilverSurfer21

I seriously doubt it. Start one and see. I know they like the new Z/28 because it is the "Z/28" they have been begging for. It isn't a daily driver and only a very small percent of the people will buy it. It is just the thought that it is available if they so desired to buy it. And it will kick Mustang's butt too.

I would just like to buy an SS with the Z/28 option (engine). How cool would that be? My original 1973 Camaro was an LT with the Z28 option. It had no badges. So to the average on looker all they could see was the wheels and spoiler. No stripes. It was a sleeper until I got on it. I loved it.

Here you go I started a new pole.
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=286190

[Z28COP]

F-bod Father:

Thank you Thank you Thank You

[CrystalRedTintcoat]

I'm a manufacturing ops guy turned enterprise software guy so what the heck do I know about mass consumer product marketing let alone automobiles. Nonetheless this productline seems to have too many model. Maybe chevy is trying to attract multiple market segments.

>323 horsepower LS and LT

>400 horsepower SS

>426 horsepower SS

>426 horsepower SS/1LE

>580 horsepower ZL1

And the new Camaro Z/28…….

I doubt you can share the numbers but what is the unit distribution between all these models? If the 1LE is expected to be a 2% car would it be logical to assume the ZL1 is about the same expected volume or less? I guess dealers pre order zl1s but not 1le's so maybe the zl1 volume is higher. And if the Z/28 is going to be about the price of the ZL1, if not higher, how many units are expected in 2014?

Actually, it'd be really interesting if you could disclose your buyer personas for each segment/model; I realize th numbers are probably private but the persona seem like something that could be shared. ??? :-)

But maybe this model proloferation is strategic. Heck. I came back to Chevy from Audi because of the 1LE. And now you have me craving the notion of the real Z/28 though I don't have the dough nor a garage to keep it ...

[GroundhogSS]

Scott, thanks for the great write-up. I like the new models. It's good to hear the background story on the Camaros. Sign me up.

[brt3]

Originally Posted by fbodfather

...The 2014 is dedicated to the “Z/28” purist. This is a track car that makes no excuses. That this car is a full three seconds faster on a track than the mighty ZL1 speaks volumes to its intent. Make no mistake – this isn’t a slap at the mightly ZL1. Far from it. If you want a car that blows other cars off a road course on Saturday and Sunday – and yet will get you to the office in comfort on Monday morning – the ZL1 is the car for you. If you want blistering track performance at a reasonable cost – the 1LE is prescribed. And – if you want to shame exotics on a road course – with an automobile that’s not meant for daily driving, then the Z/28 makes no apologies and may grab you by the collar – shake you silly -- and shout “LET’S GO MAKE HISTORY!”...

This paragraph is what I felt when I got home from work and watched the reveal. This paragraph is why, the next morning, I was on the phone to my dealer placing a "provisional order" for the new Z/28. This paragraph is why a single version of a single car has shown me that there is a core group of die-hards at GM who truly do get it. Congratulations for doing the original proud -- and for not compromising on your vision!

[PS: Could you please tell us on which track the Z/28 was 3 seconds per lap faster than the ZL1? Since I'll be tracking the *$%#*@ out of mine, I'd really like to know. Sorry to interrupt the positive vibe... ;-) ]

[dragon22]

Scott, thank you for that and I sincerely thank you, and everyone involved, for these great cars. You may not remember me, but I was one of the guys waiting for my car to get out of Area51 and the privilege of me being able to communicate with you made the agonizing wait well worth it!

I fully understand why these great Camaros were built in this way and am backing you and all of GM in everything that is done. After all, it's being done for us...the Camaro enthusiast!

I know you all let all the miserable comments run off your shoulders like water off a ducks back, but you will always have a follower in me!

Thanks for being there when I was in Area51 and thanks for these awesome cars!

[Bad@ssCamaro]

Originally Posted by CrystalRedTintcoat

I'm a manufacturing ops guy turned enterprise software guy so what the heck do I know about mass consumer product marketing let alone automobiles. Nonetheless this productline seems to have too many model. Maybe chevy is trying to attract multiple market segments.



I doubt you can share the numbers but what is the unit distribution between all these models? If the 1LE is expected to be a 2% car would it be logical to assume the ZL1 is about the same expected volume or less? I guess dealers pre order zl1s but not 1le's so maybe the zl1 volume is higher. And if the Z/28 is going to be about the price of the ZL1, if not higher, how many units are expected in 2014?

Actually, it'd be really interesting if you could disclose your buyer personas for each segment/model; I realize th numbers are probably private but the persona seem like something that could be shared. ??? :-)

But maybe this model proloferation is strategic. Heck. I came back to Chevy from Audi because of the 1LE. And now you have me craving the notion of the real Z/28 though I don't have the dough nor a garage to keep it ...

Well seeing that they've produced over 6000 ZL1's, I would estimate less than 1000 for the SS with the 1LE option. So that should put the ZL1's close to the 10% range.

[Doc]

Thank you Scott and the entire team for making the Camaro in the first place. I can only imagine the blood, sweat and tears behind the scenes that goes into the finished product that we get to drive.

There are some things I would like to request though about this new revision. The front is okay; I think the upper grille is too small, the lower too big but I know you guys made these changes with wind tunnel testing. Is the upper front that narrow because of allowing too much air at high (150+) speeds? It looks like the lower grille is blocked off at the top so it could be reduced in height to match the fog light cutouts. The entire group of grilles/cutouts just looks slightly mis-matched to me, but maybe there was a wind tunnel reason for that.

The rear of the car is the area that needs the most revision. It's okay as far as it goes... if it was on the back of an ordinary sedan. But it's on the most exciting muscle car in the industry. It's just too plain and boring. I understand the rationale behind the style of the lenses and they're pretty nice looking but making them wrap around the sides was a mistake.

Here's what I think would look better. Instead of this:



maybe something like this instead:



The 69 Camaro (as well as all those glory year Camaros) had a distinctive, tied-together back between the tail lights. I would make the lenses not as wide, sink them back in further so they're more recessed, and put a slight recess into the area between the two sides so it creates that "tied-together" look the 67-70 Camaros had. This also somewhat mimics the narrow front grille area so it's consistent style-wise.

The vertical part of the bottom area looks like it came from an SUV. Too plain down there. It needs something to break up all that plain smooth plastic.

For the Z/28 add the 4 minor gauges in the vertical area above the center dash vents. Oil temp for engine, trans and diff would be very useful. It would be nice if there was a track accessory option that would include removable tow hooks, fire extinguisher and a mounting bar with 5-point harnesses.

You guys MUST make that gorgeous frost satin white color available for the Z/28!!! That same type finish should be used on all the colors on the Z/28 to make it really stand out. A frost satin bright Sunoco-orangish-yellow, a frost satin bright butterscotch orange, a rich frost satin Le Mans blue, a frost satin silver, a frost satin deep red, a frost satin slate black and the frost satin white would look absolutely killer on the Z/28 and make it stand out like no other on the road or track.

These are just my ideas and thanks again for all the hours and hard work you guys put into these wonderful machines!

[AzItaliaSS]

Originally Posted by Thrillz

Here is one of the polls on this site that's telling you how the people here feel about the new change's. Do you not find this alarming with this kind of negative feedback from the enthusiasts?
Attachment 491683

I am not big on tweeking actual information or relative facts, but when you refer to "most camaro enthusiasts" and we are seeing starting numbers in polls,posts,opinion sites,etc I tend to listen to the people as they also are camaro enthusiasts. and I agree with this qouted poster.

I also am not into kissing butt and there should be a whole server dedicated to that just for this thread by the previous posts. Obviously those who disagree with the changes and have some not favorable opinions did not all post in this thread, however our opinions are also as "Real" as other camaro fans. I had a 240sx in front of me the other day and I noticed some similarities and have looked up preludes as well and remember, those cars are not exactly styled for the future being they are 10+ years old, so no I am not a fan of the tails either, or tiny grates on the hood which look lost to me.

I will say thank you for your post that started this thread from coming from your prospective of you represent GM's camaro team, but this is your personal opinion stance which did seem personal and was more like a rant or scolding then an educational post(just my opinion) maybe because you work there but was surprising, others will have opinions, we are the ones that keep the company going by our loyalty and contributions but should not be scolded for having negative opinions, that i dont agree with. my .02 from an actual "enthusiast".

[Bad@ssCamaro]

Originally Posted by AzItaliaSS

I am not big on tweeking actual information or relative facts, but when you refer to "most camaro enthusiasts" and we are seeing starting numbers in polls,posts,opinion sites,etc I tend to listen to the people as they also are camaro enthusiasts. and I agree with this qouted poster.

I also am not into kissing butt and there should be a whole server dedicated to that just for this thread by the previous posts. Obviously those who disagree with the changes and have some not favorable opinions did not all post in this thread, however our opinions are also as "Real" as other camaro fans. I had a 240sx in front of me the other day and I noticed some similarities and have looked up preludes as well and remember, those cars are not exactly styled for the future being they are 10+ years old, so no I am not a fan of the tails either, or tiny grates on the hood which look lost to me.

I will say thank you for your post that started this thread from coming from your prospective of you represent GM's camaro team, but this is your personal opinion stance which did seem personal and was more like a rant or scolding then an educational post(just my opinion) maybe because you work there but was surprising, others will have opinions, we are the ones that keep the company going by our loyalty and contributions but should not be scolded for having negative opinions, that i dont agree with. my .02 from an actual "enthusiast".

If you felt like you were being scolded, then is there an element of guilt on your part? You and others can have your opinion and he can as well. I'm not speaking for him, and I don't kiss anybody's ass, but what he speaks about is from over 40 years of serving and supporting a long list of brands from GM, mostly Camaro's.

Why would he not have the best interest of "enthusiast's" at heart? This man work's tirelessly for "us". I can understand your point of view and some of the other's that have voiced their opinion about their fear of the Camaro brand being "watered down" again, but c'mon people have some patience and some faith. We've (the Camaro) been the best selling brand 3 years in a row. Does that not mean anything?

What if sales are better this coming year than the last year, how are you going to feel like then? I have a pretty good idea. And guess what, if sales take a dip, they are pretty smart enough to make changes necessary to get back to achieve whatever goals that they set. So, do you want to be on the negative nelly ride, or would you rather enjoy a great time to be an enthusiast? Your choice