ZL1 GG tax, but 13 GT500 no?

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by 72MachOne99GT

More power...

but better aerodynamics (I know I know, not that big of an effect at lower speeds), less weight (see: '10 GT500 vs 11/12GT500) and a newly revised rear end drive + changes in each gear

Just a thought

I don't think it's a loop hole really..

All taken into account on my end...I don't have the engineering data, nor the expertise to understand it all if I did...I just have my doubts, is all.

Keeping them to myself for the most part, what with a enormous lack of information to have a serious conversation...

[72MachOne99GT]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

All taken into account on my end...I don't have the engineering data, nor the expertise to understand it all if I did...I just have my doubts, is all.

Keeping them to myself for the most part, what with a enormous lack of information to have a serious conversation...

See Also: Every comparo between the ZL1 and the '13 GT500 lol

Like i've said before, debate is natural, heated debate is healthy for the soul....butt-hurt-ed-ness is not required, nor healthy.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by 72MachOne99GT

See Also: Every comparo between the ZL1 and the '13 GT500 lol

Like i've said before, debate is natural, heated debate is healthy for the soul....butt-hurt-ed-ness is not required, nor healthy.

Weeelllll...I wouldn't go that far.

There's enough data to make reasonable guesses on things in the way of performance. But to defend an estimation to what seems like the death...not wise.

[right to travel]

maybe its a gimmick they could be at the min gg tax 1k and adding it into msrp but not itemizing it. the company is paying the tax in all cases gm is being honest and showing that they are passing this cost to the buyer where ford will add to msrp and pay the tax out of profit and no one will ever know. i mean what is the real company cost of making a ZL1 or a gt500.

[hognutz]

it is hard to say but the revised gearing is helping. 3.31 is going to give you better fuel economy than 3.55.

Alot of the new power is coming from boost which you are not using in normal driving.

even the ZL-1 barely gets dinged. I am trying to understand the .63 6th gear. that can't give better milage than the old .5 that used to be standart in GM 6 speeds. the 3.73's are not helping milage either. ohh then again niether is the curb wieght.

In my mind 3-400LBS lost and some different gearing and teh ZL-1 might avoid the GG.

The real issue is when designing for performance you desing the car to preform not gas milage. It was one of my pet peaves in my 4.6 mustang. the 5th gear and rear gear were so screwed up stock it struggle to pull hills at low RPM. It took a 1mpg hit but with 3.73's it was way nicer to drive. BMW would never let a car leave the factory with jacked up gearing like that. thank god ford finally started using 6speeds.

I really feel to overcome the curb wieght ot he ZL1 they had to gear it in such a manner it hurt milage.

[GT Premi]

Originally Posted by right to travel

maybe its a gimmick they could be at the min gg tax 1k and adding it into msrp but not itemizing it. the company is paying the tax in all cases gm is being honest and showing that they are passing this cost to the buyer where ford will add to msrp and pay the tax out of profit and no one will ever know. ...

Good god, man. Really? Ford isn't using smoke and mirrors to "hide" a gas guzzler tax. Just look at the EPA ratings. The [current] GT500 is rated 15cty/23hwy. The ZL1 is, what, 14cty/18hwy? Notice anything? The GT500's mileage isn't "great," but the ZL1's is horrible. It's almost BMW M5 levels of bad. That's why it is attached with a GG tax.

[htron50]

Talk is cheap because supply exceeds demand.

[RScamaro30]

Originally Posted by htron50

Talk is cheap because supply exceeds demand.

[phenixdragon]

Originally Posted by Synerbee

If it doesn't say they can't that means they can.

Actually the way it works is if it doesn't say it does, than it doesn't. The US Constitution lays out what the Fed can do, not can't do.

Tenth Amendment to the United States Constitution
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

This is why the use the commerce clause for just about everything saying they are authorized because they are told they can regulate interstate commerce.

[MauriSSio]

Originally Posted by htron50

Talk is cheap because supply exceeds demand.

supply of what? pollutants?

[Nessal]

Originally Posted by Captain Awesome

Remind me again what part of the US Constitution authorizes this.

[f ê r]

C'mon guys, isn't hard to imagine that a smaller displacement engine, at any given throttle position, would consume less fuel than a larger displacement engine.

This isn't rocket science.

Cars: GT500 vs. ZL-1
Disp: 5.8L 6.2L
FDR: 3.31 3.73
MPG: 15/23 14/18
WHT: 3,800lbs 4,100lbs

[radz28]

Originally Posted by f ê r

C'mon guys, isn't hard to imagine that a smaller displacement engine, at any given throttle position, would consume less fuel than a larger displacement engine.

This isn't rocket science.

Cars: GT500 vs. ZL-1
Disp: 5.8L 6.2L
FDR: 3.31 3.73
MPG: 15/23 14/18
WHT: 3,800lbs 4,100lbs

Doesn't more power require more fuel? Displacement isn't that great. Additionally, I'm sure the larger TVS requires more power to turn, especially given it's at a higher pressure than LSA.

Thanks for the condescending remark...

[f ê r]

Originally Posted by radz28

Doesn't more power require more fuel? Displacement isn't that great. Additionally, I'm sure the larger TVS requires more power to turn, especially given it's at a higher pressure than LSA.

Thanks for the condescending remark...

Does these tests to determine the GG taxes are ran at WOT?? Or cruising?

At cruising, you do not need all that power to turn the engine, even more if Ford's 5.8L is more efficient than GM's LSA.